Where to start circuit racing?

[tomperkins]

Hi all,

I'm looking to get into circuit racing, maybe 2015 or 2016. I don't have a huge budget but wondered if anyone's got any advice on where to start?

I've got an A4 that could be used as a tow vehicle and also a Caterham 7, but I'd like to keep the 7 in road spec and it's fairly tidy so wouldn't really want to risk any damage. So I'm planning on buying a dedicated racer.

I quite like the look of the 750 Motor Club, but any advice on a good place to start, which formula to choose and how to get a vehicle would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks in advance,

Tom

[tomperkins]

andye30m3 said:

This is worth a look http://www.pbmwc.co.uk

I'm in my third year and love it, very competitive with friendly paddock and pretty good driving standards as a whole. Car as cheap to run and entry fees are good value for circuit racing.

Interesting, thanks Andy. How much are the entry fees for that?

[tomperkins]

Carnage said:

How much is your budget, and how comfortable are you with prepping your own car? Do you want to race Caterhams, or single seaters, or saloons?

750 MC are a good bunch and reasonably priced. I started with them before racing with HSCC.

Hi Carnage,

I'm glad to hear 750MC are a good bunch.

I think trailering the car is the way to go so it doesn't matter about it being road legal. I would like to be able to do simple maintenance myself to keep the cost down (and I quite enjoy it).

I think my checklist would be as follows:

- lightweight
- simple construction
- rear wheel drive
- cheap parts

I'm thinking maybe Locust or MX-5, what do you think?

[tomperkins]

Carnage said:

There lots of people on here who race MX-5's who can probably tell you more than I can about them! From the outside, it looks like very close racing with the attendant panel damage, to put it neutrally. But bits are cheap and there's lots about.

The problem with Locosts is you can only really race them with 750 MC.

It's worth thinking about something like a Caterham, a Ginetta G20, or an MX-5 that you can race with a number of series. I live just down the road from Silverstone so it's nice being able to do a number of races there with different series.

Best thing to do is go to a couple of meetings, check out driving standards, chat to a few of the drivers about costs, and don't make any rash decisions. Good luck!

Good advice, thanks Carnage. (particularly about only being able to race Locusts with 750)

[tomperkins]

andrewcliffe said:

If you fancy single seaters of almost any description, the Monoposto Racing Club is a good place to race - good grid numbers, competitive entry fees. Classes to suit almost any car up to 2 litres - from bike engined Jedis, standard or modified Formula Fords, up to F3 chassis.

Running costs are not as high as many people assume, and a car that may have cost £ 6000 to buy will lap Rockingham in a similar lap time to a Porsche Carrera Cup car.

Thanks Andrew, worth a look for sure.

Any ideas where you would start looking for a used single seater, or a used Locust or MX5 race car for that matter?

[tomperkins]

TonykartEVR said:

I've just started racing with the CSCC in a Clio cup racer and can highly recommend them for giving good advice for beginners. If you fancy racing a caterham they have a series called 'magnificent sevens' which maybe worth a look...

Thanks Tony, so has 2014 been your first season? If you don't mind saying here (or email if you do), what sort of costs have you incurred (i.e. Car, Fees etc.)?

[tomperkins]

TonykartEVR said:

I had my first race last month at Donington and thoroughly enjoyed it!
I purchased one of last years clio racers that supported the BTCC races and I'm chuffed to bits with it, it really is a hoot!

Approx. costs I've incurred so far:-
Car £20k
List 1a & 1b tyres £1500 (not allowed to run slicks)
Race suit, lid, hans device etc £2000
Gazebo £600
Trailer £2000
Race entry £295

I've only scratched the surface there, it does get very expensive very quickly but the way I look at it is that now I have everything I need to go racing, the costs from now on should only be entry fees, fuel and accommodation.

...and the feeling you get when you finish, words can't describe how good it is!

And is the first time you've done any racing?

[tomperkins]

TonykartEVR said:

I've done many years of trackdays, racing is the next logical step for me...

Good man, hope you have a good full season next year!

Any more races this year?

[tomperkins]

andrewcliffe said:

Race Cars Direct and Motorsport Ads are classified services which is worth a peruse. Otherwise individual series have their own for sale sections or traders.

As its getting towards the end of the season, there may be a number of cars on the market soon as people decide what they want to do in the future - upgrade / retire / take up ocean yacht racing / take up darts.

That's really helpful, thanks Andrew

[tomperkins]

Stevemcmaster said:

Hi There,

I'm just coming to the end of my first year of racing. I have been with the Caterham Graduate Championship and can thoroughly recommend it.

Great circuits, relatively cheap cost of entry for the performance offered (My car was just over 8 grand for a Crossflow Caterham built in 1997), very welcoming championship that has a real family atmosphere and usually, one overseas round per year.

Tires last for a year in the Classics class, and the engines and gearboxes are pretty bulletproof.

If you are interested, give me a shout and I can give you some more lowdown and pointers.

Cheers
Steve

Hi Steve, any pointers and advice would be appreciated, email link should be in profile.

[tomperkins]

BritishRacinGrin said:

For me the deciding factor for going down the Caterham route was that the car specification is very tightly controlled. The regulations are the defining factor in the difference between being able to afford to 'compete', and being able to afford to 'win'- as these two aspirations are often seperated by a gulf of tens of thousands of pounds per season in more open class racing and even in one make series where the regulations aren't so tightly controlled.
In classic grads people have bought a car for 8,000 and won a championship on an annual budget of even less. Then, due to the residual value of Caterhams and the demand provided by a healthy club, you can sell the car at the end for the same as what you paid.

That certainly makes sense!

[tomperkins]

Bertrum said:

If you are considering MX-5's I would/I did go with the MK3 over the MK1. THe MK1 racing is very expensive due to people having trick engines etc.

THe MK3's are having a bit of a resurgence with the BRSCC averaging around 18 cars per round, seeing as high as 26 with high to mid 20's expected. Cars are about 10k to buy and run standard engines, gearboxes, diffs and brakes. Everything else being specified in the regs. Parts are cheap to come buy with complete spare cars now available for around £2500.

Engines are a bit of a week point, but the 2009 on engines are stronger. All the cars are evenly matched with 1 second seperating the top 10 at most tracks.

We have seen some excellent policing of regs this year, with 1 competitor being excluded for running a short shift kit.

There are currently 5 cars for sale at the mo, 3 on ebay.

Rob

That's interesting, thanks Rob.

It's a good point you make about choosing a championship with tight regulations to allow a fair level of competition. I have to say the MK1 MX5 racing does appeal just down to the cost of cars appearing to be around £4k rather than £10k.

When you talk about the MK!'s not having very tight regs, do you include the 750MC championship in that or are you talking about BRSCC?

[tomperkins]

Having seen the 2 part race format in the CSCC Magnificent 7's I'm talking to a friend about sharing a car, which would be a great starter and cost saver.

The regs don't seem to be so tight in that series so it may be only class wins possible without spending big money.

Does anyone know of any other series that have 2 part races that can be shared?

[tomperkins]

Carnage said:

Sharing a car is good - I've been lucky enough to race other people's car's that I could never afford to buy. But you need to be careful re being crystal clear about who is paying for what. It's one thing biffing it; it's another if your mate buzzes an engine and it needs to be stripped to see if there's top end damage. I've never raced a car belonging to someone else without having enough cash in the bank to pay for a new engine or chassis.

Some of the high end Caterhams in Mag 7's are proper weapons. The CSCC are also nice people and offer reasonable VFM, if not as good as it used to be. Andy97 on here is the man on the inside re the CSCC stuff.

There are now quite a few copies of their mini-endurance races, 750 MC's Roadsports springs to mind and the MSVR Series. Cheeky plug - I have a race TVR Griffith for sale for not much money which would be competitve in those series!

If it was me, I'd work out how much I have to spend on the car, how much per season to run it, and what you want from your racing. When I bought my current car, I wanted a historic single sweater, less than £20K, fairly cheap to run, that I could race abroad. This led me naturally to where I am now - historic Formula Ford.

Cool, thanks for the advice.

[tomperkins]

Bertrum said:

With regards to regs, the MK3 BRSCC supercup has tight regulations. One driver has been disqualified this year for cheating.

The BRSCC MX5 Mk1's are a bit more fluid and as they have been raced for so long you are racing against years of development. The cost is higher as the front runners are reportedly having several engines a year and are spending large sums on those engines. I discounted it as i would need an engine rebuild and probably a diff rebuild a year, which mounts up. I heard that one front runner was having an engine a meeting!

The MK3's on the whole seem to be more reliable, although we are as a championship going through 3rd gear synchros at an alarming rate, we also lost a few engines this weekend, but they are standard so are easily replaced and the 2009 on version seems to be more reliable with a stronger bottom end. The championnship is really friendly (everyone say's that) so we are all sharing info on oils etc, to try and improve the longevity.

Depends what you want, we are at donnigton on the 18th Oct so come and have a look.

I may well do that, thanks.

[tomperkins]

djroadboy said:

I reckon Mx5s, Compact Cup, PBMW or Caterham Grads would all be a great place to start your financial ruin.

Dan, thanks for your views, appreciate it.

[tomperkins]

mattmk391 said:

Just to balance this statement we (family ‘team’) are now in our 3rd season in the MK3 MX5s and have never had an engine/gearbox/diff fail. We’re even running two cars this year.

During two years racing a MK1 MX5 prior to that we never had a mechanical DNF either.

We really enjoyed the mk1s (Ma5da) but are enjoying the mk3s (SuperCup) even more, especially so this year.

I think in any race meeting paddock you can find someone who’s had endless mechanical trouble and there is always someone who’s thrown silly money at their car/engine perhaps unnecessarily.

But I’ve never seen anyone who’s started these types of thread come back and say ‘I’m not enjoying it. I chose the wrong championship’ no matter what they ended up racing. Usually quite the opposite!

Cheers mattmk391, appreciate you sharing your experience.