The 1975 EEC referendum
Discussion
superlightr said:
Puggit said:
RYH64E said:
Whereas today the UK is doing quite well, the economy is growing, employment is high, life is good...
Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?
I'll have a go... Sovereignty? Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?
Its like being in a 40+ year abusive relationship.
You are unappreciated, abused, money taken from, bent over backwards and shafted, shouted down and told what to do, told you will fail if you leave the relationship, told you are useless and cant survive being outside, no one will like or be friends with you ever plus you will be poor forever and you've never had it so good as you do now and perhaps if you wont be abused AS much in the future if you keep quiet now.
I would go as far as saying the majority of the UK public were far less well informed in 1975, and most probably believed they were only signing up to trading agreement, not a European super state, headed in the main by one country, that would infiltrate its unwanted control over all aspects of life in the UK, and other member states.
If they had been told then, that they were joining an organization which would be controlled by the very country, that just a few years before they been fighting and dying against to prevent it from controlling Europe, and into something, that would change into something very different from what they were being sold at the time, I imagine manyu would vote to stay out.
If they had been told then, they would be joining an organization which agreed to make significant changes to its CAP in exchange for extra billions of UK taxpayers cash, but which then not only made NO changes whatsoever to the CAP (remind me again, which country gets the most out of the CAP, a clue it is not the UK!) and continued to take the extra billions of UK taxpayers cash, but gave none of it back to the UK, which is ironic since it is the UK`s money in the first place. And then the EU has the nerve to fine the UK millions of pounds, for not spending its own money the way the EU wants it to!
Or how about the leader of a certain single EU country, who invited in millions of immigrants, and when that leader realized what a mistake they had made, wanted to foist them off onto other member states, who were given NO say in the matter, and were threatened with a 250 thousand Euro fine, for Every single immigrant they refused to take./
Or how about an organization which was happy to throw billions of Euros at a corrupt basket case country which should never have been admitted in the first place to keep the European super state wet dream alive (much of which came from the UK, as the UK is the EU`s second largest net contributor of funds INTO the EU coffers) but which would not even consider modest reforms requested by its second largest net contributor claiming that the UK was already receiving `special treatment'
Or how about an organization which makes some member states carry out several referendums until those countries come up with the result the EU wants, or in some cases completely ignores the results, because it does not suit the EU`s agenda.
My guess would be that, knowing what we know now, about the corrupt, un democratic, unaccountable, money grabbing, money wasting, over regulating monster that the EEC has morphed into, most people with any intelligence, would want to stay as far away from the cancer that is the current EU as possible, and would have voted resoundingly to keep away from it in 1975.
Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Tuesday 24th May 13:34
Eric Mc said:
I reckon they wouldn't.
The UK was economically on its knees by 1975. ANYTHING seemed better than where things stood at that time. Indeed, in 1975/76, Britain came closest to a military coup than at any time since the Civil War.
The EEC was looked on as a form of "rescue" - as it often is perceived by countries gagging to join.
But they voted on joining a trading bloc, known as the EEC, not to become a subordinate country in an organization led by the very country they were fighting against just a few short years before.The UK was economically on its knees by 1975. ANYTHING seemed better than where things stood at that time. Indeed, in 1975/76, Britain came closest to a military coup than at any time since the Civil War.
The EEC was looked on as a form of "rescue" - as it often is perceived by countries gagging to join.
E.g Vote question in 1975: UK, Do you want to vote to join what is being called a trading organization, which once you are in, will change itself (without your consent) into a European super state, (headed ironically by the same country you have just been fighting to stop it dominating Europe) and which will be taking billions of pounds off you every year, for nothing more than the privilege of letting the UK do business with it?
My guess would be that most UK citizens at the time would vote no.
Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Tuesday 24th May 13:47
Eric Mc said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
But they voted on joining a trading bloc, known as the EEC, not to become a subordinate country in an organization led by the very country they were fighting against just a few short years before.
We all know that, now.I'm talking about the mindset in place over 4 decades ago and the circumstances existing at the time of the vote
I would wager that even if people thought that sovereignty was an issue back in 1975, they still would have voted "yes" on the basis that the current governments and unions of the day were effectively destroying the country between them.
We now know much more than we did then, but surprisingly there are still `some' (probably EU gravy trainers or those who have not bothered to look at the UK`s relationship with what is now the EU) who will vote to remain.
jakesmith said:
55palfers said:
Me too!
This point is of limited relevance. Whilst we hear of the stupidity of some European bureaucracy and the laws that annoy us, in the tabloid press, great majority of legislation in the UK is not of European origin. We still have our own parliaments, elections, laws. It is nowhere near the sort of forced economic union that those joining the Euro experience, that we are free from. Eric Mc said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Do you seriously believe the UK has the same influence over the way the EU is run, and in what direction it will go as Germany (or even France for heavens sake)???
Who's fault might that be?We shouldn't the UK have a bigger (if not the biggest) influence in the EU? Our economies and influence in the world is or at least should be on a par with that of France or Germany. Why should the UK feel it is being pushed around by big bad European bullies? Is it some sort of post Imperial inferiority complex at work?
I sometimes think that Britain's "why is everybody kicking us around" attitude frankly pathetic. The country should just roll its sleeves up and get into the ring with the rest of them and fight its causes properly instead of whingeing from the corner saying "poor us, nobody loves us".
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