Birmingham Transport Plan, remove parking spaces

[FiF]

I really dislike Birmingham. Though there is no money, so is this just hot air.

https://www.birmingham.gov.uk/downloads/file/14861...

rabid anti car council people said:

The allocation of road space will change away from prioritising private cars, to support the delivery of public transport and active travel networks. (Note:- Active travel apparently means, walking, wheeling i.e. wheelchairs and disability equipment, cycling, scooters.)

The city centre of Birmingham will be transformed through the creation of a network of pedestrianised streets and public spaces, integrated with public transport services and cycling infrastructure. Access to the city centre for private cars will be limited, with no through trips allowed.

Parking will be used as a means to manage demand for travel by car through availability, pricing and restrictions. Where development potential exists, land currently occupied by car parking will be put to more productive use.

On-street parking replaced with outdoor hospitality space

Divide the city centre into seven segments (the city core and six peripheral segments bound by the A4540 Ring Road), is a first step towards encouraging sustainable freight movements. Each segment can only be accessed from the A4540 Ring Road, while movement between segments is only possible for public transport, pedestrians, and cyclists. All other vehicles cannot cross the segment boundaries due to physical measures such as bus gates and road closures, and so would need to go back to the A4540 Ring Road to move between segments.

Reduction in council owned car park spaces (at least by 2,500 spaces since 2012) and redevelopment of a number of large car park sites. Car parks to be redeveloped into housing.

Review of all parking provision including areas outside the A4540 Ring Road.

Existing Controlled Parking Zones in place and extend these to remove free car parking from within the A4540 Ring Road, from neighbourhoods on the outskirts of the city centre, and from local centres.

Thought there was "No war on the motorist."

Edited, I forgot to include the proposal 20mph standard limit, except strategic roads, 30mph.

Safe to say, assuming still driving by the time this comes to fruition in 5/7 years will be avoiding the place. Pretty much avoid it now. Hell hole.

[FiF]

Quhet said:

horseshoecrab said:

Eh? You'd rather have this? Taking priority away from car use has literally led to billions of pounds of investment

FiF said:

Thought there was "No war on the motorist."

Edited, I forgot to include the proposal 20mph standard limit, except strategic roads, 30mph.

Safe to say, assuming still driving by the time this comes to fruition in 5/7 years will be avoiding the place. Pretty much avoid it now. Hell hole.

I live in Edgbaston and the quickest way for most people on my side of the city to get to Spaghetti Junction is to drive into town and join the urban motorway literally 100m from New Street Station. It's frankly insane.

Breaking the concrete collar at Masshouse around 15 years ago was the first step to making a more llivable and walkable city. It took away some crappy car parks but didn't stop people driving into town. It did lead to the creation of several thousand new dwellings, a park, massive expansion of one of the city universities and an incoming HS2 station. The Clean Air Zone was the first big nudge to get people out of cars and this is being followed by carving up the city centre like a trivial pursuit cheese so that traffic has to go around rather than through. This has been handily aided by the Curzon Street HS2 development and the new Metro line through Digbeth.

If I have a meeting in London or go shopping in Oxford Street I don't expect to drive there. Cars are being pushed out of Birmingham city centre and although directly affected by this everyday I generally support what is being done but only if public transport options are in place. The city core is set to expand enormously out to the A4540 Middleway. It's already a more pleasant experience but if you want to avoid the place it's probably for the best.

Sensible post and I agree 100%. It makes complete sense to affect a modal shift away from cars in town and city centres as long as the public transport and cycling infrastructure is improved too.

Plenty of places got into a mess in the 1950s-1970s by planning around the car, Birmingham included (how many here complain that it's a concrete sthole?). Movement away from this will obviously cause some short term pain but it should bear fruit - just look at how Danish and German Cities have been able to do it.

In principle I don't disagree with the view that public transport has to match. Currently the public transport in Birmingham wouod have to improve significantly.

As for the public transport in the surrounding areas who commute into Birmingham, that has to improve by many factors more than the City network. From Worcester, Droitwich Bromsgrove, Ledbury, Malvern, Bewdley, Wyre Forest, Hagley. Just to name things coming from one direction. These have, pretty much rural transport networks, made worse by unreliability.

It's a major task, needs more than Birmingham on its own can cope with.

[FiF]

Mrr T said:

Quhet said:

FiF said:

In principle I don't disagree with the view that public transport has to match. Currently the public transport in Birmingham wouod have to improve significantly.

As for the public transport in the surrounding areas who commute into Birmingham, that has to improve by many factors more than the City network. From Worcester, Droitwich Bromsgrove, Ledbury, Malvern, Bewdley, Wyre Forest, Hagley. Just to name things coming from one direction. These have, pretty much rural transport networks, made worse by unreliability.

It's a major task, needs more than Birmingham on its own can cope with.

That's where park and ride comes in. Like it or not, it's fairly straightforward to drive to a station like Selly Oak, King's Norton, Longbridge etc and then get the train in. Its what hundreds if not thousands do everyday for work

Except going shopping is different to work. If you can park near the shops you can pop back to leave purchases. Making the day much easier. Using public transport means carrying all your purchases.

The alternative is the retail parks which welcome cars.

In a few years time the council will be lamenting the decline of its high street.

Know I started this thread but I'm torn on this issue. We used to regularly go into Birmingham during the day for shopping, winding in a lunch or coffee. Also our corporate place was at Fiveways for a time though I used to avoid it for other unrelated reasons. Additionally there were plenty of evening visits for entertainment, dining, meeting up with folks at regular spots. Now that never happens, just don't go, and the reasons have got absolutely nothing to do with traffic, difficulty of driving in and parking or whatever. Could use public transport, train station only a short way away, but frankly the infrequency and unreliability of the service coupled with the totally unpleasant crowd that get on and off part way through the journey. Only need to take a glance at some of them, "Well they're getting off at <insert intermediate station name>." always an accurate observation. Yep snobby, guilty as charged. But it all makes for better to find an alternative, which has turned out to be avoid the place.

Yet on the other hand our nearest county seat had a Park and Ride, which we used, everyday. Both for 9-5 and weekend shopping. Yes it was awkward if carrying a few bags of stuff, but generally it was not much hassle. Finished early so no good for night economy excursions, and working late could be awkward. Service removed for financial reasons and is missed tbh. Again results in less visits, less business for the city centre.

Personally wonder if in years to come the council will look at the on street parking converted to outdoor hospitality and wonder if that decision was about as accurate as Blair's changes to licensing hours in 2002/3(?) would lead the denizens of Grimsby to sit out in pavement cafes late of an evening sipping at a Campari and Soda.

There's no doubt that city centres are changing, and have to change, including converting existing buildings and spaces to increase availability of quality housing. But it seems to me that hitting the freedom afforded by personal transport is also unfairly hitting many of low / middle income who really need that transport to carry on life.

[FiF]

MrBig said:

GiantEnemyCrab said:

They've literally said they will remove free car parking in surrounding areas also. It's in the OP.

Yes, from inside the inner ring road. I have no issue with that, but they should be providing parking outside of the ring road. Off the expressway, straight into a car park, walk the rest of the way into a clean congestion free city centre. Seems perfectly logical to me.

You need to read it more carefully.

They specifically mention reviewing all parking inside and outside the ring road, extending Controlled Parking Zones remove free car parking from within the A4540 Ring Road, from neighbourhoods on the outskirts of the city centre, and from local centres. Workplace Parking Levy too.

Some proposals are definitely welcomed, eg removing and stopping parking on footways and pavements, this is a curse.

The overall headline aim is to "Manage Overall Demand through Parking Measures."