Rolex GMT II or JLC Master Chrono or IWC Da Vinci
Discussion
I've been looking for a new watch, I used to have a Speedmaster and Rolex GMTII and like the sports and or chronograph look the budget is 5-7k.
As I've searched I've thought about what I want in terms of look and feel and then crossed the thorny issue of what you're actually getting for your money. It appears many watches have pretty standard ETA movements in them which are inexpensive though apparently robust but mass produced, something that isn't exactly reflected in the price charged for the finished watch.
I started looking at who actually made their own movements and who was an independent watch maker, as many brands are owned by Swatch or Richemont. (not saying that's a bad thing either and most are owned by a corporate group) So at my price point is there an in house movement available in a case that I like?
They say a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing and it probably is, but my search lead me to the following short list. The IWC is an outlier as it doesn't have an in house movement but I think it looks stunning, they are also not independent but neither are JLC so I've already decided that doesn't matter, who cares who owns who.
Rolex GMTII:
A safe reliable and obvious choice, good looking, strong, well made in house movement and I enjoyed the one I had, it took quite a battering and remained reliable, only issue is I can't get past what they cost these days but the price is the price I guess.
I'd get an additional RubberB or Everest strap as well so I could have two watches in one (kind of)
JLC Master Chronograph:
I'm drawn to this watch due to the apparent high quality finish and in house movement from a manufacture watch maker, that also supplied many of the grand names with movements that they then embellished. To me it reeks of quality and is a proper watch (at its price point) and sits to the left hand side of the Rolex in that it could be worn formally and informally. The Rolex can be too I guess, being quite a discrete sports watch these days compared to the 44-46mm monster divers watches from (Omega/IWC etc..)but the master looks a bit more dressy whilst still being a sports chronograph in design.
IWC Da Vinci ceramic chronograph:
This I guess is a big leap from the others in that you could term it as a "fashion watch" rather than a long running classic, over-sized, ceramic and titanium sports chrono with an enhanced ETA movement. But I think it looks wonderful especially with the see through case back, not an in house movement or independent but we've decided along the way ownership doesn't matter anyway, choice No 3:
Of the 3, all except the IWC can be bought used or new (not that it makes much difference on the Rolex price wise) The JLC appears to cheaper used but I don't know if they discount them from new? The IWC is only used as they have stopped making that ceramic model. I've only found one in the UK offered to me for 7.5k which does seem expensive, I've already had a bid of 6.5k rejected so I'll need to pony up to get that one.
Of course the answer is "buy the one you want/like the most" but I like and want all 3 and that's not going to happen.
Having read my attempted missive, am I on the right track? Should I be bothered about the horology behind the dial? Is the JLC the "proper watch" of the three? Or is that thought the result of too little knowledge? I know the Rolex ticks all the boxes but it feels like a cop out (as smart as it is) and the IWC is just starting to slide into the showy/bling portion of my brain and is going to be around 1.5k-2k more than the others (used Vs. used price).
All advice/putting me straight/recommendations etc...gratefully received.
As I've searched I've thought about what I want in terms of look and feel and then crossed the thorny issue of what you're actually getting for your money. It appears many watches have pretty standard ETA movements in them which are inexpensive though apparently robust but mass produced, something that isn't exactly reflected in the price charged for the finished watch.
I started looking at who actually made their own movements and who was an independent watch maker, as many brands are owned by Swatch or Richemont. (not saying that's a bad thing either and most are owned by a corporate group) So at my price point is there an in house movement available in a case that I like?
They say a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing and it probably is, but my search lead me to the following short list. The IWC is an outlier as it doesn't have an in house movement but I think it looks stunning, they are also not independent but neither are JLC so I've already decided that doesn't matter, who cares who owns who.
Rolex GMTII:
A safe reliable and obvious choice, good looking, strong, well made in house movement and I enjoyed the one I had, it took quite a battering and remained reliable, only issue is I can't get past what they cost these days but the price is the price I guess.
I'd get an additional RubberB or Everest strap as well so I could have two watches in one (kind of)
JLC Master Chronograph:
I'm drawn to this watch due to the apparent high quality finish and in house movement from a manufacture watch maker, that also supplied many of the grand names with movements that they then embellished. To me it reeks of quality and is a proper watch (at its price point) and sits to the left hand side of the Rolex in that it could be worn formally and informally. The Rolex can be too I guess, being quite a discrete sports watch these days compared to the 44-46mm monster divers watches from (Omega/IWC etc..)but the master looks a bit more dressy whilst still being a sports chronograph in design.
IWC Da Vinci ceramic chronograph:
This I guess is a big leap from the others in that you could term it as a "fashion watch" rather than a long running classic, over-sized, ceramic and titanium sports chrono with an enhanced ETA movement. But I think it looks wonderful especially with the see through case back, not an in house movement or independent but we've decided along the way ownership doesn't matter anyway, choice No 3:
Of the 3, all except the IWC can be bought used or new (not that it makes much difference on the Rolex price wise) The JLC appears to cheaper used but I don't know if they discount them from new? The IWC is only used as they have stopped making that ceramic model. I've only found one in the UK offered to me for 7.5k which does seem expensive, I've already had a bid of 6.5k rejected so I'll need to pony up to get that one.
Of course the answer is "buy the one you want/like the most" but I like and want all 3 and that's not going to happen.
Having read my attempted missive, am I on the right track? Should I be bothered about the horology behind the dial? Is the JLC the "proper watch" of the three? Or is that thought the result of too little knowledge? I know the Rolex ticks all the boxes but it feels like a cop out (as smart as it is) and the IWC is just starting to slide into the showy/bling portion of my brain and is going to be around 1.5k-2k more than the others (used Vs. used price).
All advice/putting me straight/recommendations etc...gratefully received.
Edited by Wills2 on Tuesday 6th September 17:21
chris56 said:
Wills2 - of the watches you list the Rolex GMT II is the one to go for. Much more practical, much more robust than the other two and will hold its value much better. Your idea of the rubber B strap will also add variety for very little additional cost.
Yeah I had an early start and long drive today and came to that conclusion whilst mulling it over, cheers. PJ S said:
Hmmm…I say you should stop mucking about and buy something decent – https://www.chrono24.co.uk/vacheronconstantin/vach...
Or https://www.chrono24.co.uk/ulyssenardin/blue-surf-...
Or https://www.chrono24.co.uk/girardperregaux/sea-haw...
I was looking at a second hand VC Royal Eagle which I liked, thanks for the suggestions. Or https://www.chrono24.co.uk/ulyssenardin/blue-surf-...
Or https://www.chrono24.co.uk/girardperregaux/sea-haw...
13m said:
Incidentally, there is a brand new GMT II for sale in PH classifieds.
Yes had a look thanks, but it's a 6 year old brand new GMT for just under list, without a warranty so I'd rather wait for a new one. Watchfinder has 3 month old one unworn with original seals/tabs and just under 4 years 9 months warranty remaining for £5995.
Looks like the waiting list is growing and or rumours of the price increase is pushing pricing up, I don't want to wait for years or pay over list TBH or pay near list for an un-warrantied example.
But the market is what the market is, I find buying cars much easier!
13m said:
Wills2 said:
Yes had a look thanks, but it's a 6 year old brand new GMT for just under list, without a warranty so I'd rather wait for a new one.
Watchfinder has 3 month old one unworn with original seals/tabs and just under 4 years 9 months warranty remaining for £5995.
Looks like the waiting list is growing and or rumours of the price increase is pushing pricing up, I don't want to wait for years or pay over list TBH or pay near list for an un-warrantied example.
But the market is what the market is, I find buying cars much easier!
I agree. Watchfinder has 3 month old one unworn with original seals/tabs and just under 4 years 9 months warranty remaining for £5995.
Looks like the waiting list is growing and or rumours of the price increase is pushing pricing up, I don't want to wait for years or pay over list TBH or pay near list for an un-warrantied example.
But the market is what the market is, I find buying cars much easier!
Personally I'd prefer one from an AD or known source, even if it means paying a bit more. But if the one in the classifieds has proof of purchase and if he is prepared to drop a chunk off the price I'd probably take a look.
Just to square off the thread, I went a bought a completely different watch and make.
A Cartier Santos 100, I went to see a JLC compressor GMT and Rolex GMT but I was disappointed in the flesh with the JLC and couldn't get my wallet round the Rolex prices, the Cartier caught my eye and I love it.
A Cartier Santos 100, I went to see a JLC compressor GMT and Rolex GMT but I was disappointed in the flesh with the JLC and couldn't get my wallet round the Rolex prices, the Cartier caught my eye and I love it.
Edited by Wills2 on Sunday 25th September 22:44
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