£10-13k hero.....335/535 - is there anything else?

[mrdanbartlett]

Hi all,

Sorry for another 'what car' thread.....but I'm just wondering if I've ruled out everything, or if the PH'ers will suggest a gem I've missed?

I have a budget of £10-13k for a 4 door 'sensible' car, my requirements are as follows:

- 4/5 doors
- fast as possible, sub 14 0-100mph etc
- not insane running costs
- 25mpg+
- not £500 a year tax
- Stylish and good to drive
- A few toys/comfortable

It's to replace a BMW z4 3.0, which is about the minimum performance I can live with, so I don't want anything slower. Happy to remap the car for extra power, so I'm drawn towards a 335i/335d or 535d as this seems to tick all the boxes nicely. I'm not yet sure if a diesel is a good idea as I drive about 20 miles a day (10 each way) an then the odd longer trips at weekends, I've read lower miles/shorter trips isn't too healthy for a diesel and as I'm not doing huge miles I don't think the saving will be there on the fuel, currently my fuel costs are around £100-120 a month (700 miles I guess). I don't want anything that could be v v expensive to run so rules out something like an E39 m5.

I've ruled out:

- Audi S4 - £500+ tax, prob low 20's MPG.
- Insignia VXR - newer car but not sure I can deal with the Image, and probably not the best drivers car?
- Jags - prob too expensive to run a S-type R and the XF is a bit big/out of budget for one with sensible miles
- Impreza - can get a new shape one but I'm just not a fan of these, interior not the best, hate the styling etc.
- Merc CLS500's and other Merc's like that, seem v heavy so poor MPG, expensive to tax and service I imagine.

I think post remap I'll need 300bhp+ to not loose too much speed, so this also rules out alot of cars, I can't see anything better than the 335/535 out there - anything I've missed though?

Thanks all for any replies.

[mrdanbartlett]

Thanks all.

645i is not 4 door, a 545 I was tempted but they seem impossible to shift on, I think you'd struggle to get 25mpg from one unless you had a nice easy motorway drive (mines country lanes).

Well remember a £14k car is an asset, which yes will depreciate but it's over a period of time, £500 a year in tax is pure money you'll never see again. My Z4 has lost me £100 a month in depreciation over the 5 years I've had it, which seems pretty good, £500 a year tax is £41 a month JUST in tax. i.e £20 a month more than a £250 tax car, which over 5 years is £1250. So over a 5 year period you could buy a car costing £1250 more, which will prob retain £400 of that value.

Not being anal here, just trying to explain why for me I don't want to spend out £500 a year on tax, I prefer to buy the car and have sensible yearly costs where possible. I do alot of town driving so I worry a big engine will be VERY expensive in fuel.

[mrdanbartlett]

Yes they seem v v good for the money, and manual too. I wouldn't mind an auto but I think the 335 autos are the older box, the mid 2007 5 series gets the newer Sports box so if I went for a 535d I'd prob go for that LCI updated model.

That CLS 350 isn't a bad shout, but prob not fast enough, remap to maybe 280/300 but aren't they are 2+ ton? Vs sub 1700 for a 3 or 5 series with 350-380bhp. Also the new one makes the old one look v dated now, plus most seem to have the horrid wood dash.

[mrdanbartlett]

Wow thanks for so many replies.

CLS/C55 amg's - hmm its 367bhp but pretty heavy? A remapped 335/535 is 350-380 and lighter. Plus I imagine better on fuel, and probably cheaper to run. Maybe I should consider some TD's on these though.

FD2 type r - interesting as I'd never seen one of these, or knew it existed, but surely it's the 197bhp type R engine, which is going to be a bit gutless in a saloon, I think I need 300bhp min for a 1500kg+ car. My Z4 feels slow so I was hopeing for something at least as fast if not quicker.

VXR's - seem £20+, they must be pretty quick though and probably v reliable!

E36 m3 Saloon defo way to old for me, driven the 3dr 3.2 Evo though and it was a nice car.

130i too slow, and the 5dr 135i is alot of money still (shame as would prob be ideal).

Thanks all so much, so many good and varried replies, such a great forum.

[mrdanbartlett]

ITP said:

Well, sounds like you like your BMW's but for something a bit different you could try an alfa guilietta QV with an AHM (or similar quality) remap. You'll get a 2011 car for under 13k, plus 500 for the remap, and you'll have a modern 5dr car with plenty of toys, under 200 co2, so the cheap tax you want, 35mpg plus on a run but also 290bhp, which should get you the performance you need. Under rated car i reckon, certainly for the money. No powerslides though.....

Gosh now that's a rabbit out of the hat, risky ALfa reliability but this could be worth a little look too, interesting as on paper that's alot of car (age/miles etc for the price).

[mrdanbartlett]

Which mk? Will do some research on them though. thank you.

[mrdanbartlett]

Again I never knew that Passat existed in that form, 296bhp isn't too shabby and thats alot of car for the money, nice looking too.

Once again some great replies in this thread, I also didn't realise the CLS55 AMG was SC, I thought it was an NA lump! Interesting.....

Certainly got a few more cars to think about now.

[mrdanbartlett]

Would love one, my mate has one of these and its running 414bhp with a remap and is a lovely all rounder, but I'm pretty sure they are over £20k.

[mrdanbartlett]

yep £18k is the cheapest and has 82k on it, on here in the classifieds, they are from 2009 so fairly new.

[mrdanbartlett]

BMW residuals are pretty good too though

The audi is out of reach for now, especially as I'd want an auto, I don't want to over-stretch here, maybe thats one for the future. I guess the others deserve a look but 335i's are coming in v well priced now, have seen some amazing examples for £12k and good ones ub £10k.

[mrdanbartlett]

Scootersp said:

GS450H? Low tax,high ish mpg, good pace. Too barge like? Poor image?

yeah I saw them but looks huge/ugly, probably very very uninspiring to drive. Interior looked bland too.

[mrdanbartlett]

Possibly a bit too big for me, they are huuuuuuuuge. I park in a fairly small car park at the station.

[mrdanbartlett]

pimpchez said:

Depending if your not a badge snob .

MK2 Mazda 3 MPS.

Have a look at my readers cars for all the information you need.

Looked at those, unbeatable package but for me too 'hot hatch' like and not enough prestige etc, GF has a 2011 Mazda 2 and although its good the interior is a bit plasticy. Plus not a massive fan of the looks, too Jap for me, too much like an Impreza.

[mrdanbartlett]

new666uk said:

Have you thought about a lease?

Golf R, Merc AMG and BMW M135i all tick boxes and care sub £400 a month with options. Even less if you take standard spec.

I'm pretty against leasing, I like to own my cars outright, i.e so if my circumstances change then I have something of some value to sell and also I'm not paying our any money monthly etc. Plus I hate the concept of renting something, I'd rather lose a little each month (100-200) in deprecation than £300-400 on a lease. My commuting costs are already £650 a month (train/fuel/parking) so I don't want anything to add to that. I prefer to save monthly a little for my next car, rather than be behind by leasing if that makes sense.

[mrdanbartlett]

£300 a month over 3 years is £10k, the same as I can buy a car for which will be worth min £5k in 3 years time.

[mrdanbartlett]

The Crack Fox said:

"Hero" - at the risk of wandering off topic, we're talking about a car, right?

I just took cue from EVO magazines '10k hero's' articles.

Agree re the Alfa, they are nice but I've had mates with them and they generally are always trouble, I v v nearly bought a 147 GTA once, my mate got one and sold it to another mate - wasn't the best! They have prob had 5 alfas between them and they just are a little flakey, I had a Fiat coupe 20v turbo years ago and although it was nice it was the same 'worrying' feeling you get with the Alfa, generally needs a fair bit of TLC.

They do look/sound lovely though! I'd just not be keen on that v6 engine, its SO old in design, terrible on fuel, and will only be alot worse due to the SC.

[mrdanbartlett]

Uncle John said:

How about the mk 2 Focus ST facelift with the Mountune pack. Great cars, lots of character, look good, knocking on 300hp.

Now they are a great car on paper, I just do not like Fords, and I live in Essex so it would be a cliche! I drove a brand new ST recently and was v impressed with how responsive it was, no lag, v sharp etc, turning circle was utterly terrible but common with FWD I find. Nothing wrong with them and they have a proper engine in the 5 pot turbo those older ones, sound lovely, but just not my bag.

[mrdanbartlett]

Zero7 said:

Some nice car suggestions, although I think the OP wants and Auto... FD2 is an amazing point to point machine but again manual, and what a great manual, only car I made money on when I sold it.

OP - I'm in the same boat and will also be going for a 335i, just cant decide if there is much in it between the Auto and DCT box, the DCT I had in my M3 was stunning but I believe the one in the 335i is not the 'M' version.

What year are you looking at?

From my research I *THINK* the 3 series upto at least 09 had a pretty old skool auto, it's not terrible but not as good as a DCT or more modern box.

The e60 5 series started off with this same box, but then in mid 2007 they facelifted it and it got a fast auto box, with a much more modern looking shifter, quicker shift times etc. NOW.....there was also an option to have 'SAT - spots auto transmition' on these facelifited (LCI model) 5 series, which gave it a sport button on the gear surround and a slightly different looking shifter - apparently these are even faster to change and well worth seeking out for the keener driver.

To confuse things the 335d started with the 286bhp engine which the 5 series only got from the LCI 2007 facelift, the older 272bhp enghine is meant to be a fair bit less economical. Obv no issue if going for a 335i but I thought I'd point this out

If you find any more info do let me know! I drove a 535 2006 model and the auto was OK but not great, I'm waiting for find a local 2007 with SAT to drive. (missed one this weekend which sold within a few hours)

[mrdanbartlett]

Sorry to try and simplify that:

335i - 2005-2009 has the older traditional auto box (or manual)
335d - 2005-2009 has the older traditional auto box, but the newer more eco 286bhp engine
535d - 2005-2007 has the older traditional auto box, the older 272bhp less eco engine
535d - mid 2007 onwards has the newer improved auto box and the newer more eco 286bhp engine
535d - mid 2007 onwards with SAT option, newer improved auto box + even faster shift times in sport, and the newer more eco 286bhp engine

The non-SAT shift in the 2007 5 series is angled towards the driver and has no sports button on its surround, you CAN retro fit the SAT but it will cost you a few hundred and require some programming to get the sports mode unlocked.

No manual for the D engine - it has too much torque.

[mrdanbartlett]

Zero7 said:

I'm looking at 2009 models, will probably go for a vert as regardless of performance of the 335i it's not going to be an M3 for me and I've had a coupe of these in DCT variants, plus I like open top motoring, I too only do around 10 miles each way and would no way having another Diesel, takes too bloody long to warm up and it;s souless (A6 3.0tdi Le Mans).

Ok I think they had a newer auto box in 2009, not as good as say the VAG DCT but prob alot better than the old one .

I think they STILL had the older (cr*ppy looking) giear leaver though, so it's hard to tell what box it has.