RE: Toyota GT 86: £24,995
Friday 3rd February 2012
As you'll have gathered from Harris's first drive earlier in the week the excitement about the Toyota GT86 - and its Subaru BRZ twin - appears to be well deserved. One number that hadn't been confirmed up til now was the price, but Toyota has confirmed what we thought and announced a basic price of £24,995 for when sales start in June.
How much for this much fun? £25K it seemsPricing is always a lively topic of conversation on PH, so we'll leave you to the number crunching but, to give you some inspiration, we've dug out some pricing on likely rivals.
Toyota GT86: £24,995
Toyota blinks first and confirms GT86 price - your move, Subaru
No word yet on what you'll get in that price, but the bits we're interested in - the rear-driven, limited-slip diff chassis, 200hp Subaru-donated boxer four, compact size and lively handling - are all standard.
How much for this much fun? £25K it seems
A VW Scirocco in comparable 210hp 2.0-litre form starts at £24,960 though you can get cheaper 1.4 variants too. The GT86 does undercut the equivalent 211hp Audi TT 2.0 TFSI (£27, 140) by a useful margin while its nearest rear-driven equivalent would be the BMW 1 Series Coupe, which costs £27,115 in 218hp 125i M Sport guise. You can get a 170hp 120i too - £22,650 in Sport or £25,560 in M Sport.
Other alternatives? A 184hp Mini Cooper S Coupe starts at a more reasonable £19,775 or £23,795 in 211hp JCW form. Or you could have a Peugeot RCZ - £23,595 for the 200hp petrol turbo.
All very interesting, but the one price we're really waiting for is Subaru's...
Discussion
Tiger Tim said:
What were the Corollas rivals back in the day though? The GT86 was meant to be a dirivetive of a boring economical hatch and therefore would have had a fairly budget initial cost.
Problem is, this is marketed against TT's, 1 Series and other premium coupe's and that's how it's justifying its price. That doesn't make sense to me...
Sounds like the idea originally was from some excited and passionate, Japanese RWD car obsessive and ended up being diluted until it's forced to be what was never intended.
Balance-sheet Vs the dream.
Not proof read as I can't be arsed (I'm working) so do one if the above is grammatically wrong :P
It's not marketed against TTs and 1 serieses. It's not a premium coupe and is not promoted as such.Problem is, this is marketed against TT's, 1 Series and other premium coupe's and that's how it's justifying its price. That doesn't make sense to me...
Sounds like the idea originally was from some excited and passionate, Japanese RWD car obsessive and ended up being diluted until it's forced to be what was never intended.
Balance-sheet Vs the dream.
Not proof read as I can't be arsed (I'm working) so do one if the above is grammatically wrong :P
It seems 100% pure to the original concept. They never promised anything more than a modestly powerful, light, RWD, affordable and interesting car. That's what they've given us.
On the topic of 370Z discounts, don't forget the Nissan has been out for a few years now and while it was a car a lot of people looked forward to, it didn't have the sort of anticipation, hype and almost unanimously positive reviews that the GT-86 has. The Toyota is brand new, is only coming in limited numbers and there seems to be a very strong sense of anticipation for it - the speed at which this thread and every other GT-86 thread has grown shows that. I suspect in a few years when there's something newer and shinier to tempt people Toyota (and Subaru) will need to think about discounting, but I think demand will outstrip supply for the first year at least.
Criticising it for not being powerful enough, fancy enough, or whatever is valid if what you want isn't what Toyota are offering, because that's a subjective opinion. Criticising the price isn't valid because 1) it is on every obective measure, good value and 2) it has no directly comparable competitors. It is typical of this site for people assume to "If I don't like it, no one else does". We may look down on people who drive mundane, boring, poor value (in our terms) cars but that misses the point that most people aren't fussed if their car is mundane or boring. Similarly, some people seem to be looking down on potential GT-86 owners as "why have you bought that, it's not a [insert some random alternative]", which misses the point that perhaps they want a new, small, light, affordable £25k RWD coupe, and if they do, then there's not much choice but to buy a GT 86. Likewise, comparing any new car with a used car on a like-for-like basis is insane.
Criticising it for not being powerful enough, fancy enough, or whatever is valid if what you want isn't what Toyota are offering, because that's a subjective opinion. Criticising the price isn't valid because 1) it is on every obective measure, good value and 2) it has no directly comparable competitors. It is typical of this site for people assume to "If I don't like it, no one else does". We may look down on people who drive mundane, boring, poor value (in our terms) cars but that misses the point that most people aren't fussed if their car is mundane or boring. Similarly, some people seem to be looking down on potential GT-86 owners as "why have you bought that, it's not a [insert some random alternative]", which misses the point that perhaps they want a new, small, light, affordable £25k RWD coupe, and if they do, then there's not much choice but to buy a GT 86. Likewise, comparing any new car with a used car on a like-for-like basis is insane.
cyman said:
i think they have missed a trick they could of made a coupe for the mass market that appealed to the petrolheads that its aimed at a lot more. they just needed to pitch the price point a little lower and make the power a little higher than those around it say 240-250bhp and they would of been onto a winner. instead they have just made another hyundai coupe an ok looking car that handles ok but no better than any other car around the same money and goes ok but doesnt set the world alight.
if i had 25k to spend on a coupe i would be looking at 2nd hand porsche caymans that really would put a smile on my face everytime i got in it
It'd be much better if it had 500bhp and cost 62p, too.if i had 25k to spend on a coupe i would be looking at 2nd hand porsche caymans that really would put a smile on my face everytime i got in it
flatline84 said:
Sorry to piss on the bonfire but for 25 grand and leather/metallic added in and probably very little discount its priced on par with a 370Z with 10 miles on the odo, and should be judged as such.
Yes its a brilliant car but
A, Its ugly
2, its not cheap sorry
3, the 370Z is in another division performancewise
The right car at the right time but priced 5.000 too high for what it offers
A - That's a subjective opinion, not an objective fact. I think it looks good. The 370Z looks good in a squashed way too.Yes its a brilliant car but
A, Its ugly
2, its not cheap sorry
3, the 370Z is in another division performancewise
The right car at the right time but priced 5.000 too high for what it offers
B - It might not be cheap but compared to its most direct competitors - of which we might say the 370Z is one - it's competitive.
C - The GT86 is in another division handling-wise and costs-to-run wise.
Ghostbhp said:
agree with this man! however who the hell is it aimed at ?!
I'm glad you don't run the product planning dept. of Toyota! Just because you don't like it, it doesn't mean no one else does.If you must know, so far as I'm concerned, it's aimed at me. I have a reasonable budget and want a fun, interesting car that is reliable and not ruinously expensive to run. I don't want a hot hatch. I don't want a second hand car. Why is this so difficult to understand?
braddo said:
Anyone know when the first drives will be available?
I am a little annoyed as I've signed up twice with their website asking to be informed but all I've had is a load of brochures about Avensises, Aygos, Land Cruisers and the like. Best bet, in my experience, is to go into a dealer. The guy I spoke to was very enthusastic, and very professional and has emailed to say that although he hasn't any more info than what is publically available yet, he's not forgotten.elementad said:
Had to chip in. Hate internet hearsay.
Not really to the above quoted
People go on about Autocars Porsche handling comparison but EVOs review of the 370z resulted in the last paragraph saying this before they gave it 4.5/5
"I was doubtful when they said that they wanted to take on the Cayman, but now I’ve driven the 370Z I think Porsche might well have a fight on its hands."
GT86 being lighter will be great fun to handle and i expect will be easier to handle which we've all discussed. Another division though? I dont know about that. Time will tell
I take the point, and no, I've not driven it (the GT86; I have the 370z). However the unanimous praise being heaped on the Toyota/Subaru leads to the conclusion that either it handles, or every motoring journalist the world is lying / on the take / under some kind of hypnotic mind control. Not really to the above quoted
People go on about Autocars Porsche handling comparison but EVOs review of the 370z resulted in the last paragraph saying this before they gave it 4.5/5
"I was doubtful when they said that they wanted to take on the Cayman, but now I’ve driven the 370Z I think Porsche might well have a fight on its hands."
GT86 being lighter will be great fun to handle and i expect will be easier to handle which we've all discussed. Another division though? I dont know about that. Time will tell
gmh23 said:
These recent articles on the GT86/BRZ have really highlighted how many numptys are on PH.
Indeed. I assumed that taking the time to sign up and post meant that you must have some passing knowledge of at least one or another aspect of cars, motoring, the automotive industry or whatever. I don't claim to be much of a mechanic, or even a brilliantly talented driver, but I do know that a fun, small, light, reasonably affordable-to run RWD coupe that is reliable and reasonably practical from one of the largest car manufacturers is not only a viable product from the marketing point of view, but in general terms "a good thing" for anyone who is interested in cars as more than a means to go from A to B.Tonberry said:
Too expensive. Not enough power.
Who is going to buy it?
If you want a track car, you buy a proper one.
If you want a 'sporty' road car, you buy a proper one.
23 years old if you're wondering and this doesn't interested my in the slightest. But then neither does the Civic Type R or any other of this type of vehicle (yes I know the Civic is FWD).
Boo.
You make the mistake of thinking everyone else is you. Who is going to buy it?
If you want a track car, you buy a proper one.
If you want a 'sporty' road car, you buy a proper one.
23 years old if you're wondering and this doesn't interested my in the slightest. But then neither does the Civic Type R or any other of this type of vehicle (yes I know the Civic is FWD).
Boo.
Olivera said:
The GT86 seems to be targeted at the driving enthusiast rather than the image concious. PH is populated with much of the enthusiast demographic, yet potential purchasers here seem to be thin on the ground.
Let me pose a question, is there a single PHer who has either pre-ordered or intends to purchase a GT86?
Yes.Let me pose a question, is there a single PHer who has either pre-ordered or intends to purchase a GT86?
I suspect that in 10 or 15 years time, this car will be considered a classic of it's era. Typically those cars which assume 'classic' status are those which have an element of the 'marmite' about them - some people just don't get them, while others love them to death.
Moving the debate on, some may like this, others may not. I don't understand why those who don't like this are working so hard to find reasons not to like it though. I mean, I don't want a RS Focus, or a GTR, but if I see one I can think to myself "that's a nice car", and hope that it's owned by someone who loves it as a driving machine and not merely as a status symbol. Similarly, I'd not have a Mk1 MX5 but if I see one, I know its driven by a proper enthusiast.
Moving the debate on, some may like this, others may not. I don't understand why those who don't like this are working so hard to find reasons not to like it though. I mean, I don't want a RS Focus, or a GTR, but if I see one I can think to myself "that's a nice car", and hope that it's owned by someone who loves it as a driving machine and not merely as a status symbol. Similarly, I'd not have a Mk1 MX5 but if I see one, I know its driven by a proper enthusiast.
StevieB said:
I cant understand the negative comments on this thread. Its a 25 grand sports coupe with rear wheel drive, a high revving naturally aspirated engine, not many gizmos and its light. Surely thats what a lot of us were hankering after? I actually think it looks great and I think the price/performance ratio is just right. The whole idea of this car was something that wasnt ballistically quick, grippy and over-complicated. People are totally missing the point. Its also not as if its gonna slide off the road either. It has up to date traction control and decent modern tyres, so its hardly an E30 BMW with trailing arms suspension, it it?
Just be glad Toyota and Subaru have made a RWD alternative to the BMW/Mercs out there and stop moaning about it....
It's like being asked on a date by Katy Perry and turning her down cos you don't like boobs.Just be glad Toyota and Subaru have made a RWD alternative to the BMW/Mercs out there and stop moaning about it....
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