Justifying an "expensive" car purchase...
Discussion
Hi, I am looking to spend around £8,000-£12,000 on my next vehicle. This may not sound like a lot of money, but it certainly is a sizeable chunk for me, especially bearing in mind that my current car cost £2,500! At the moment I drive a 2001 Toyota MR2 Roadster. It's a lovely car but I need something bigger and better now. Something that's more practical, responsive, faster and all-round a step-up. I have therefore thoroughly considered the market and the following cars are on my list:
Porsche Boxster (986 or 987)
BMW E46 M3
Nissan 350Z
Lotus Elise S2
The problem is justifying spending up to £12k on a materialistic luxury. To be fair, the time is right as I have no mortgage, no commitments (other than a full-time job), a reasonable income and no g/f (Oh, woe is me!). So, if there was a time to own an ostentatious sports car then surely that time is now? I mean, I can always sell the car once I've scratched that itch.
I was just wondering what your opinions were on a situation that must be familiar to many Pistonheads? Maybe I'm asking the wrong crowd as cars are our passion, but it's worth getting feedback I think. I would probably get a loan of up to £8000 which would cost me about £250/month over 48 months. This is achievable with my currently earnings and excess. My sensible head says I should save for a mortgage instead, or spend the excess on holidays and experiences. The devil in me says I should buy my dream car and enjoy it whilst I can. What do you reckon?
Porsche Boxster (986 or 987)
BMW E46 M3
Nissan 350Z
Lotus Elise S2
The problem is justifying spending up to £12k on a materialistic luxury. To be fair, the time is right as I have no mortgage, no commitments (other than a full-time job), a reasonable income and no g/f (Oh, woe is me!). So, if there was a time to own an ostentatious sports car then surely that time is now? I mean, I can always sell the car once I've scratched that itch.
I was just wondering what your opinions were on a situation that must be familiar to many Pistonheads? Maybe I'm asking the wrong crowd as cars are our passion, but it's worth getting feedback I think. I would probably get a loan of up to £8000 which would cost me about £250/month over 48 months. This is achievable with my currently earnings and excess. My sensible head says I should save for a mortgage instead, or spend the excess on holidays and experiences. The devil in me says I should buy my dream car and enjoy it whilst I can. What do you reckon?
philmots said:
I used to buy cars at around 12k... I then got a mortgage and buy cars around half that. I have just as much fun in them, they're just a bit older and miley.
This is what I'm thinking. Could I not find a car that does what those in my list can without having to spend £12k?! Are there cars out there that I could get for £6k, for example, that are as good as a Boxster, M3, 350Z, etc... (Yes, I know a Boxster can be bought for £6K, but they'll be pretty dodgy won't they?).marcosgt said:
Not if you've got one 
Who are you trying to justify the purchase to? Yourself? If so, do you really want to buy a much better car?
If you don't just feel "I want that car and I can afford it", then why waste the money?
If someone else, it's a different matter
M.
I'm trying to justify it to myself. To be honest, I'm very careful with my money. Even when I'm buying a TV for around £250 I'll look for weeks and weeks for the very best deal I can get, and even then I'll hand my cash over reluctantly! There are days when I really want a better car and then there are days when I'm like "Hmm, it's just a bloody car!". I can afford to get a loan, service and insure all the cars in that list right now. That's not the problem. It's just whether or not I take the plunge!Who are you trying to justify the purchase to? Yourself? If so, do you really want to buy a much better car?
If you don't just feel "I want that car and I can afford it", then why waste the money?
If someone else, it's a different matter
M.
TTwiggy said:
You need something bigger and more practical, and you're considering an Eise?!? Methinks you are already lying to yourself about this potential purchase 
I've discussed what to replace my MR2 Mk3 with on Pistonheads in the past few weeks and many people have said that the Elise is actually far more practical! I do find that a little hard to believe mind! kambites said:
If you'll enjoy it enough, do it. Money has no absolute value beyond the pleasure it brings to the person who's spending it.
Personally I'd be looking at a mk3 MR2 for considerably less money, though.
I already own an MR2 Mk3! Personally I'd be looking at a mk3 MR2 for considerably less money, though.
And many Pistonheads have told me that an Elise is actually more practical than my little Toyota!LuS1fer said:
If you struggle to justify £12k to buy the car, you will most certainly struggle to justify the running costs of cars such as the M3 and Boxster if an unexpected bill arises.
Choose a car you can afford to have repaired if it goes wrong. Also bear in mind insurance and VEL costs and particularly tyres as some decent tyres may cost up to £1000 a set.
I'm not advocating one but as an example, the 2005 Mustang is now down to that level and you can service it youself using the blunt end of a fishfork so running costs are lower and depreciation is lower when you come to fund your next car. I'm sure there are other cars that fulfil this brief also but look at the big picture or understand you're taking a risk and it could end in tears.
Agreed. I've taken this all on-board already. I can afford to buy, service and insure these vehicles. The problem is justifying the purchase itself. It's a substantial amount. However, so many people these days buy cars on finance, for example. New car sales are growing all the time. A basic Ford Focus can cost more than £12k but nobody seems to question this purchase. Just look at how many new cars you see on the road every day. I refuse to believe the majority have bought this outright! So, if these people (many with families and mortgages to worry about too) can justify such elaborate expenses, why can't I?!?Choose a car you can afford to have repaired if it goes wrong. Also bear in mind insurance and VEL costs and particularly tyres as some decent tyres may cost up to £1000 a set.
I'm not advocating one but as an example, the 2005 Mustang is now down to that level and you can service it youself using the blunt end of a fishfork so running costs are lower and depreciation is lower when you come to fund your next car. I'm sure there are other cars that fulfil this brief also but look at the big picture or understand you're taking a risk and it could end in tears.
kambites said:
Marginally, yes. If you're not sure about whether to spend the money though, I'd stick with what you have. Personally, I think the MR2 is a better drivers' car than the 350Z, Boxster or 3-series and it's not a million miles behind the Elise.
Really? Wow, I'm surprised. Is there anything similar but slightly more practical that you could suggest?Shnozz said:
I've owned 2 of the cars you list, my ex had an E46 M3 so spent a lot of time driving one of those, and I've test driven a 350Z hardtop and roadster. I've also driven Mk2 and 3 MR2s.
I would save your money. You can have as much fun in a mk 3 MR2 as just about anything else on the road, at speeds less likely to get you nicked.
If you had the chunk of cash sat there perhaps I might hold a different view, but a loan for 4 years (when all sorts of things might change) is a lot of committment for not that much of an upgrade.
Oh, and running costs on both the Porker and the M3 are significant as has been mentioned. Can easily do £3k - £4k in a bad year.
I see your point. Regarding the loan - I should perhaps have mentioned that I don't intend to own this car for more than 2 years - just long enough to enjoy whilst I can without the worry of a mortgage, etc. The idea is that I get the loan which I suggest I'll pay off over 4 years. This ensures the monthly payments are manageable. However, as I only intend to own the car for a couple of years, I'd eventually sell it and use this money to pay off a chunk of the loan, and then my own cash to cover any early redemption fees and interest. So, the commitment would never be for the entire 4 years - at least that's the plan! Is my thinking flawed in any way? Obviously I could write the car off, but this is an extreme possibility *touch wood*.I would save your money. You can have as much fun in a mk 3 MR2 as just about anything else on the road, at speeds less likely to get you nicked.
If you had the chunk of cash sat there perhaps I might hold a different view, but a loan for 4 years (when all sorts of things might change) is a lot of committment for not that much of an upgrade.
Oh, and running costs on both the Porker and the M3 are significant as has been mentioned. Can easily do £3k - £4k in a bad year.
Shnozz said:
Don't disagree with either point. Enjoy your youth, but you dont need to spend £12k you dont have to do so. I sold up my car for about £12k when I was 20 to use as a deposit on a flat. Bought the flat about 21 and then at 22 I bought myself a TVR S for about £6k. Not a lot of money, but a lot of fun. Safely on the property ladder, I upgraded both my flat/houses and cars along the way but even at 33 now I don't spend big bucks on cars, whereas there are times I have pushed my borrowing a little uncomfortably in property. I'm happy to take that risk on property, whereas borrowing money for cars has never appealed. Chances are you could spend less and have just as much fun. For most cars there is a budget version (or just older..) that is as grin inducing 95% of the time of the expensive option.
You make some good points. How do so many people justify buying new cars though? They depreciate as soon as they roll off the forecourt! What I'm trying to get my head around is the purchase of, for example, a basic Ford Fiesta hatchback. Now, this'll cost about £9,795 new. So, you buy the car, drive it home and already it's lost £500-£1000. This is commonplace. Lots of people spend this sort of money on cars that are really not that special at all. So, why is buying a 6-year-old Porsche Boxster more of a risk or less appealing? It seems that it's one rule for sensible cars such as the Fiesta, another for exotica like a Porsche?Deva Link said:
People buy them because they want the comfort of a 3yr warranty, pretty cheap servicing costs (most cars need little more than an oil change every year) and, unless they do a lot of miles, probably no other maintenance costs.
Funnily enough, I feel the exact opposite of you. I don't mind paying a lot of money for a car but the thought of big bills terrifies me. It's a fear on the unknown.
You say you can afford to run the cars on your list but you can't afford to buy them without a substantial (compared to the price) loan. As someone else suggested, these cars can land you with big bills - what are you going to do then? One thing you should definitely do, if you're not heavily into DIY, is make sure you've got a trusty indie lined up to do service & repair. Finding the right indie could sway your choice of car.
I suppose that does sound strange, so let me just provide an example. Say I earn £2000/month (I don't, but just as an example!). I spend £500 rent/bills, £150 petrol, £200 food/essentials, £200 miscellaneous. This leaves me with £950. That £950 can then be spent on whatever. I therefore commit to a loan which costs me, say, £250/month over 4 years (I only intend to own the car for a couple of years, so would pay this off early) which still leaves me with £750 to cover anything else, including repairs, etc. Does that make sense or am I talking out of my aFunnily enough, I feel the exact opposite of you. I don't mind paying a lot of money for a car but the thought of big bills terrifies me. It's a fear on the unknown.
You say you can afford to run the cars on your list but you can't afford to buy them without a substantial (compared to the price) loan. As someone else suggested, these cars can land you with big bills - what are you going to do then? One thing you should definitely do, if you're not heavily into DIY, is make sure you've got a trusty indie lined up to do service & repair. Finding the right indie could sway your choice of car.
e? Shnozz said:
I'm not sure of the relevance to be honest.
What I'm trying to say (but not very well!) is that I'm sitting here worrying about whether to buy a car for up to £12k when hundreds of people, with far more financial commitments and therefore less disposable income, do this everyday without blinking an eye!
Debaser said:
I owned a 986S for 18 months, when I got it it was about 6 years old. Adding up all costs (including petrol for 1000 miles a month) it cost me £18000 to run.
It's the running costs of older performance cars you need to consider.
£18,000 to run a 986 S over 18 months?? Are you kidding me?! That's got to be a joke. Also, I do nowhere near 1000 miles/month. 500 max.It's the running costs of older performance cars you need to consider.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
I hate to be a bore but....never borrow money to buy a depreciating asset. (Unless it is necessary to make money, like a suit for an interview, or a taxi if you're a cab driver.)
Making this lifestyle choice may cause you pain in the short term, but in the medium to long term you will be far wealthier and probably end up with better cars than most, paid for in full!
But surely people are "borrowing" against a depreciating asset every time they purchase on finance? And there are lots of people who buy used cars having acquired a loan. Are these people just being foolish then? I'm not saying you're wrong, just questioning the difference. I do actually agree with what you're saying, but this is where people differ greatly. Some want to enjoy the here and now whereas others are happy to wait, play it safe, save and fully enjoy life later on.Making this lifestyle choice may cause you pain in the short term, but in the medium to long term you will be far wealthier and probably end up with better cars than most, paid for in full!
FLGirl said:
He doesn't have a house
But your last point is most salient. If you're comfortable with the monthly payments but it still feels like a 'spend', I'd hazard a guess that any big bills (hello Porsche...!) will start to become a burden. You sound a bit like me in terms of research and thinking things through, and what marred my ownership experience of a relatively expensive sports car (yes, you, Porsche, again!) was the nagging worry in my mind of something going wrong.
I hated parking in public places, potholed roads, being asked to drive through heavy traffic to give lifts etc... It was my only car, ergo very fun but impractical and eventually I began to resent running it.
Now I own 2 cars worth around 15% of what I spent on the expensive car, but I have at least 100% more fun! Ironically I now have the income to justify a much more expensive car, but it doesn't appeal in the slightest.
I don't regret it for a second, but my petrolhead lust is more than sated at the moment. You could buy a really fun car that you never have to worry about for less than £4k. If you need practical, buy a snotter for £500 and rag it around. Added bonus = some savings for the (eventual) mortgage and no need to "justify" your choices. More is not always better.
That said - early 996s are well within your budget and I'd (almost) recommend one
Yes! This is definitely something that would play on my mind. I've only ever owned cheap cars (sub-£3k) and so have never been particularly bothered when something goes wrong because it's not usually that expensive to fix. And then there's the fact that I now live in Bristol. Travelling around a city is a completely different kettle of fish to when I used to live in the countryside. Just last week some idiot drove straight into the back of my MR" and smashed the bumper up. I thought to myself; "Imagine if that'd been a Porsche?". I just think that the fear factor of driving an far more expensive care around this poorly-planned city, increased fuel, servicing and maitencance costs, it's going to be more hassle and worry than it's worth. Perhaps I'll never own the car of my dreams, but at least I won't being worrying about it everywhere I drive!But your last point is most salient. If you're comfortable with the monthly payments but it still feels like a 'spend', I'd hazard a guess that any big bills (hello Porsche...!) will start to become a burden. You sound a bit like me in terms of research and thinking things through, and what marred my ownership experience of a relatively expensive sports car (yes, you, Porsche, again!) was the nagging worry in my mind of something going wrong.
I hated parking in public places, potholed roads, being asked to drive through heavy traffic to give lifts etc... It was my only car, ergo very fun but impractical and eventually I began to resent running it.
Now I own 2 cars worth around 15% of what I spent on the expensive car, but I have at least 100% more fun! Ironically I now have the income to justify a much more expensive car, but it doesn't appeal in the slightest.
I don't regret it for a second, but my petrolhead lust is more than sated at the moment. You could buy a really fun car that you never have to worry about for less than £4k. If you need practical, buy a snotter for £500 and rag it around. Added bonus = some savings for the (eventual) mortgage and no need to "justify" your choices. More is not always better.
That said - early 996s are well within your budget and I'd (almost) recommend one
Having said that, I do pine after a Lotus Elise or Porsche Boxster all the same. And the sound of a BMW straight six is just magnificent... !
Rosscow said:
I'm sorry but I would never, ever buy an Alfa! Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff