Would you work in F1?

[Otispunkmeyer]

A question I often ask myself; "would I actually like to work in F1?"

I have the interest; I have watched F1 since about 95 when I was 10 years old. I believe I posses the aptitude; 1st class MEng + a PhD and was offered a job by Ilmore in May last year but in the end turned it down.

I turned it down because I just wasn't sure it was what I wanted. The money was merely average, but they wanted a pound of flesh and then some. Plus the location just didn't fit at the time, there would have been no work for my OH.

It seems to me, like its something you do out of sheer love. The money doesn't matter so long as you can put a roof over your head and you won't mind spending a lot of time in the office or at the factory. Do I really love F1 that much, do I have the passion?! To add, I once was able to speak to an old hand aero guy from McLaren. The picture he painted was one of relativlely low pay, slow progression and stuck in an office running CFD simulations on bits of front wing endlessly.

A friend also worked at Woking for the F1 team and described a very sterile, anodyne environment where you couldn't even have so much as a few loose sheets of paper on your desk. In Mark Webber's recent book, he painted a pretty bleak picture of what is was like to work at Williams F1, saying everyone looked glum and that he didn't know a single person who would say working there was a happy existence. Whilst he said RedBull was much better, the inter-team politics sounded like it would make for a very stressed out environment.

So I don't know.... would you? unless you're at the very top, pay doesn't sound great, long hours, potential for huge stress (at my Ilmore interview they were very open about how frequently they will pull all nighters or be in the office all weekend on race weekends trouble shooting). To me it sounds like you have to have an intense love and passion for motor-racing to be able to put up with the bad bits.

[Otispunkmeyer]

Also, whilst I guess your job is more-safe at the well supported teams. I imagine those working for teams lower down in the pecking order always have job security looming into the equation as well. I feel for the chaps at lotus, who on top of having to deal with all the stresses of running a race team, must do so whilst worrying whether they'll still have a job next race and whether their pay cheque will arrive!

[Otispunkmeyer]

Muzzer79 said:

lee_fr200 said:

I think the drivers are way overpaid but how about everyone else I can't see a mechanic on a very low wage but maybe I'm wrong.

The drivers are paid according to demand.

Most nowadays actually don't earn that much. I'm talking the Maldonado, Verstappen, Sainz & Ericssons of this world. Either because they're young and inexperienced, or they get paid by their sponsors.

There's then a middle bracket of reasonable earners - low-ish millions per year, in which I include Button, Massa, Ricciardo, Rosberg and probably now Raikkonen.

Only the top few get multi-multi million deals - Hamilton, Alonso and Vettel are currently the only ones in this bracket I think.

It's easy to say they get too much, but there's very few people in the world who can drive an F1 car fast and even fewer who are the fastest.

It's a weirdly odd swing though don't you think? At one end you have Hamilton on £150m for 3 years and at the other you have guys (who arguably are not as good as Hamilton) paying, either from personal wealth or big state sponsors, to drive a car. (granted those with big state sponsors are probably being paid in a roundabout way, just not by the team).

[Otispunkmeyer]

Derek Smith said:

Otispunkmeyer said:

A question I often ask myself; "would I actually like to work in F1?"

I have the interest; I have watched F1 since about 95 when I was 10 years old. I believe I posses the aptitude; 1st class MEng + a PhD and was offered a job by Ilmore in May last year but in the end turned it down.

I turned it down because I just wasn't sure it was what I wanted. The money was merely average, but they wanted a pound of flesh and then some. Plus the location just didn't fit at the time, there would have been no work for my OH.

It seems to me, like its something you do out of sheer love. The money doesn't matter so long as you can put a roof over your head and you won't mind spending a lot of time in the office or at the factory. Do I really love F1 that much, do I have the passion?! To add, I once was able to speak to an old hand aero guy from McLaren. The picture he painted was one of relativlely low pay, slow progression and stuck in an office running CFD simulations on bits of front wing endlessly.

A friend also worked at Woking for the F1 team and described a very sterile, anodyne environment where you couldn't even have so much as a few loose sheets of paper on your desk. In Mark Webber's recent book, he painted a pretty bleak picture of what is was like to work at Williams F1, saying everyone looked glum and that he didn't know a single person who would say working there was a happy existence. Whilst he said RedBull was much better, the inter-team politics sounded like it would make for a very stressed out environment.

So I don't know.... would you? unless you're at the very top, pay doesn't sound great, long hours, potential for huge stress (at my Ilmore interview they were very open about how frequently they will pull all nighters or be in the office all weekend on race weekends trouble shooting). To me it sounds like you have to have an intense love and passion for motor-racing to be able to put up with the bad bits.

That's a very depressing post. But then, I didn't expect it to be fun at such a high level.

I was a guest in the pits for a number of LMES races and the atmosphere was very supportive. The mechanics seemed to want to help their colleagues and no one seemed afraid to admit they needed help, always a good sign I think. I enjoyed it. One thing which surprised me was how excited the guys got in the races. When a car expired during the race, the atmosphere went well down and no one seemed to try and get it back up, despite there being two cars. When one car was taken out by a dreadfully driven Audi at the Bus Stop, the concern of the guys sent shivers down my spine, and then, when the report came back of all OK, they got on with their work as if nothing had happened.

It was very exciting. The only ones who threw a strop or weren't interested in the team as much as themselves, were the drivers.

I wouldn't want to do it though. All that hard work, all that expertise, and then they hand the cars over to egotistical idiots who drive it into the barriers and blame a 'sudden odd sensation with the steering'. Yes, mate, you were driving over stones.

I guess WEC and LMES are sorta in the same realm? In Webber's book the difference between how people and teams behave in WEC is wildly different to his experience in F1. It sounded like there is more concern for each other across teams. More camaraderie. In fact a cool point was on Porsches return to Le Mans, Audi won. Porsche guys went down to the Audi garage to congratulate them and the Audi team gave Porsche a bit of a standing ovation instead, recognising their achievement in the first Le Mans back despite not winning. Very sporting. But then Le Mans really is an extreme test of man and machine, everyone has to have everyone elses back to get through it.

[Otispunkmeyer]

ukaskew said:

My neighbour was a mechanic for a middle of the pack team for a number of years (would also be a wheel changer during the race), apparently the travelling really takes its toll after the novelty of the first year or two. As soon as a job back in the factory came up he went for it...he's happy now! I haven't seen his payslip, but he's very comfortable.

I also used to hear a lot from an IT guy at Brawn/Mercedes, very similar stories regarding the travelling, exhaustion and moral (even for a championship winning team) for the long fly-away stints.

Edited by ukaskew on Monday 5th October 22:11

Regarding pay, Merc High Performance engines lot down Northampton way have some really good per win bonus money. Everyone gets a nice little pot per race win, slightly smaller pots for second and third and it goes not just for the works team, but those running customer engines as well. With Mercedes mopping up a lot of 1-2's, bank accounts were looking plum! They've designed and built the best engines and its winning races hand over fist (or was last year at least) so its well deserved!

[Otispunkmeyer]

citizensm1th said:

Otispunkmeyer said:

Did you do your PhD at Loughborough?

Yes I did! How did you know/guess?


BTW, thank you all (so far) for the sensible posts. I was worried it would be derailed at some point. Thanks too to those who have worked or are still working in/for F1 and have chimed in with their experiences; very useful insights. Good luck to those guys getting interviewed hope you get the jobs you want!

Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Tuesday 6th October 22:52

[Otispunkmeyer]

lauda said:

dazm said:

Interesting stuff

I can't begin to imagine which team it is you might work for

Does their F1 car turn into a lawn mower on a certain new advert for the engine supplier?

[Otispunkmeyer]

citizensm1th said:

Otispunkmeyer said:

citizensm1th said:

Otispunkmeyer said:

Did you do your PhD at Loughborough?

Yes I did! How did you know/guess?


BTW, thank you all (so far) for the sensible posts. I was worried it would be derailed at some point. Thanks too to those who have worked or are still working in/for F1 and have chimed in with their experiences; very useful insights. Good luck to those guys getting interviewed hope you get the jobs you want!

Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Tuesday 6th October 22:52

I have a friend who did his PhD at Loughborough on the use of a turbo to scavenge exhaust gases to increase fuel efficiency ,He had a interview with ilmore but turned them down to work for JLR instead.

He also likes to shoot white stuff at other men at the weekends (if you get that reference we do know each other)

I know exactly who you're on about. We had the same supervisors. Turbo-Discharging was the name given to that particular idea I believe! I spoke to him (over FB mind) not too long ago about said shooting white stuff at people for something to do for a 30th birthday bash.

Trying to think who you are now...!

Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Thursday 8th October 10:25

Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Thursday 8th October 10:27