Wednesday 8th July 2015

Volkswagen Phaeton: Guilty Pleasures

The Phaeton has recently been axed from the UK, and many won't miss it - Matt will though

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Despite the opinions of an unfair few and a weird obsession with America, I am not a flashy person. Reserved, diffident and subtle is just fine actually, which is why the VW Phaeton appeals so much. Well it's one of many reasons actually, but the rather dowdy appearance seems like as good as place as any to start.

Nondescript? Fine. Good, in fact

As luxury cars, indeed all cars, become visually more dramatic and bold, there's something increasingly quite plesant about the plain old Phaeton. For ultimate under the radar luxury, surely there's little to match it. The conservative look, combined with the VW badge, didn't help new sales; it hardly screams wealth and success, does it? But even from launch I've had a soft spot for its incredibly understated opulence, the ability to deliver the full luxobarge sensation behind a fairly humdrum badge. The Bentley link only strengthens the appeal, the impression of the poor old VW never quite getting the credit it deserves because of a perceived image problem.

I should qualify this by saying I've never actually driven a Phaeton. However, having consulted What Car? (a sensible sort of car deserves a sensible sort of opinion, right?) there's good news: "A superbly built, reliable and understated executive express." Apparently it's not the most dynamic luxury saloon - who cares?

The involvement of Ferdinand Piech in the project is another key factor of the Phaeton fascination. Of course it's not remembered as well as his other successes but that same meticulous attention to detail is there in its development: a Phaeton W12 had to be capable of driving at 186mph in an extenal temperature of 50 degrees while maintaining an interior temperature of 22 degrees. Allegedly. But I love the idea of it being overengineered, of incredible development goals being set and eventually reached.

Who cares about the badge, look at this!

Rumour goes as well that the Phaeton was a response to the Mercedes A-Class; that car was seen as Merc infringing on VW's domain and the Phaeton was intended to steal a few luxury saloon sales from Benz. Obviously that didn't quite work out, and it could all be hearsay, but it's a nice story nonetheless.

And there's a V10 diesel. As cars continually move to a powertrain uniformity, that period in the early 2000s where daft engines found their way into strange vehicles looks even better. V6 in a Clio? Nice. Passat W8? Even better. Rotary engines? Who cares about fuel, feel the smoothness! The V10 used in the Phaeton and Touareg is one of those engines. Today 300hp diesels are more plentiful but 313hp was really something back in 2003, or so it seemed. There was 553lb ft also, a sub-seven second sprint to 62mph and, er, 25mpg. Oh. But, personally speaking of course, the curio appeal of a 10-cylinder diesel still hasn't waned. I would love to know to know of any PHer experience with them.

So that's it really. I like the Phaeton because it's largely unloved, because it was developed by one of the world's greatest engineers and because it can be had with an interesting engine. I even think it looks good, especially on BBS wheels. But a disturbing fondness for the Euro scene is a discussion for another blog...

[Source: What Car?]

 

[BIRMA]

I've run a V10 5 litre twin turbo as a University Taxi for nearly a year and I love it. If you need a long distance wafting power barge this is it. It's anonymous on the road despite having monstourous torque at just over-tick over. On my 400 mile round trip to Norwich I get 35 MPG keeping it to motorway limits. The cooling massage seats along with double glazing and near silent travel make the initial 200 mile journey like a trip to the shops. I paid £10K for a four seater LWB version from a bunch of idiots up North and will keep it until I throw it away.

Edited by BIRMA on Wednesday 8th July 16:48

Edited by BIRMA on Thursday 9th July 08:00

[BIRMA]

Initially when I bought mine I was going to get AMD to re-map it as they could easily achieve 1000Nm torque at just over tick-over but having had the car for a while now it does the job fine.
At the motorway limit you are just over tick-over so when you floor it its almost cartoon like and the silence is interrupted by what I can only describe as a deep volcano like rumble you really have to restrain yourself from this wave of torque.
You take a gamble to a certain degree buying one because I understand an engine out job is forty hours and special equipment is required to do the job, mine has a automatic boot function that refuses to co-operate but I live with it. The fabulous cast aluminium boot struts look like they could hold up a small bridge and inside despite the plastic bits its a nice place to be.
It shares its chassis and suspension with the Bentley Continental when I looked inside a secondhand £40K Flying Spur the other day you can see all the control functions are the same on the seats and dash its just a bit more bling/expensive in the Bentley.

Here are some photos of mine excuse the fact I played too much Scrabble as a youngster but Phat One does raise the odd smile from the occupants of the car behind on several occasions.
Mine has the four individual seats that each have their own massage and cooling function and reclining ability along with individual air-con zones, my pervy mates love going on a trip in it plus it has a stonking sound system as standard.

[BIRMA]

GJR68 said:

That's a sweet car, BIRMA. I love these and have been tempted on a few occasions. Potential huge bills though and they will go wrong at some point.

Absolutely spot on there, I am a person who doesn't mind a high risk gamble and I bought mine with the mind-set if it goes wrong I'll have to throw it away or at least strip it down as it's worth a lot as parts. I had a budget of £40K to spend on such a car so I'm up on the deal so far and still think it was the right choice at £10K with only 50K miles on the clock.

[BIRMA]

Yes I quite often give a tail-gater a sooty little gift despite running it on V-Power the V10's were pre DPF and of course £280 road tax per annum.

[BIRMA]

I'm assuming most people wouldn't buy one new or even nearly new (who in their right mind would apart from large corporations) Like I have said I paid £10K for mine and it does me as a daily driver, a tip run carrier then I give it a quick clean and vacuum and its a limo.

I have really got to like mine over the year I've had it and wanted to try it's capability with winter tyres in the snow but I guess there is this winter so its four wheel drive capabilities will have to remain unknown 'till then. I know the one I bought has every conceivable extra but it really is a nice place to be. It's no B road hooner by any means but does cope with twisty A roads reasonably well.

But in all honesty you get in it and it's first party trick is to retract the polished wood covers to reveal the air vents which never blow air in your face instead the cabin warms or cools to make you instantly comfortable any journey of a reasonable length is honestly a pleasure.
As I am now in love with the N/A 6.2 litre AMG engine the only car I'll replace it with will probably be a CL63 as my daily transport at three or four times what I paid for the Phaeton.

[BIRMA]

Did try the Ls 460 very nice car and the Hybrid version didn't really like it that much.

[BIRMA]

Well put and totally agree, I remember when I did my first test drive in a V10 (bearing in mind I was convinced the Cayenne Turbo S was my next car) I had to ask the dealer for a second test drive because I couldn't get over the grunt it had at just over tick-over which combined with four wheel drive and adjustable suspension had me hooked.

[BIRMA]

Hackney said:

Possibly, but W12

If you're buying one of these now, particularly the larger engine either petrol or diesel, you've got to want something a bit.... ludicrous really.

A 2.0TDi Passat would have done 90% of what my Passat W8 would have done.
But I bought it for that other 10%

Couldn't agree more, if you are willing to take the chance and buy a monster engined Phaeton they will reward you with many 'big smile moments' I also run a hooligan of a car in an SL63 and the Phaeton gives me the same sort of buzz and only uses half the fuel.

[BIRMA]

Just don't let anyone customise it.

[BIRMA]

ilovevolvo said:

BIRMA said:

Just don't let anyone customise it.

Not a chance

funny enough i spotted you in Havant a few months ago in your V10 and thought how good it looked do you know what year the V10 was made up to ?

Russ

I don't know exactly but have seen 2006 registered cars for sale in the past. So as far as I know not very long up to the end of cheap road tax perhaps

[BIRMA]

blindswelledrat said:

Barchettaman said:

I can´t help thinking that if you´re in the market for a large refined saloon without ´badge appeal´, a newer Superb will do 99% of what an older Phaeton will, without the risks of massively expensive repair bespoke parts if/when things go wrong.

I bought one as a result of a thread on here (I think Bimma was a significant contributor)
My choice was an A8, 7 series or a Phaeton which I plumped for.
What you cannot get from pictures or rhetoric is quite how well built the things are. Mine is a 57 plate but the interior could have left the factory last week. There is not a single sign of aging on the inside and not even the slightest rattle of any kind.
I have owned and driven a lot of cars but I have never been in anything close to being this well built. Ive had it a few months now and every time I drive it I am still astounded by what an incredible car it is and what incredible value they are. Mine is genuinely as quiet at 120 is it is at 60 and if you can get on a smooth bit of motorway that eliminates tyre noise it is silent.
A Skoda Superb is not a valid comparison for this car at all.

I'm glad it suited you and you continue to enjoy the car, it's always difficult when you as an owner are enthused about a particular car which in this case doesn't suit many PH members. As they say the proof is in the ownership experience and every time I get in mine having not used it for a while say to myself 'hello old friend' rather than the string of expletives one or two of my past cars has prompted.

In answer to what years they were available ilovevolvo according to how many left there were just over 100 V10's registered in the UK between 2004-2007 with just one in 2007 with just under 100 4 and 5 seaters registered now.

[BIRMA]

Gompo said:

Saw my local one parked up for the first time over the weekend. Didn't realise it had those wheels on it, but I quite like the look.

NB. the registration.

I've seen those wheels on a custom painted V12 which was for sale a while ago and didn't like them that much but on a plain black car they look quite good.
You have to be careful buying wheels for Phaetons because of its weight. I bought some VW 'Performance' alloys for mine because I hated the standard 'Challenger' wheels that came with the car.

[BIRMA]

Just a heads up because something pretty rare has come up for sale in the form of a W12 Phaeton its a 2010 model so has the new head unit and the amazing Dynaudio sound package it's just appeared in the classified on here.
Put it this way if my V10 wasn't such a low mileage recent purchase I'd be straight up and buy it no hesitation

[BIRMA]

Hackney said:

BIRMA said:

Just a heads up because something pretty rare has come up for sale in the form of a W12 Phaeton its a 2010 model so has the new head unit and the amazing Dynaudio sound package it's just appeared in the classified on here.
Put it this way if my V10 wasn't such a low mileage recent purchase I'd be straight up and buy it no hesitation

Dammit! I'm six months ish away from buying a car (currently leasing, which ends in April)

Although they did make them right up until recently I've never seen such a late model come on the market. Still there is hope for me once mine has passed it's sell by date if it ever does.

[BIRMA]

Bit of a Unit said:

Just thought I'd bump this as it's rapidly jumping to the top of my barge list for an imminent purchase.

Is the interior spec standard across the range of engines? Or is there an extensive options list?

Any other ownership contributions appreciated. Particularly the 3 litre diesel as there aren't too many v10 on the market and I need to buy

OK you can tell if the car has the very nice cooled massage seats by the number of controls on the seat base/side. The non cooled massage seats have just a few basic knobs/controls whereas the cooled ones have quite a few. Some of the 2010 cars also have the Dynadio package which is really worth getting a car with, the later cars also have a slightly nicer central dash layout as the previous models do look a bit dated but I don't mind that. A careful check of the specification is required because I found a few dealers didn't know bugger all about what the cars have spec wise.

[BIRMA]

Bit of a Unit said:

BIRMA said:

OK you can tell if the car has the very nice cooled massage seats by the number of controls on the seat base/side. The non cooled massage seats have just a few basic knobs/controls whereas the cooled ones have quite a few. Some of the 2010 cars also have the Dynadio package which is really worth getting a car with, the later cars also have a slightly nicer central dash layout as the previous models do look a bit dated but I don't mind that. A careful check of the specification is required because I found a few dealers didn't know bugger all about what the cars have spec wise.

Thanks again for your help mate. There are 3 available within 20 miles of me right now that look to have good histories. I'm going for a few test drives this weekend!

Have fun, just a few tips, if any you try have the auto gear indicator fully lit up as a block as opposed to individual figures/letters (its in the display between the speedo and rev counter) walk away it is very rare that a car will have this but best avoided. If any have a full VW history that would be desirable. When you turn on the ignition the rather nice wooden trims should disappear without problem if any stay down press the A/C button on the lower row of buttons and you will see a diagram of the air circulation on the display press the buttons to the side and they should open/operate.

Edited by BIRMA on Tuesday 25th August 20:22

Edited by BIRMA on Tuesday 25th August 20:39

[BIRMA]

blindswelledrat said:

BIRMA said:

. When you turn on the ignition the rather nice wooden trims should disappear without problem if any stay down press the A/C button on the lower row of buttons and you will see a diagram of the air circulation on the display press the buttons to the side and they should open/operate.

[]

I meant to ask on the Phaeton forum about this but you saved me the trip.
When I bought the car and it was a little cooler those trims stayed down more or less permanently.
Now it is warmer they are open most of the time, even when the car is to temperature. Is that normal?

I think all models are the same but it may be the case that the last owner programmed the key to suit his or her exact needs and they perhaps didn't want them open on start up. I know my spare key was set to someone about 2 foot shorter than me and didn't like fresh air.

The air con system has so many variables I have mine set on manual. First press the AC button (the 12 buttons below the screen) and get the AC screen when you press the buttons on the side of the display that are near the up arrow and side arrow, if you have it on auto it will blow high on a hot day (you can turn auto off by pressing one of the two buttons on the 8 buttons above the display screen) if you have the side button pressed on both sides where the horizontal arrow is on the display provided it needs cooling or heating all of the wooden covers should be raised. In the winter you can adjust the central vent to blow cooler air to keep you alert on a long journey. Just make sure its not set on econ as this turns off the ac system.

Also remember the perfectionist who designed this car regardless of cost didn't want air blowing on his face so the air-con is designed in a way that it works on adjusting the cabin temperature with the least amount of intrusion from the heating/cooling system.

It may be the case that you will have to go back into settings and set your key to your preferred settings this includes the steering wheel/seats and rear view mirror plus the air-con you can also control arrival and departure lighting too.

Hope that helps, as you say the Vortex forum has a lot of people who know a lot more about these cars than me.

Edited by BIRMA on Wednesday 26th August 09:31

[BIRMA]

blindswelledrat said:

GOod stuff. I will explore that. Thank you.
Two more related questions as you have obviously explored this thoroughly.

1) On the door by the window there is an a/c vent that has it's own button which turns yellow when pressed. What does that do?
2)You know how each vent has it's own button immediately beneath it which has a light that moves left and right? Well I know what that does but there is an identical button in the centre of the dash with a red dot on one end and a blue on the other. When you press it the light beneath it moves along but changes from red to blue once it goes past the middle. I love this button but haven't got the faintest idea what it does?

As an aside, I recently got this regassed and the bloke who did it said that the a/c was the coldest he had seen

No problem,
1 As far as I know when pressed and yellow it stops vented air clearing the side window.
2 Thats the central button I mentioned, what it does is in the middle it gives out ambient air if you press it to blue it lowers the temperature to keep you awake on a long journey if you want slightly warmer air go to red its very subtle but a nice little tweak to the elaborate air-con system.
Properly working i.e. fully gassed up the air-con system in this car is really effective on a typical journey my wife in the passenger seat likes it hot, my daughter in the back likes it cold then hot then cold then hot, meanwhile I keep it at a constant cool and remain blissfully unaware of the multitude of temperatures my passengers seem to want which up until the purchase of the Phaeton made every journey a bloody misery.

[BIRMA]

Lungwun said:

Thread resurrection!

The V6 powered petrols are well and truly into bargain barge territory.

Does anyone have any experience running one of these?

I quite fancy the understated look of these and i'm looking into a quiet comfortable highway muncher.

Any tips on pre-purchase inspections for the tiny V6?

There is only a V8 petrol, the V6 is a diesel as far as I know, I'm sure there was never a V6 petrol.

[BIRMA]

blindswelledrat said:

Lungwun said:

BIRMA said:

There is only a V8 petrol, the V6 is a diesel as far as I know, I'm sure there was never a V6 petrol.

There is/was a Phaeton with the 3.2 VAG petrol available in Germany. not too sure if it was available in the UK

Yes there are loads of V6 petrols. The classifieds would suggest it is almost the most common variant here.

Didn't realise there was a V6 petrol just goes to show how much I know. Having said that I was only ever interested in the V10 or W12