RE: The £70K M3 CSL: Spotted
Tuesday 7th July 2015
How to spec the lightweight special? That's the quandary for today. Something with an RS, GT or CSL badge typically presents its buyer with a tricky decision: specify the options for everyday usability and early resale or play the long game, adhere to the purist ethos and hope that a stripped out spec becomes a collectors' item
Key part of the appeal still hereSat in the queue to drive the Goodwood hill in a Cayman GT4, its lack of air-conditioning seemed a very daft oversight. Yes, first world problems and all that. It's a no-cost option saving about 15kg, which may well be of benefit through Molecomb (or Maggots, say) but what about driving to the track? That time you may commute? Let's see how the commitment would hold out then.
Very covetable, but £70K covetable?CSLs have been going up and up since bottoming out at around £25K a few years back. There aren't any below £30,000 now with low mileage cars comfortably above £40,000; indeed, those hoping to grab a CS fairly cheaply will be disappointed as rising CSL values have pulled the former up to c. £20K.
The £70K M3 CSL: Spotted
It's not just E30 M3s climbing into the stratosphere...
Key part of the appeal still here
Hence a lot of no-cost options are indeed optioned back in. Trophy-Rs and the like tend to have the radios, navigation systems and air-con added back in; they're useful things to have. But what about when they're not fitted? Welcome to the 'no options' M3 CSL.
We've covered the lightweight M3 plenty on PH but this car is interesting as one of very few without air conditioning, a stereo, sat-nav, xenons and parking sensors. According to this advert that saved 35kg and contributed to a 7:50 'ring time. Even 12 years on that's damn fast.
Apparently there are just three such cars in the UK, the ones that adhere most strictly to the Coupe Sport Leichtbau mantra. One has been crashed and, allegedly, the owner of the other won't part with it for less than £100K. This one is up for sale at £70,000. Seventy grand!
Very covetable, but £70K covetable?
Obviously this CSL has been specced and purchased as an investment, especially given it has only covered 18,000 miles. Question is though, can CSLs continue to climb? Yes, E30 M3s are even up near £100,000 now but they are cars with genuine competition provenance and still the archetypal M3 to many. Could a £100K M3 CSL actually happen? With BMW committed to a turbocharged and hybrid future that gorgeous straight-six will of course hold considerable appeal.
Even if it does appreciate and make its next owner some money, it does seem a shame to have an M3 CSL solely as a collectors' item, sat barely used waiting to be recognised. Oh well. Should you just want a regular a M3 they're still loitering very temptingly at around £10K. Finally, let's hope whatever that M4 'Safety Car' actually is can deliver another six-cylinder special that M Division can be truly proud of.
BMW M3 CSL (E46)
Engine: 3,246cc 6-cyl
Transmission:
Power (hp): 360@7,900rpm
Torque (lb ft): 273@4,900rpm
MPG: 23.7
CO2: 287g/km
First registered:2004
Recorded mileage: 18,000
Price new: £58,000
Yours for: £69,995
View the advert here.
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Discussion
Nors said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I have always found it fascinating that when they launched the E46 CSL they struggled to sell them but now they are worth a fortune...what a positive turn around, very highly regarded too.
Only worth.... if someone actually pays....There's lots of crazy priced cars all over the place right now but lots aren't selling!
gigglebug said:
Exactly how much time would a 35kg saving make around the ring? For the sake of the added weight I'd rather have the kit myself, it is a road car after all
I think it is a fine line and agree it is a road car and it often makes me smile when manufacturers bang on about little weight savings when the kerbweight to start with is hardly featherweight anyway. Chapppers said:
From what I'm hearing / seeing - whilst the super high price ones are taking a while the mid-market is really quite furious at the moment, there have been a few cars sold within a couple of days of late.
I agree and mid market they seem seriously sort after and from reading on here/cutters all the owners/past owners of them have loved them and don't have a bad word to say about them as well.b14 said:
hot66 said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I have always found it fascinating that when they launched the E46 CSL they struggled to sell them but now they are worth a fortune...what a positive turn around, very highly regarded too.
same happened with the Porsche 964 RSAtmospheric said:
cerb4.5lee said:
RichwiththeS2000 said:
Maths says no. This is 10x the price of a standard M3. Is it 10x the car of a standard M3? No.
If you were being cruel you could say the standard M3 is actually better because its offered with a proper gearbox(manual/three pedals).Roma101 said:
b14 said:
hot66 said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I have always found it fascinating that when they launched the E46 CSL they struggled to sell them but now they are worth a fortune...what a positive turn around, very highly regarded too.
same happened with the Porsche 964 RSmoktabe said:
Too many seem to have an informed opinion on the CSL yet, in reality, not many posting have actually ever seen one let alone either driven or had a passenger ride.
Welcome to pistonheads 
I am sure its a great machine to drive and it could go around the ring in two minutes for me but it can never hide the fact the its still only a 3 series and is based on a boring standard car in the first place.I prefer something that is designed from the ground up as a sports car or track car rather than something tarted up...in fairness though with the money they fetch it certainly doesn't seem to bother the ones that own/buy them.
hot66 said:
cerb4.5lee said:
Welcome to pistonheads I am sure its a great machine to drive and it could go around the ring in two minutes for me but it can never hide the fact the its still only a 3 series and is based on a boring standard car in the first place.
I prefer something that is designed from the ground up as a sports car or track car rather than something tarted up...in fairness though with the money they fetch it certainly doesn't seem to bother the ones that own/buy them.
But you only 'think' this ...... as you admit you've not driven one .... I'm a massive porsche fan, air cooled and manual gearboxes only for me in what most would admit is a proper 'sports car' ( I have 2 parked next to my csl ) .... The CSL is no lesser a car and in some respects more fun. Even the gearbox ( which before driving one I'd convinced myself I wouldn't like) imho adds to the experience and I definitely wouldn't want a manual csl I am sure its a great machine to drive and it could go around the ring in two minutes for me but it can never hide the fact the its still only a 3 series and is based on a boring standard car in the first place.I prefer something that is designed from the ground up as a sports car or track car rather than something tarted up...in fairness though with the money they fetch it certainly doesn't seem to bother the ones that own/buy them.
The bottom line is the csl is an icon and a fantastic investment too and hats off to the guys/girls that have had the privilege of owning and experiencing them.
Mike Rainbird said:
Also at the end you will see me wait for my mate's stripped out E92, which is on 285 Cups all round, KW V3 Clubsports, APs and weighs only 1460kg. It is a DCT car as well, so is a proper weapon (I struggle LOL). Only lasts for 1 lap, as he runs low on fuel.
Enjoyed watching that 
The pesky E92 M3 showing its annoying side I see...terrible thirst and poor range!
CorvetteConvert said:
I owned a mint CSL E46 and it is one of the world's most over-rated cars. Like people have said, the 1385 kgs dry weight is only with no options. Most have ICE and air-con so 1425 kgs is much more realistic. Mine had those options and was not a particularly quick car unless you could keep the thing over 6,000 rpm the whole time. In real world driving asking for performance quickly was often difficult as the rubbish gearbox was too slow to react and on-paper slower cars would often get away. As a road car i did not rate it, although i did manage an 8 minute 2 seconds lap of the Nurburgring in it, which is pretty decent. The brakes were poor on a £60,000 sports coupe as well, very poor. Overpriced and over-valued now for me. £40,000 for a 12 year old one? Forget it, buy the best Nissan GTR you can get for the same price and hand the CSL it's arse on a plate.
I like this honesty rather than the typical blinkered/fanboy obsessed view you usually get whenever a M3 is mentioned. Leins said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I like this honesty rather than the typical blinkered/fanboy obsessed view you usually get whenever a M3 is mentioned.
What, so the fact I love what my CSL is means I'm a lying fanboy? Just because you bought the wrong car for what you wanted doesn't mean we're all wrong Lee! so I do believe you love it, surely you cant deny though that there are loads of blinkered views overall and that it is a car that if you say anything against it you are frowned upon. jcremonini said:
cerb4.5lee said:
Leins said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I like this honesty rather than the typical blinkered/fanboy obsessed view you usually get whenever a M3 is mentioned.
What, so the fact I love what my CSL is means I'm a lying fanboy? Just because you bought the wrong car for what you wanted doesn't mean we're all wrong Lee! so I do believe you love it, surely you cant deny though that there are loads of blinkered views overall and that it is a car that if you say anything against it you are frowned upon. When all said and done we all like different things and it would be a hell of a boring place if we all liked the same thing for sure.
Chapppers said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I like this honesty rather than the typical blinkered/fanboy obsessed view you usually get whenever a M3 is mentioned.
I can't imagine you'd "appreciate the honesty" if (rightly or wrongly) someone who'd owned a Cerb came along to a thread calling it a poorly built plastic muscle car but you'd certainly know they were wrong. One poor experience doesn't make a bad car. Mine gives me such a buzz every time I drive it, perhaps that's what causes my blinkered fanboy attitude or perhaps it's because it's genuinely hilarious to drive.One thing I will say... saying it's hard to access the performance of one of the fastest responding engines I've ever experienced is a little odd.
Edited by Chapppers on Wednesday 8th July 20:51
I did love its noise/power to weight ratio/sense of occasion/head turning ability though but that all came at a price because nine times out of ten the bloody thing wouldn't start when you wanted it to!
Chapppers said:
cerb4.5lee said:
Chapppers said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I like this honesty rather than the typical blinkered/fanboy obsessed view you usually get whenever a M3 is mentioned.
I can't imagine you'd "appreciate the honesty" if (rightly or wrongly) someone who'd owned a Cerb came along to a thread calling it a poorly built plastic muscle car but you'd certainly know they were wrong. One poor experience doesn't make a bad car. Mine gives me such a buzz every time I drive it, perhaps that's what causes my blinkered fanboy attitude or perhaps it's because it's genuinely hilarious to drive.One thing I will say... saying it's hard to access the performance of one of the fastest responding engines I've ever experienced is a little odd.
I did love its noise/power to weight ratio/sense of occasion/head turning ability though but that all came at a price because nine times out of ten the bloody thing wouldn't start when you wanted it to!
some don't like them but they are right up my street, I cant dislike the 3 series that much as I have owned three of them! I like a BMW`s dependability and it is a breath of fresh air when you have experienced TVR ownership.
Leins said:
cerb4.5lee said:
Leins said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I like this honesty rather than the typical blinkered/fanboy obsessed view you usually get whenever a M3 is mentioned.
What, so the fact I love what my CSL is means I'm a lying fanboy? Just because you bought the wrong car for what you wanted doesn't mean we're all wrong Lee! so I do believe you love it, surely you cant deny though that there are loads of blinkered views overall and that it is a car that if you say anything against it you are frowned upon. 
But TBH the criticism of the CSL on PH nearly always comes from the uninitiated, or from people who I believe bought the car for the wrong reasons (e.g. Daily driving). It's always complaints about the gearbox, the seats, the ride, the high-revving engine, that it's a BMW (a lowly 3-series at that), even the bloody stereo (although not in this case!) - and I think the criticism is unfair. It's like buying a Defender and then grumbling about its motorway manners
As mentioned earlier, GT3s and 360CS don't seem to get the same stick, and even in its first year a number of journos suggested that the CSL was a cut-price version of the above that captured most of the magic
However, I've never kept quiet about the one downside of the CSL, which once again no-one has mentioned here yet - steering feedback. Maybe it's because it's a "modern" car, or that it's still carrying a bit of weight in the engine bay, but it's slightly lacking in that department. Also, the steering wheel is offset slightly (Only on RHD ones IIRC), although that was pointed out to me and I've never thought about it since
But weekend fast-road / track running / Euro-trips I still maintain there's little to compete with a CSL, even at current higher prices
But here's the thing - if I was offered £70k tomorrow for mine, I'd probably take it. But only because what I believe could be the next car up the line from the CSL that I could then buy would be available - the CLK Black. I'd probably drive an Alpina B3 GT3 first too though
Or maybe even the one car that I could have bought back in 2011 for about the same money that has far outperformed the CSL in terms of value gain - the 964 Turbo 3.3. I suspect it wouldn't see which way the CSL went down my favourite road, but for me such things are all about driving pleasure, not driving times
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