Sub Mod

[996Type]

I have an older non date sub.

I’m thinking of a few modifications, some reversible, as my eyes aren’t as good as they were and I also like the look of the milsub.

[1] Switch to aftermarket broadsword type hands as seen on the milsub (reproductions).

[2] Relume the above new hands and hour markers on the existing face to match (or buy a second hand face and relume this).

Any suggestions which after market hands would fit a 1991 sub / suppliers?

I’ve found a relume firm in Northumbria that could then do the work for me.

This is the kind of thing I’m aiming for, I’m not too bothered about making it a full homage though….….

[996Type]

Thank you for the response, it’s a 14060 I believe being a 1991 (I’ve assumed this, it came with no box and papers but from a local specialist dealer). It has the white gold hour marker surrounds versus just the lume.

There’s a specialist in Northumberland that can do the relume, he is also up for the hand swap.

It’s a good point about the Omega hands, I’ve a couple of Seiko modified watches with Broadsword type hands and I’ll also look into this, your link is exactly the kind of thing I’m looking for. I’m hoping the spindles are universal as I want the mod to last and there to be no detrimental effect to the “real” bits.

Also a couple of older dials on eBay from a Canadian seller but they are very low cost relatively so not sure if real, so I may just relume my current dial tbh?

https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?u...


I’ve noticed there is a tiny bit of residual lume left active but it’s not readable anymore.

While I’d love a MilSub, I don’t have anything like that kind of money! Let me rephrase that - if I sold everything I owned and worked until I drop - I still wouldn’t be able to afford a milsub!

I’ve had a few subs over the years, sold them on, I’m happy with an older used one from here on. A few changes and it will do me, keep coming back to the non date sub to be honest….

[996Type]

Thank you for the responses.

Would anyone know if the Rolex hand set specification for the 3000 calibre movement in the 14060 is 120 / 80 / 20?

I’ve found several sets of aftermarket hands but information is vague as to if they will fit.

If the 3000 = 5513 specification wise I could be OK, but it’s not clear if that’s the case either…..

It hinges on the size of the hole for the spindle mount and the length of the hands…..

[996Type]

Thank you, I will check with them.

I have a few requests out to see what will fit the 3000 calibre and if it’s similar to the 5513 that used a similar calibre.

[996Type]

Will do Dom,

It’s this chap I’m in touch with regards the lume replacement and possible hand switch, the calibre in this watch might / might not be the same as the one in the 5513 so going to check locally what’s feasible.

Lume on mine is all but dead which prompted the search, then the rabbit hole of if the watch is coming apart anyway, might as well do the sword hands so I can see it better….

That lovely old used 5513 in the other thread I think is probably a perfect watch after a mil sub….

https://www.alchemistrelumer.co.uk/about

[996Type]

Hi Dom,

Sadly not, none of the vendors can confirm if their aftermarket hands fit well on the post 5513 mechanism, and it’s a bit of a risk to pull it apart on a guess.

Was just thinking about this today as it happens, I’m going to drop Dom Hackett a note and see what he might suggest.

My eyes are getting so bad the mod would help me see then watch better anyway, it’s the lume replacement I’m also very keen to sort.

I saw the below on the internet, wondering if the lume can be built up to cover the white gold markers on the current face and if a change of second hand colour might be too much…

[996Type]

Thanks Dom,

That’s interesting, didn’t think of removing the markers and hadn’t heard of puffy lume before!

Looking at mine, building over the gold markers would produce a similar effect to that pic above.

Prompted by your message I’ve pinged Dom (H) for a chat in the new year to see what I can do, he lives in the heart of watch land and if it can be done, he’ll know someone. Maybe even Omega broadsword hands etc, all reversible but can’t see me selling this one tbh.

I did post an image of a watch with a red second hand as you mention but struggled to upload it, trying again below…

I’m also hoping to keep the costs down on the job as it’s pointless otherwise to mess with an otherwise good watch….

[996Type]

dom9 said:

Any update, OP?

Found this on the Rolex Forum:

https://www.rolexforums.com/attachment.php?attachm...

In this thread: https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=15939...

Sorry Dom I see the thread but not the attachment, would you mind a screenshot or the thread page reference? If they are U.K. I’ll get in touch with them….

[996Type]

That’s great Dom, thank you, I’ll do that.

I’d be happy with that watch above, I’d probably go a bit more yellow on the lume, otherwise I’d be happy with that!

[996Type]

Latest on this is that my watch is now apart and we are looking at various options.

The spindles on the 3000 work out 145/95/23 for H/M/S respectively.

Minute and second spindle fit are fine.

Hour aperture though is too big and as they have a collar as part of the standard hour hand mechanism, compressing it slightly to bridge the minuscule gap is a non-starter (see image below)…

We have a few hand sets of the after market type and are experimenting with ways to bridge the larger hole to fit the smaller spindle.

I’m now exploring if the aperture can be filled in completely with metal then drilled back out to 145, we are going to try first with epoxy to see if the concept works.

Does anyone know of any jewellers that could do the metal work? I don’t expect it’s too complex for someone making rings for example.

Also found this lovely watch based on a more modern sub base while researching the hands.

https://wildmanbespoke.com/collection/wildman-mili...

[996Type]

Thank you Dom,

I’d have a set of broadsword hands made if it came to it, sure there must be a way to get a version that’s a smaller mount….

[996Type]

Thanks for the responses, the M/S hands can both be adjusted at the mount point a little to make good but the hour hand has a collar that means it needs to be very close to the original spec to allow reworking (ideally smaller to drill out as opposed to larger to add material to bridge it, which will be my next plan).

Not my pics (credit James) but the minute and second hands can be made to fit OK, it’s just the hour hand we need to work out a solution for as it’s design is more complex in 3D.

Any spindle that looks close to working size wise then makes the hand shorter in length so it grates against the other hands.

Below images on the gauge might help illustrate it better…

[996Type]

[996Type]

Quick update, before and after shots…..

Really happy with the results, my photos don’t do it justice and I can also see to tell the time again!

[996Type]

Thanks Dom,

We ended up with around 6X hand sets to create a bitsa, the Vostok tip given above led us to the hour hand we needed (thanks for the suggestion!!)

Had the “T” printed on the dial, only because it was with a firm that had the mask and originally I was going to have it done in lume but the paint was too thick to attempt it, so just went with standard white while there.

Final lume is a vintage off white (very bright from what I can see).

Watch is really transformed now, images don’t do it justice.

All reversible and I have the original handset stored away….

[996Type]

Lume shot (need to practise), ably supported by the “which torch” thread…..

Certainly seems bright enough!

This did get a good pulse of super bright white light….

[996Type]

Thanks!

Asked for a new pip - guess what - none standard size like everything else on the watch so no go!

The minute hand is after market, part of one of the broad sword kits we bought.

I daren’t post in the Rolex thread but thanks for the suggestion!!