Do you think trust can ever be earned back?
Discussion
What's the consensus on this one then..
I'm asking specifically about trust in a relationship, not the jeremy Kyle sort of 'did my brother steal my baby's ipad' kind of thing.
Once it's broken, is it worth keeping at it and hoping it'll come back, or is it gone forever, and hoping it'll come back is just a waste of time?
I'm asking specifically about trust in a relationship, not the jeremy Kyle sort of 'did my brother steal my baby's ipad' kind of thing.
Once it's broken, is it worth keeping at it and hoping it'll come back, or is it gone forever, and hoping it'll come back is just a waste of time?
Stupeo said:
This. I've just learnt how difficult it can be to trust someone again..
Ive been trying for a couple of months now, and there are days it doesn't enter my mind, and then other days (usually the weekend where there are no distractions of work etc) where it becomes quite problematic. Firstly, thank you for all of your replies. Especially to those who have been through a similar thing, I guess we both know it's not easy!
Some of the responses along the lines of 'get some self respect & get rid' are fine if the relationship isn't particularly serious, but for a couple who live together, and planned on marriage and children etc I think it's a worth a little more consideration.
I'll give you some background information:
A couple of times in the past she has received attention from someone and not done enough to discourage it which has annoyed me, infact actuall encouraged it - but I nipped that in the bud and fully explained what I expect in a relationship and we carried on and forgot about it. There were also a few other unnacceptable things that happened but I won't go into details, I think I was a bit of a mug at the start but just really wanted it to work.
A couple of months ago she left her phone at home and went off to work, and she wasn't clever enough to hide the messages - lots were discussed between her and a married man from work (married with a kid - that's one of the things that's most disgusted me!!) they discussed sex, and I found out they'd kissed, but from the messages and what she's told me (yes I know...) that was it, and she had clearly stopped replying and realised what she was doing. Attempted to put a stop to it but if I hadn't found out who knows if it could of escalated.
She was devastated and in bits for about a week (facing losing a partner who'd do anything for her, her house and potentially job as her family are miles away, couldn't stsy here on her own etc) as was I, and I decided it was worth trying as we had made so many plans for our future together and had 4 years invested in the relationship - love has clearly not gone but been tainted a little.
This is where I get judged harshly and probably fairly - I find it easier to forgive(or feel like I should) as I did something I shouldn't have about a year ago. It's no excuse, but I was under a lot of pressure at work (only in my early 20's in a high pressure job, woe is me and all that but sometimes it gets a little much), i was trying to help my mentally ill mother cope through a very bad time, under great financial strain, splitting time between working long hours, caring for my mum and making sure I was still the attentive bf to my demanding and rather selfish gf.... and she was making it incredibly difficult and being very unreasonable/selfish and as a result I struggled to help my mum (who's on her own, I'm her only family), gf not understanding at all and I was forced to be super son and boyfriend and employee and I was making myself unwell... Or rather my other half was, instead of supporting me and my family like most normal people would.
No excuse for anything but she was making my life hell and perhaps I should of called it a day back then, but things did improve and she became *almost* the perfect girlfriend after that. We have always been best friends as well as a couple, most of the time. At least I was decent enough not to let her find out, but it still eats away at me, how can I be angry at her for doing something when I did too?. But anyway, I know I'd n ever do anything like that again, biggest regret of my life... the trouble is, I don't know my other half wouldn't, as she seems to lap up any attention instead of ignoring it like she should or would if she was happy enough with me.
You'll think now that the relationship is basically knackered and I should give up, but honestly i don't think either of us can imagine life without one another. Ive been trying to get back to normal but it's taking more work then I'd have ever thought, and all I want is to be able to trust her again and carry on with everything we planned for the future.
I think overall ive put up with more than I ever should have with her, but I know what it's like to make a mistake. At the moment I find it hard to trust she wouldn't do it again one day, I guess this is what needs to be earned back.
It wasn't a drunken mistake, no real reason for it or explanation/excuse other than enjoyed the attention, that's what bothers me. I also think by forgiving it I do risk her thinking she can get away wth things again. In my mind, a relationship should be innocent and you should get married knowing things are just the way they are meant to be, devoted to each other, I can't help but think this sours the whole thing - but can't seem to ever let go.
Thanks for reading all this if you bothered... Make of it what you will, it's not all bad and day-to-day life is usually pleasant and we really enjoy each others company, but with these underlying issues im sceptical about our future :-(
Some of the responses along the lines of 'get some self respect & get rid' are fine if the relationship isn't particularly serious, but for a couple who live together, and planned on marriage and children etc I think it's a worth a little more consideration.
I'll give you some background information:
A couple of times in the past she has received attention from someone and not done enough to discourage it which has annoyed me, infact actuall encouraged it - but I nipped that in the bud and fully explained what I expect in a relationship and we carried on and forgot about it. There were also a few other unnacceptable things that happened but I won't go into details, I think I was a bit of a mug at the start but just really wanted it to work.
A couple of months ago she left her phone at home and went off to work, and she wasn't clever enough to hide the messages - lots were discussed between her and a married man from work (married with a kid - that's one of the things that's most disgusted me!!) they discussed sex, and I found out they'd kissed, but from the messages and what she's told me (yes I know...) that was it, and she had clearly stopped replying and realised what she was doing. Attempted to put a stop to it but if I hadn't found out who knows if it could of escalated.
She was devastated and in bits for about a week (facing losing a partner who'd do anything for her, her house and potentially job as her family are miles away, couldn't stsy here on her own etc) as was I, and I decided it was worth trying as we had made so many plans for our future together and had 4 years invested in the relationship - love has clearly not gone but been tainted a little.
This is where I get judged harshly and probably fairly - I find it easier to forgive(or feel like I should) as I did something I shouldn't have about a year ago. It's no excuse, but I was under a lot of pressure at work (only in my early 20's in a high pressure job, woe is me and all that but sometimes it gets a little much), i was trying to help my mentally ill mother cope through a very bad time, under great financial strain, splitting time between working long hours, caring for my mum and making sure I was still the attentive bf to my demanding and rather selfish gf.... and she was making it incredibly difficult and being very unreasonable/selfish and as a result I struggled to help my mum (who's on her own, I'm her only family), gf not understanding at all and I was forced to be super son and boyfriend and employee and I was making myself unwell... Or rather my other half was, instead of supporting me and my family like most normal people would.
No excuse for anything but she was making my life hell and perhaps I should of called it a day back then, but things did improve and she became *almost* the perfect girlfriend after that. We have always been best friends as well as a couple, most of the time. At least I was decent enough not to let her find out, but it still eats away at me, how can I be angry at her for doing something when I did too?. But anyway, I know I'd n ever do anything like that again, biggest regret of my life... the trouble is, I don't know my other half wouldn't, as she seems to lap up any attention instead of ignoring it like she should or would if she was happy enough with me.
You'll think now that the relationship is basically knackered and I should give up, but honestly i don't think either of us can imagine life without one another. Ive been trying to get back to normal but it's taking more work then I'd have ever thought, and all I want is to be able to trust her again and carry on with everything we planned for the future.
I think overall ive put up with more than I ever should have with her, but I know what it's like to make a mistake. At the moment I find it hard to trust she wouldn't do it again one day, I guess this is what needs to be earned back.
It wasn't a drunken mistake, no real reason for it or explanation/excuse other than enjoyed the attention, that's what bothers me. I also think by forgiving it I do risk her thinking she can get away wth things again. In my mind, a relationship should be innocent and you should get married knowing things are just the way they are meant to be, devoted to each other, I can't help but think this sours the whole thing - but can't seem to ever let go.
Thanks for reading all this if you bothered... Make of it what you will, it's not all bad and day-to-day life is usually pleasant and we really enjoy each others company, but with these underlying issues im sceptical about our future :-(
mikefacel said:
This! In fact, I'd go as far as to say this is worse than the infidelity. You have here a woman who is selfish, self-centred and lacks empathy and true love. If she really loves you OP she'd have helped you. Instead, she was jealous of your relationship with your mum.This is a clear warning that she is not there for you. Neither will she be there properly for your kids if you have them. In her world, she comes first, always. I take back what I said in my earlier post - get out now. There's a world of pain ahead. You are not "invested" properly in a relationship after only 4 years and if you don't have kids.
Apparently she's shown true love by staying with me when I was going through that difficult time as apprently most people wouldn't.... Hmm. I know at that stage in the relationship I should of said goodbye. I had given her endless opportunities in life, she got to do things she never would of done, move out, learn to drive, the confidence to get a decent job, had lots of presents and surprises, weekends away, holidays.... Yet when I need some understanding it really wasn't there. Things have improved on that front, but it's hard to forget it. Thanks for the comments all, I certainly know I don't have any moral high ground and it's something very out of character for me and something I'm genuinely embarrassed/ashamed about. I know having a stupid excuse doesn't make it better, it was escapism I suppose, something to forget my car crash of a life at the time.
I know none of it looks good and if I were to give a friend advice with the same situation I know what I would say - but when you love someone and have built a life with them, it goes deeper than being scared of being single. I'm not scared of that at all, I could have more sleep, do more exercise, spend more time with family (maybe move nearer them), do as much overtime ag work as I like and finally get a mortgage deposit together. I'm not scared of being alone at all, I don't just want any relationship or any person, I want her, and can't imagine life with us not together. Stupid as it may be to some of you. It's a s
t situation. Smitters said:
To summarise:
When you needed her, she wasn't there for you. Caring for your own family should make her beam with pride she's got a good-un, not act out like a spoilt brat who's not getting enough attention. Strike one.
"A couple of times in the past...". It's not a one off, drunk moment of weakness. You're talking about issues you know of. Tip of the iceberg my friend. She doesn't respect you, herself, the third party or the third party's family in any way. Her emotional maturity is seriously stunted. Strike two. Note, she was devastated at the potential outcome (all thing's she'd lose). Change is scary - she was scared of change. I'm willing to bet if the nest had been rosy on the other side of the fence (i.e. not married, not having a kid), she'd have been a lot less upset.
You talk of marriage and kids. Can you really imagine settling down with someone who is proven more than a little flighty? Easily distracted/attracted? It's up to you if this is strike three.
If I were you, I'd gather up all the good memories, bank them and move on. It's a big, scary decision but you're obviously a capable man. You'll do fine. I learned the hard way that ignoring exactly this issue simply delays the inevitable. The inevitable happened in 2012, post marriage, post house purchase but thankfully pre-kids. If I'd been braver and smarter ten years ago, I'd have saved myself, quite literally, eight years of unhappiness, interspersed with occasional moments of happiness. Life should be the other way round...
Its good to hear it from someone who's been through a break up and come out the other side, it's probably the best advice I'll receive in this thread, but it doesn't make it any easier to even contemplate finishing it. I suppose the right thing to do is rarely easy.When you needed her, she wasn't there for you. Caring for your own family should make her beam with pride she's got a good-un, not act out like a spoilt brat who's not getting enough attention. Strike one.
"A couple of times in the past...". It's not a one off, drunk moment of weakness. You're talking about issues you know of. Tip of the iceberg my friend. She doesn't respect you, herself, the third party or the third party's family in any way. Her emotional maturity is seriously stunted. Strike two. Note, she was devastated at the potential outcome (all thing's she'd lose). Change is scary - she was scared of change. I'm willing to bet if the nest had been rosy on the other side of the fence (i.e. not married, not having a kid), she'd have been a lot less upset.
You talk of marriage and kids. Can you really imagine settling down with someone who is proven more than a little flighty? Easily distracted/attracted? It's up to you if this is strike three.
If I were you, I'd gather up all the good memories, bank them and move on. It's a big, scary decision but you're obviously a capable man. You'll do fine. I learned the hard way that ignoring exactly this issue simply delays the inevitable. The inevitable happened in 2012, post marriage, post house purchase but thankfully pre-kids. If I'd been braver and smarter ten years ago, I'd have saved myself, quite literally, eight years of unhappiness, interspersed with occasional moments of happiness. Life should be the other way round...
Thanks again for taking the time to reply chaps.
A quite update then:
After rowing every weekend pretty much since it happened, we got it all out and decided to move forward, and have had a good few weeks - almost like it never happened. Until this morning, I went to drop her off some lunch at work and I see the fat getting out of his car on his way in... Ive never wanted to run someone over so badly in all my life!
Apparently he's leaving next week (I did demand she get a new job if we are to work) but now I know what car he drives, it's a small town and Chances are I'll see him again and want to kill him every time (potentially dangerous, I'm not that sort of person but obviously this sort of thing can provoke certain emotions....) and if I see him with his wife and kid in tescos or whatever I don't think I could hold back, which would be unfair on his poor wife and child, I wouldn't want to break up a family!
I'm not really prepared to move house to another town but this has set me back a long way after things were just starting to get back to normal.
Time to evaluate everything, again.
I can safely say I would never do anything like this to anyone ever now, knowing what I now know and how it feels.
A quite update then:
After rowing every weekend pretty much since it happened, we got it all out and decided to move forward, and have had a good few weeks - almost like it never happened. Until this morning, I went to drop her off some lunch at work and I see the fat
getting out of his car on his way in... Ive never wanted to run someone over so badly in all my life! Apparently he's leaving next week (I did demand she get a new job if we are to work) but now I know what car he drives, it's a small town and Chances are I'll see him again and want to kill him every time (potentially dangerous, I'm not that sort of person but obviously this sort of thing can provoke certain emotions....) and if I see him with his wife and kid in tescos or whatever I don't think I could hold back, which would be unfair on his poor wife and child, I wouldn't want to break up a family!
I'm not really prepared to move house to another town but this has set me back a long way after things were just starting to get back to normal.
Time to evaluate everything, again.
I can safely say I would never do anything like this to anyone ever now, knowing what I now know and how it feels.
SeeFive said:
If you and your wife have got this sorted out, it is probably time to realise that you mean more to her than he does. Unless there is a sign of him encroaching on your relationship again, then I would say that as hard as it is, your mindset must be that he is a loser, has no future impact on your life and therefore is nothing to worry about.
Must be very tough for you, but you need to feel like the winner, see your wife's commitment to the relationship and put this loser behind you just as she has. I wonder how he feels when he sees you - and potentially you and her going forward?
I can't imagine he feels much, it's probably a case of silly man wants to have his cake and eat It too, I doubt there was much of an emotional connection there, probably bored married bloke trying to make his dull life a bit more interesting. Some of the people I work with seem to do it fairly regularly behind their wives backs and have done for a long time, to stave off the boredom it seems. Must be very tough for you, but you need to feel like the winner, see your wife's commitment to the relationship and put this loser behind you just as she has. I wonder how he feels when he sees you - and potentially you and her going forward?
I like the sentiment of your post though, it's a nice positive spin on it. Thank you
Condi said:
I think she's put up with more than she ever should have to from you as well. Whats to say high stress job, working away from home, staying in hotel rooms.. you dont end up taking that chick from the bar upstairs. I mean, you've done it once and nobody is ever going to find out, right?
As with everything, there is of course context... Edited by Condi on Saturday 20th February 13:19
But I won't attempt to defend myself in any way, hypocrisy at large completely. However, it doesn't really change the trust from my point of view, which is really the point of the thread. Its no competition, but I'd say doing something like that which means one partner can't go about their business in the town in which they live without a constant possibility of bumping in to the person involved isn't ideal.
I looked at her phone not because I was unnecessarily suspicious but because of things that have happened In the past, which shouldn't have, on her part. Lack of trust is never a good thing but I had good reason.
It's all a big mess and as much as I want everything to go back to how it should be/was before any of this happened it seems less and less likely. I guess once things are spoiled they can't always get better.
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