Chamonix studio renovation - build thread
Discussion
The plan was to rent a place in Argentiere, Chamonix, for the winter to do a ski season. We viewed a few places in the summer and realised the deposit on a modest place was only a bit more, so we put in a cheeky offer on a small studio in Grand Roc instead and it was accepted. We signed last Friday and by Monday I was in Chamonix with a big hammer, knocking seven bells out of the place with a view to doing a complete renovation.
The apartment is a studio duplex on the ground floor of a 5-storey concrete tower block, built in 1968. It hadn't been re-decorated since. Here's a plan of the original layout. It's 32sqm in a footprint that's 3.75m wide and 5.7m long, with a ceiling height of 4.3m. The walls are chunky concrete and the upstairs bathroom sits outside those measurements on a solid concrete floor. All of the plumbing is off a communal chimney, which gives a few restrictions on placement.
Here's a panoramic shot of the ground floor space. It's even smaller than it looks.
Taken with my back to the apartment door, with the ground floor toilet room on my left and the 'GCSE woodwork' staircase to my right.
The beautiful bathroom. Again, it's a panoramic shot so don't be deceived by the space. It's pokey in there at 1.3m x 1.9m. I'm also hoping to squeeze a toilet in here now as well.
Apparently a very popular renovation is to extend the mezzanine to a full floor and add two proper bedrooms, to sleep six. We're more interested in making a very comfortable space for ourselves (a 30-something couple, with a dog) and visiting friends to enjoy. I looked at the space and thought it could be improved with a bit of a rethink. The little bathroom downstairs seemed to be a waste given there was already a bathroom upstairs (albeit missing a toilet). The stairs were also in an odd place which left a lot of wasted space above them, on the mezzanine floor. I came up with a new design that would mean gutting the entire place and starting again from a bare shell.
I'm a designer by trade, but not an architect, so I suspect I'm a nightmare client. I have very detailed ideas but not the experience to execute them properly - knocking up some IKEA flat-packs is about as far as my DIY experience goes, though I have designed a desk, library wall and walk-in wardrobe for the London gaff which have proved successful. I've designed the staircase myself, but have a friendly joiner helping to install it and stop me from cocking it up too royally.
Total budget is £30,000, including my own living and travel costs during the build. I'll be doing the work with a local mate (paid) who's got a full complement of tools and knows what to do with them. If everything ran perfectly smoothly I think it's a five week job. I'm allowing six weeks - hopefully 20% is a big enough contingency.
The carved wooden tat seems to be the only style the mountain folk can do, so all of the apartments and chalets I've stayed in have been the same. My plan is to aim for something a bit more luxurious. More like a studio apartment you'd find in London or another European capital.
The apartment is a studio duplex on the ground floor of a 5-storey concrete tower block, built in 1968. It hadn't been re-decorated since. Here's a plan of the original layout. It's 32sqm in a footprint that's 3.75m wide and 5.7m long, with a ceiling height of 4.3m. The walls are chunky concrete and the upstairs bathroom sits outside those measurements on a solid concrete floor. All of the plumbing is off a communal chimney, which gives a few restrictions on placement.
Here's a panoramic shot of the ground floor space. It's even smaller than it looks.
Taken with my back to the apartment door, with the ground floor toilet room on my left and the 'GCSE woodwork' staircase to my right.
The beautiful bathroom. Again, it's a panoramic shot so don't be deceived by the space. It's pokey in there at 1.3m x 1.9m. I'm also hoping to squeeze a toilet in here now as well.
Apparently a very popular renovation is to extend the mezzanine to a full floor and add two proper bedrooms, to sleep six. We're more interested in making a very comfortable space for ourselves (a 30-something couple, with a dog) and visiting friends to enjoy. I looked at the space and thought it could be improved with a bit of a rethink. The little bathroom downstairs seemed to be a waste given there was already a bathroom upstairs (albeit missing a toilet). The stairs were also in an odd place which left a lot of wasted space above them, on the mezzanine floor. I came up with a new design that would mean gutting the entire place and starting again from a bare shell.
I'm a designer by trade, but not an architect, so I suspect I'm a nightmare client. I have very detailed ideas but not the experience to execute them properly - knocking up some IKEA flat-packs is about as far as my DIY experience goes, though I have designed a desk, library wall and walk-in wardrobe for the London gaff which have proved successful. I've designed the staircase myself, but have a friendly joiner helping to install it and stop me from cocking it up too royally.
Total budget is £30,000, including my own living and travel costs during the build. I'll be doing the work with a local mate (paid) who's got a full complement of tools and knows what to do with them. If everything ran perfectly smoothly I think it's a five week job. I'm allowing six weeks - hopefully 20% is a big enough contingency.
The carved wooden tat seems to be the only style the mountain folk can do, so all of the apartments and chalets I've stayed in have been the same. My plan is to aim for something a bit more luxurious. More like a studio apartment you'd find in London or another European capital.
Day 1
Gathering tools and doing a bit of research in the nearest big town to see what's available in the way of materials. After lunch we starting demolishing the place and made decent progress. Unfortunately, being France, we're only allowed to do heavy works within very narrow times, and not at all during school holidays, so the race is on to finish before half-term week.
Half the ground floor cleared already.
Gathering tools and doing a bit of research in the nearest big town to see what's available in the way of materials. After lunch we starting demolishing the place and made decent progress. Unfortunately, being France, we're only allowed to do heavy works within very narrow times, and not at all during school holidays, so the race is on to finish before half-term week.
Half the ground floor cleared already.
KTF said:
Do you have access to a communal ski locker (or similar) to store all your gear or does that have to be in the apartment as well?
If the natives have all extended the second floor isn't that something that should be explored as it gives you a clue to what the market wants?
There is a communal locker, but it's too narrow for snowboards, so I'm utilising a bit of leftover space behind the new kitchen for a supplemental ski-locker.If the natives have all extended the second floor isn't that something that should be explored as it gives you a clue to what the market wants?
That may well be what the majority of the market wants, but there are 100 odd apartments in the three buildings all catering to that need. I'm fairly confident that there's at least a small market for a well appointed small apartment for people with a bit more cash than the gap-year seasonaires, looking for something a bit more comfortable. It's the sort of place we would like to rent, along with many of our friends. It may be niche, but there doesn't seem to be anybody else competing for those type of people so I'm hoping we'll do OK.
We're treating this as our pension so rental yield is important, but it's also for us to enjoy ourselves, so I wouldn't be too disappointed if it didn't generate the absolute maximum return possible.
Day 2
The skip arrives. Luckily we managed to jump into the space right outside the apartment just as one of our neighbours left. It's hoofing distance from the balcony so now we can get on with some serious demolition.
Maurice, my geriatric, potty-mouthed accomplice with a leaky arse that smells of dead things.
By lunch time we'd cleared the upstairs bathroom and all of the upper level.
And by the end of the day we've cleared the kitchen and taken up most of the mezzanine floor. I think we'll have a largely bare shell by lunch time tomorrow.
The skip arrives. Luckily we managed to jump into the space right outside the apartment just as one of our neighbours left. It's hoofing distance from the balcony so now we can get on with some serious demolition.
Maurice, my geriatric, potty-mouthed accomplice with a leaky arse that smells of dead things.
By lunch time we'd cleared the upstairs bathroom and all of the upper level.
And by the end of the day we've cleared the kitchen and taken up most of the mezzanine floor. I think we'll have a largely bare shell by lunch time tomorrow.
jke11y said:
Great project. Looking at the photos the extending of the mezzanine would result in an internal bedroom? I can see why you would rather keep it open and more spacious feeling, double heights spaces are great for that.
Yes, the standard renovation creates a tiny windowless bedroom and a larger one at the bottom of my plan. They'd both be tiny in reality. Going double height in such a small space is a bit indulgent but that's the whole idea. I'm using glass for balustrading too, so it helps to open the space up a little more.
Day 3
Final clearing of the internal structure.
We now have the most spacious bathroom in the valley.
Safety first.
The internal space is now cleared, save for a bit of carpet, asbestos-filled floor tiles and some wallpaper. The electrics in the place are awful so we'll just rip it all out and start again from scratch. I'll pick up the joists and wall brackets tomorrow and we'll make a start on the new mezzanine floor.
Final clearing of the internal structure.
We now have the most spacious bathroom in the valley.
Safety first.
The internal space is now cleared, save for a bit of carpet, asbestos-filled floor tiles and some wallpaper. The electrics in the place are awful so we'll just rip it all out and start again from scratch. I'll pick up the joists and wall brackets tomorrow and we'll make a start on the new mezzanine floor.
Edited by Gruffy on Wednesday 25th September 12:24
OscarIndia said:
I shipped some out from the UK and had them fitted. that was about half the price of getting it done by the French!
I'm finding this too. I had quotes for the glass for the staircase and mezzanine balustrades from the local French glass processor and it was €5,000 (for about 4.2sqm of 15mm toughened). Seemed a bit pricey to me so I had my local Bermondsey place quote me and it came in at £1,600 + VAT. That's being cut this week and I'm shipping it off to my joiner in Brum to bring down with the staircase. 
Chamonix is known as the birthplace of extreme sports, after all.jke11y said:
Gruffy said:
so I had my local Bermondsey place quote me and it came in at £1,600 + VAT. That's being cut this week and I'm shipping it off to my joiner in Brum to bring down with the staircase.
And they'll be getting it from European in Park Royal at 30+less again 
Driller said:
Great project, beautiful place!
Were you careful to smash the asbestos up really small before you chucked it in the skip?
The tiles are a job for this morning (along with carpet and wallpaper). We're pretty confident they'll come up in good pieces. I bloody hope so otherwise that'll seriously dent the budget and the schedule!Were you careful to smash the asbestos up really small before you chucked it in the skip?
Day 4
Finally confirmed the glass this morning. I checked in a couple of local places now that I'm on the ground and nobody could turn it around quickly enough. I also met another Brit who does a lot of building out here and he reckoned they'd never come close on price. Luckily my supplier in Bermondsey came through and will get it to the joiner in time for his drive down next weekend.
Gathered up all the materials for the mezzanine floor this morning. Just got in there before the 12 o'clock siesta started, so they sawed them into manageable pieces, because 12m is a bit much to be hanging out of the van.
"Doe fret and keep gooin" - Maurice is 'black country' (and all about H&S)
Half the wall hangers are up now. I was desperate to keep the floor as thin as possible, to save headroom - I'm 6'4" and we have a total height of 4.3m for both floors. We were also partly limited by what wall hangers were available, so we ended up using 140x140mm joists with 400mm spacing for a span of 3.75m. This felt a bit on the safe side - which I'm happy with - but it wasn't until we started marking up for the hangers that we realised we'd gone properly overboard. Somehow we'd both been picturing 400mm gaps, not 400mm spacing. About 40% of the whole floor space is now joists. A tiny bit closer and we could have done without floorboards altogether! Still, at least it ain't going anywhere.
Essential tools for the job. Now whenever Maurice floats an air biscuit (roughly 5 minute intervals), I can blow raspberries of my own.
Finally confirmed the glass this morning. I checked in a couple of local places now that I'm on the ground and nobody could turn it around quickly enough. I also met another Brit who does a lot of building out here and he reckoned they'd never come close on price. Luckily my supplier in Bermondsey came through and will get it to the joiner in time for his drive down next weekend.
Gathered up all the materials for the mezzanine floor this morning. Just got in there before the 12 o'clock siesta started, so they sawed them into manageable pieces, because 12m is a bit much to be hanging out of the van.
"Doe fret and keep gooin" - Maurice is 'black country' (and all about H&S)
Half the wall hangers are up now. I was desperate to keep the floor as thin as possible, to save headroom - I'm 6'4" and we have a total height of 4.3m for both floors. We were also partly limited by what wall hangers were available, so we ended up using 140x140mm joists with 400mm spacing for a span of 3.75m. This felt a bit on the safe side - which I'm happy with - but it wasn't until we started marking up for the hangers that we realised we'd gone properly overboard. Somehow we'd both been picturing 400mm gaps, not 400mm spacing. About 40% of the whole floor space is now joists. A tiny bit closer and we could have done without floorboards altogether! Still, at least it ain't going anywhere.
Essential tools for the job. Now whenever Maurice floats an air biscuit (roughly 5 minute intervals), I can blow raspberries of my own.
Whoops. I priced up my kitchen with using ikea.co.uk thinking it'd be broadly similar in Geneva. Most of the appliances are 60% over the UK prices!?
HJÄLPSAM slimline dishwasher
IKEA UK £300
IKEA Geneva 699CHF (£479)
FORKYLD integrated fridge
IKEA UK £350
IKEA Geneva 799CHF (£548)
RENLIG integrated washing machine
IKEA UK £400
IKEA GENEVA 899CHF (£616)
MOJLIG 2-plate induction hob
IKEA UK £220
IKEA GENEVA 399CHF (£273)
Total cost in Blighty = £1,270
Total cost in Geneva = £1,916
Difference of £646
HJÄLPSAM slimline dishwasher
IKEA UK £300
IKEA Geneva 699CHF (£479)
FORKYLD integrated fridge
IKEA UK £350
IKEA Geneva 799CHF (£548)
RENLIG integrated washing machine
IKEA UK £400
IKEA GENEVA 899CHF (£616)
MOJLIG 2-plate induction hob
IKEA UK £220
IKEA GENEVA 399CHF (£273)
Total cost in Blighty = £1,270
Total cost in Geneva = £1,916
Difference of £646
What a result. One of the black country glass processors I asked to quote has come back massively cheaper than my London lot. The Bermondsey outfit were very decent about it and let me back out without any penalty at all. He even refused to let me cover his costs for the glass saying he'd use it somewhere else - decent bloke. The black country gang needed a bit of £lubricating to get it turned around quickly enough but I'm still up by about £500 all said and done.
Day 5
All of the wall hangers for the mezzanine are up by lunch. We went through two drill bits finding some of the steel that's reinforcing the concrete walls.
Each end of each joist is routed and then chiselled to give a recess for the wall hanger, so that we have a nice flush finish for hanging plasterboard.
The last joist goes in by mid-afternoon and we move on to fixing batons to the end wall to support the floorboards on the top and plasterboard on the bottom.
A bit of skip shopping to find some 70mm timbers I know I threw in there somewhere.
So far we're about 1/2 a day ahead of schedule, though we're now planning a full re-wire of the electrics, which will likely add a day or two. We're also running about £2,000 under budget. Hopefully that trend will continue.
All of the wall hangers for the mezzanine are up by lunch. We went through two drill bits finding some of the steel that's reinforcing the concrete walls.
Each end of each joist is routed and then chiselled to give a recess for the wall hanger, so that we have a nice flush finish for hanging plasterboard.
The last joist goes in by mid-afternoon and we move on to fixing batons to the end wall to support the floorboards on the top and plasterboard on the bottom.
A bit of skip shopping to find some 70mm timbers I know I threw in there somewhere.
So far we're about 1/2 a day ahead of schedule, though we're now planning a full re-wire of the electrics, which will likely add a day or two. We're also running about £2,000 under budget. Hopefully that trend will continue.
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