Boxster S to Burstner 747
Discussion
thought I'd post abit about our Motorhome journey as it seams there are many people making a similar move!
After a fair amount of tenting in sports cars around Europe it was time for something more comfortable.
so the Porsche was put up for sale.
requirements were:
Secure garage for Bikes
kitchen separate to dinette
Future proof
German built
Ideally could tow the track car 3-5 times a year
As a teenager we travelled around Europe in a kontiki 640, bunk above cab, pullman with kitchen opposite and U rear lounge. the Kontiki is still going with 150,000 miles and various damp repairs. So i had a good idea what I wanted.
so the Porsche was sold
We looked at various Hymers, Neisamans, Rapidos and Burstners
the first almost purchase was a bug-eyed Rapido on a narrow sprinter chassis like this
the main issue was that the living area was too cramped two forward facing seats a narrow table and the cab chairs.
then looked at a B700 on a twin tyre Merc
this solved the space issue, but felt old inside, although solidly built
it also wallowed and rocked as you got into it or moved about, not like the rock solid like the Alko based motorhomes
but did have the towing capacity
it was also above budget could have got something like this Burstner also by the Hymer group:
so it was settled, and it was time to find a Alko tag axel Burstner or Dethleff in budget!
Edited by custardkid on Wednesday 17th February 20:40
So in October 2014 we purchased a 2002 747 like this:
Plus points:
Heating - its air rather than water heating, but gets very warm an cosy inside quickly with separate truma boilers for the front and back. Even when its -2 outside in wet windy wales
Heat exchanger - meaning there is heat in the back whilst you are travelling
Handling - its very sure footed, not effected by HGVs or winds, and handles twisty roads with more capability than it deserves
Tanks - enough water for c 6 showers
Twin batteries - we've done 3 nights without running out (I don't have the patients to stay anywhere more than 3 nights)
Storage and weight - it has a full underfloor storage and >1ton capacity so you don't have to worry about stocking up on cheap french wine
Raised floor - meaning you are higher and people walking past cant look in
Cab - the cab can be closed off from the rest of the motorhome makes travelling more refined, as you can close it off
Heat - it keeps cool even in 35 deg spainish heat
Space - enough to survive a wet weekend with the parents in-law & 3 dogs!
other stuff - everything works as it should
Build - build quality feels solid, more so than some British motorhomes
Minus
130 bhp - its not fast, and slows on long motorway climbs, i'm sure the latest 180bhp 3.0s are much better
Bumper - it had a crack, which I fixed but it reappeared, i took a chunk out of it in september.. so it now has a new bumper.
Battery drain - the battery drains even on 240volt after a month or so, solved by hooking up a permanent Ctek charger
Auto frost protection - it drops all its water if the temperature drops below 2 degrees, good if its parked up, not so good if you are in it and want the heating to work! solved with a spring clip.
Height - at 3.2m it triggers the HGV sensors on french tolls, meaning you need to press the intercom button, and most of the time they charge you as class 2. the Aclass version comes in at 3.0m so should sneak under the sensors.
front view - not being an Aclass you don't get a picture window.
Seats - the standard captains chairs (from a special italian manufacturer) weren't comfortable on long journeys, they have been replace with some ford Puma (ebay and local) leather chairs, which are much better
Underfloor access - newer motorhomes have hatches in the floor to access compartments in the double floor, we can only access the double floor storage from the outside.
Satellite dish - i wouldn't have chosen it, and haven't used it ever! we don't even have a TV, some we looked at had 3 tvs! why do you need 3 tvs in a space smaller than some living rooms?
we have the blue interior - pictures are not ours but gives you the idea
this runs under the whole of the motorhome:
ours has a door both sides:
Plus points:
Heating - its air rather than water heating, but gets very warm an cosy inside quickly with separate truma boilers for the front and back. Even when its -2 outside in wet windy wales
Heat exchanger - meaning there is heat in the back whilst you are travelling
Handling - its very sure footed, not effected by HGVs or winds, and handles twisty roads with more capability than it deserves
Tanks - enough water for c 6 showers
Twin batteries - we've done 3 nights without running out (I don't have the patients to stay anywhere more than 3 nights)
Storage and weight - it has a full underfloor storage and >1ton capacity so you don't have to worry about stocking up on cheap french wine
Raised floor - meaning you are higher and people walking past cant look in
Cab - the cab can be closed off from the rest of the motorhome makes travelling more refined, as you can close it off
Heat - it keeps cool even in 35 deg spainish heat
Space - enough to survive a wet weekend with the parents in-law & 3 dogs!
other stuff - everything works as it should
Build - build quality feels solid, more so than some British motorhomes
Minus
130 bhp - its not fast, and slows on long motorway climbs, i'm sure the latest 180bhp 3.0s are much better
Bumper - it had a crack, which I fixed but it reappeared, i took a chunk out of it in september.. so it now has a new bumper.
Battery drain - the battery drains even on 240volt after a month or so, solved by hooking up a permanent Ctek charger
Auto frost protection - it drops all its water if the temperature drops below 2 degrees, good if its parked up, not so good if you are in it and want the heating to work! solved with a spring clip.
Height - at 3.2m it triggers the HGV sensors on french tolls, meaning you need to press the intercom button, and most of the time they charge you as class 2. the Aclass version comes in at 3.0m so should sneak under the sensors.
front view - not being an Aclass you don't get a picture window.
Seats - the standard captains chairs (from a special italian manufacturer) weren't comfortable on long journeys, they have been replace with some ford Puma (ebay and local) leather chairs, which are much better
Underfloor access - newer motorhomes have hatches in the floor to access compartments in the double floor, we can only access the double floor storage from the outside.
Satellite dish - i wouldn't have chosen it, and haven't used it ever! we don't even have a TV, some we looked at had 3 tvs! why do you need 3 tvs in a space smaller than some living rooms?
we have the blue interior - pictures are not ours but gives you the idea
this runs under the whole of the motorhome:
ours has a door both sides:
Edited by custardkid on Saturday 13th February 12:35
So a bit about our adventures so far:
we have had several winter trips to snowdonia and south wales walking and mountainbiking
mountain biking near Machynlleth with some friends
By the sea in Brittany
Awesome Aire in the Rioja region with a natural hot spa "Arnedillo"
A very wet Juno Beach
an official Aire but the 747 is a bit long for the car sized spaces
Amongst the vines in St Emillion - with Dads old Kontiki
we have had several winter trips to snowdonia and south wales walking and mountainbiking
mountain biking near Machynlleth with some friends
By the sea in Brittany
Awesome Aire in the Rioja region with a natural hot spa "Arnedillo"
A very wet Juno Beach
an official Aire but the 747 is a bit long for the car sized spaces
Amongst the vines in St Emillion - with Dads old Kontiki
Hi
Hopefully some one gets something useful from it
Saw your post about Harry
Looks fun and they do get a good rep. And there is something about the big old merc hymers .
Some good friends swapped their T4 for a 1982 Talbot "classic layout" hymer
It is well made, but they have had mechanical and electrical issues like you would with a similar age car.
Good point about the length
We are a touch over 8m and are just about the max you'll get away with on the best European campsites and Aires, anything longer and you won't squeeze onto the best spots on the beach front etc
The newer tag burstners look lovely, but are too long at 9m
Hymer do a sprinter based 4x4 Aclass at c7.8m, ideal for those wet Welsh field excursions... The only problem is they are c£100k!
Hopefully some one gets something useful from it
Saw your post about Harry
Looks fun and they do get a good rep. And there is something about the big old merc hymers .
Some good friends swapped their T4 for a 1982 Talbot "classic layout" hymer
It is well made, but they have had mechanical and electrical issues like you would with a similar age car.
Good point about the length
We are a touch over 8m and are just about the max you'll get away with on the best European campsites and Aires, anything longer and you won't squeeze onto the best spots on the beach front etc
The newer tag burstners look lovely, but are too long at 9m
Hymer do a sprinter based 4x4 Aclass at c7.8m, ideal for those wet Welsh field excursions... The only problem is they are c£100k!
Hi
Hopefully some one gets something useful from it
Saw your post about Harry
Looks fun and they do get a good rep. And there is something about the big old merc hymers .
Some good friends swapped their T4 for a 1982 Talbot "classic layout" hymer
It is well made, but they have had mechanical and electrical issues like you would with a similar age car.
Good point about the length
We are a touch over 8m and are just about the max you'll get away with on the best European campsites and Aires, anything longer and you won't squeeze onto the best spots on the beach front etc
The newer tag burstners look lovely, but are too long at 9m
Hymer do a sprinter based 4x4 Aclass at c7.8m, ideal for those wet Welsh field excursions... The only problem is they are c£100k!
Hopefully some one gets something useful from it
Saw your post about Harry
Looks fun and they do get a good rep. And there is something about the big old merc hymers .
Some good friends swapped their T4 for a 1982 Talbot "classic layout" hymer
It is well made, but they have had mechanical and electrical issues like you would with a similar age car.
Good point about the length
We are a touch over 8m and are just about the max you'll get away with on the best European campsites and Aires, anything longer and you won't squeeze onto the best spots on the beach front etc
The newer tag burstners look lovely, but are too long at 9m
Hymer do a sprinter based 4x4 Aclass at c7.8m, ideal for those wet Welsh field excursions... The only problem is they are c£100k!
Spuffington
surprised you had engine issues on the 416, would have thought the Mercs were robust regardless of age?
roof lights arn't too bad. swapped out the Aircon unit (weights a ton and we rarely use the mains) and opaque roof light for two clear mini Hekis, or are they besopoke on the hymer?
how come the Superbrig didn't workout, Italian build quality?
share some interior pics of Harry.
As you say its easy to want the latest and greatest, but as long as everything works they haven't changed much in the last 30 years (or more), if anything they have got a bit too bling. its all about the adventures to new places and a simpler (but comfortable) out door life
surprised you had engine issues on the 416, would have thought the Mercs were robust regardless of age?
roof lights arn't too bad. swapped out the Aircon unit (weights a ton and we rarely use the mains) and opaque roof light for two clear mini Hekis, or are they besopoke on the hymer?
how come the Superbrig didn't workout, Italian build quality?
share some interior pics of Harry.
As you say its easy to want the latest and greatest, but as long as everything works they haven't changed much in the last 30 years (or more), if anything they have got a bit too bling. its all about the adventures to new places and a simpler (but comfortable) out door life
The UK is different to Europe...
In the UK many camp sites are on farms or on the outskirts of towns, so you have to drive.
so in some sense a caravan makes much more sense in the UK
In Europe they tend to be better set up with campsites or Motorhome Aires at the attraction, so there is minimal travel.
We tend to shop enroute (we have a freezer) once there its ether walk/bike or bus
we also tend not to stay 1-3 nights before moving off
Pitching up is nothing more than switching off the engine, turning gas on and in the summer getting the deck chairs out.
you are right a T5 is more "handy" but..
our thought process started with a T5 or Vito LWB conversion, but to do it well its £16k+, and with a dog, Mountain bikes and wet Welsh weather they suddenly feel cramped.... and are less family friendly
so you then start thinking Sprinter / Iveco daily conversion, but once you get that big you may as well get a proper motorhome with shower, central heating etc then cost and driveability don't vary that much with the length of the motorhome.
Even with the 8m long beast we are not confined to the country side.
On the Beach in Gijon... 15min walk into the town centre.
In the centre of Leon (next to the posh Parador hotel) 5-10 walk to the cathedral
On Lake Garda (not my pic, but have been a similar camp site)
In the UK many camp sites are on farms or on the outskirts of towns, so you have to drive.
so in some sense a caravan makes much more sense in the UK
In Europe they tend to be better set up with campsites or Motorhome Aires at the attraction, so there is minimal travel.
We tend to shop enroute (we have a freezer) once there its ether walk/bike or bus
we also tend not to stay 1-3 nights before moving off
Pitching up is nothing more than switching off the engine, turning gas on and in the summer getting the deck chairs out.
you are right a T5 is more "handy" but..
our thought process started with a T5 or Vito LWB conversion, but to do it well its £16k+, and with a dog, Mountain bikes and wet Welsh weather they suddenly feel cramped.... and are less family friendly
so you then start thinking Sprinter / Iveco daily conversion, but once you get that big you may as well get a proper motorhome with shower, central heating etc then cost and driveability don't vary that much with the length of the motorhome.
Even with the 8m long beast we are not confined to the country side.
On the Beach in Gijon... 15min walk into the town centre.
In the centre of Leon (next to the posh Parador hotel) 5-10 walk to the cathedral
On Lake Garda (not my pic, but have been a similar camp site)
France is well set up for motorhomes for two reasons: (this may not be 100% factually correct)
1) by law you are allowed to park your car anywhere and sleep in it as long as you remain with in its confines. ie dont get the deck chairs and washing line out, so you could happily camp on the Champs Elyesse. however due to the popularity of motorhomes there are starting to be some restrictions on this, and the creation of specific motorhome aires at popular places like beaches.
2) by law each commune (bit like a parish) has to provide a camp site. so just about every village has one, they vary from the village green by a lake with a toilet and electric point, to full on camp sites with adjacent water parks.
from our experience
Sea side aires get busy in peak season, and these tend to be more carpark like.
in land lake or river side aires tend to be more prettier with more greenery and a rarely busy.
Its worth getting one of the books "all the aires" is good.
and we use the ASCII app for campsites
if you are getting a late crossing out (or early back) then there is a great aire in Boulogne sur mer (just north of town on D940), its very safe (although when we arrived at midnight the first time during the Calais unrest I was cautious!), its on the cliff top so has great views and is a short walk down to the main beach and the harbour area of the town. the Gendarms come to collect 5or6 euros in the morning. if you are heading south then go through the town to the motorway and you pass a big supermarket for cheap fuel and French supplies.
given its on the cliff tops it can get windy, and is popular on peak holiday times, but we've not been turned away yet
Spain is cheaper and the weather is better, but has fewer campsites and Aires tend to be carparks in industrial areas. (happy to be proved wrong if anyone knows of a good source of info)
..off to the Gower for a few days
1) by law you are allowed to park your car anywhere and sleep in it as long as you remain with in its confines. ie dont get the deck chairs and washing line out, so you could happily camp on the Champs Elyesse. however due to the popularity of motorhomes there are starting to be some restrictions on this, and the creation of specific motorhome aires at popular places like beaches.
2) by law each commune (bit like a parish) has to provide a camp site. so just about every village has one, they vary from the village green by a lake with a toilet and electric point, to full on camp sites with adjacent water parks.
from our experience
Sea side aires get busy in peak season, and these tend to be more carpark like.
in land lake or river side aires tend to be more prettier with more greenery and a rarely busy.
Its worth getting one of the books "all the aires" is good.
and we use the ASCII app for campsites
if you are getting a late crossing out (or early back) then there is a great aire in Boulogne sur mer (just north of town on D940), its very safe (although when we arrived at midnight the first time during the Calais unrest I was cautious!), its on the cliff top so has great views and is a short walk down to the main beach and the harbour area of the town. the Gendarms come to collect 5or6 euros in the morning. if you are heading south then go through the town to the motorway and you pass a big supermarket for cheap fuel and French supplies.
given its on the cliff tops it can get windy, and is popular on peak holiday times, but we've not been turned away yet
Spain is cheaper and the weather is better, but has fewer campsites and Aires tend to be carparks in industrial areas. (happy to be proved wrong if anyone knows of a good source of info)
..off to the Gower for a few days
Edited by custardkid on Thursday 25th February 10:07
Good weekend, perfect start to the season
front heater was grumbling after its layup since September, but both the front rear thermostat truma's kept the van toasty whilst we enjoyed some good, clear & windy cliff top walks with the dog.
it was good to know the 2 leisure Batteries last the 3 nights even with the two thermostats on most of the time, the longest most we've done before is 2 nights before driving somewhere else (or its been summer which is obviously less intensive)
fridge never kicked in on gas, tried to manually light the pilot light but no success, so will call the local Dometic man, hopefully it'll be less than the £800 for a new fridge!
like cars, i'm sure they like being used, last year we went away November, December & January... bad form this year!
front heater was grumbling after its layup since September, but both the front rear thermostat truma's kept the van toasty whilst we enjoyed some good, clear & windy cliff top walks with the dog.
it was good to know the 2 leisure Batteries last the 3 nights even with the two thermostats on most of the time, the longest most we've done before is 2 nights before driving somewhere else (or its been summer which is obviously less intensive)
fridge never kicked in on gas, tried to manually light the pilot light but no success, so will call the local Dometic man, hopefully it'll be less than the £800 for a new fridge!
like cars, i'm sure they like being used, last year we went away November, December & January... bad form this year!
oblio said:
Was that Carreglwyd? Looks nice.
I see you are on a the roadway bit (good idea in winter with soft ground) but did you see if any of the EHU pitches had hardstanding at all?
Cheers
Yes carreglwydI see you are on a the roadway bit (good idea in winter with soft ground) but did you see if any of the EHU pitches had hardstanding at all?
Cheers
We were the only people in the lower two fields, so no problems being on the road.
No hard standing
Electric only in the top fields
Ground was relatively firm so don't think you'd get stuck, just park front wheels down hill with some getaway strips under the front wheels (assuming it's a fiat!)
Edited by custardkid on Monday 29th February 21:14
chopper602 said:
Last year was the first time we haven't set foot in France (prices have been astronomical, for eating out and supermarket shopping) for as long as I remember. Took North Sea Ferry to Rotterdam and headed East. After Berlin, we went into Poland (and the town of Torun). Then headed south into Czech Republic before heading west, back into Germany on the way home.
Even Germany was a lot cheaper than France, Poland and Czech more so (fillet steak in Poland - about £8!).
Agree there is more to life than France Even Germany was a lot cheaper than France, Poland and Czech more so (fillet steak in Poland - about £8!).
Planned to go to Croatia last September, but headed south instead. I'm sure it would have been fine, but they closed the boarder with Austria when we were supposed to be coming back... Which would have been inconvenient but a good excuse to extend the holiday!
Maybe next year..
Bit of an update
we've been to Afan mtb centre a few times & bike park wales.
other than that in June we went down to Limoges to see family, then across to the Clermont-Ferrand and back.
a couple of highlights
the lovely spot in a tiny village called Tourzel Ronzieres just south of St Nectaire (of cheese fame)
great view across the valley and the flat top hills caused by the ancient volcanoes.
tried to pay at the Marie, only to be told it was free.
just don't follow the satnav, as it took us over the top of a mountain on a dirt road, then down through the steep twisty streets of the village, where as our route out was on smooth two lane roads
on the way to our next stop we made sure we stopped at Pully Fume for some previsions
the other highlight was Treteau just north of Vichy, pleasant spot in quiet village, with a bakery.
Have also added some draws in the underfloor to make the space a bit more useful, and modified the bike racking - will try to do an update on that too
Again a faultless trip in the 747
next rip is the Alps before the lifts close
we've been to Afan mtb centre a few times & bike park wales.
other than that in June we went down to Limoges to see family, then across to the Clermont-Ferrand and back.
a couple of highlights
the lovely spot in a tiny village called Tourzel Ronzieres just south of St Nectaire (of cheese fame)
great view across the valley and the flat top hills caused by the ancient volcanoes.
tried to pay at the Marie, only to be told it was free.
just don't follow the satnav, as it took us over the top of a mountain on a dirt road, then down through the steep twisty streets of the village, where as our route out was on smooth two lane roads
on the way to our next stop we made sure we stopped at Pully Fume for some previsions
the other highlight was Treteau just north of Vichy, pleasant spot in quiet village, with a bakery.
Have also added some draws in the underfloor to make the space a bit more useful, and modified the bike racking - will try to do an update on that too
Again a faultless trip in the 747
next rip is the Alps before the lifts close
Yes another one on the way - still too much to see & do!
hoping to head to Slovenia & Croatia this summer
Parents in-law have taken a share in the motorhome so will be newer, but a bit smaller and <3.5t
(which will be good for speed & tolls, bad for payload)
Just need to wait for it to arrive - will share details when its here!
hoping to head to Slovenia & Croatia this summer
Parents in-law have taken a share in the motorhome so will be newer, but a bit smaller and <3.5t
(which will be good for speed & tolls, bad for payload)
Just need to wait for it to arrive - will share details when its here!
Gassing Station | Tents, Caravans & Motorhomes | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff