All those bargain end of Lease Golf R's ?

[J4CKO]

Where are they ?

had a quick nosey last night and most are 20k plus even for a leggy 2013, most seem to be 25k for anything more recent and arent they available from a broker for 28 ish new ? anything less than 20 seems to be Cat D or some other dodgyness. Was hoping there would be a good number dipping into the mid high teens by now.

Am I missing something ? but to me, looks like the predicted droves of Cheap Golf R's arent happening as predicted, or is it still too early, or my expectations on price a bit unrealistic ?

Wonder if, despite the numbers leased the R will follow the pattern of previous fast Golf's/VAG stuff, 6'rs are still expensive, R32s also ?

[J4CKO]

MDMA . said:

would you really want an ex lease Golf R?

lad at work has one. ragged from cold everyday. abused no end. he takes the view that it's going back next year!

not for me.

Because its a car that for me would do it all, and the question would still stand for 3 year old privately owned examples as well.

Also, not everyone is quite as hard on cars as your colleague and is actively trying to damage it for the next owner and anyway, a modern car that is serviced should cope with a bit of that and I am not sure it is that possible to leave most places of work and deploy 300 bhp straight away due to speed limits, traffic, common sense ?

[J4CKO]

Not sure where this "ragged" thing comes from, I can get the fact they are too expensive currently relative to a discounted new one but people still rag ones they own, maybe less but really I cant see they will be knackered after two years and 10 to 20k even with the odd bit of stick from cold.

The leasing works for the manufacturers as a Golf Cost x pounds to make, even the most basic ones cost pretty much the same as an R to make, ok the 4wd gubbins will cost more but I cant imagine most of it will really make an R cost more to make than any other Golf, that you can get from what 18 grand, VW much prefer to sell 30 grand R's to 18 grand bog spec ones, its another 12 grand minimum, for very little additional outlay after its been designed and tested, would be interesting to see the actual costs and what costs the most to make, the line will be running day and night chucking them out.

They need cars in the used chain and the cheap leases do that quite nicely as otherwise the Golf R, and many other cars would be a rare sight !

[J4CKO]

MDMA . said:

J4CKO said:

Because its a car that for me would do it all, and the question would still stand for 3 year old privately owned examples as well.

Also, not everyone is quite as hard on cars as your colleague and is actively trying to damage it for the next owner and anyway, a modern car that is serviced should cope with a bit of that and I am not sure it is that possible to leave most places of work and deploy 300 bhp straight away due to speed limits, traffic, common sense ?

you obviously don't employ many idiots at your place. it's like the starting grid at an F1 race with a rush to get out at home time

We have our share, but generally the traffic means you cant hammer your car from cold anyway.

I must admit, I dont give it 30 miles and check the oil temp like some on here do before giving it full throttle, just a reasonable bit of sympathy and havent had any issues, at least wait until the coolant is half way so the oil has got round, i have actively over a period of months tried to kill a car and it just came back for more, that was a Metro GTI that I hated with a passion that needed to die, it was revved from freezing, bounced off the rev limiter, buzzed to 7500 rpm, I did burn outs and hammered it senseless, seemed to just get faster, I think I ran it in properly.

[J4CKO]

I was kind of considering leasing but kind of fancy tuning one which isnt an option unless you own it, am sure it is fast enough standard but kind of want to shoot for 400 bhp and get it out of my system.

Was thinking 20 grand to buy a reasonably fresh example and modify it but think thats a little way off yet for a 7, would need to be a 6 which is still a decent car but also still expensive and has that not the real deal thing about it.

Will be interesting to see what the new version is like, suspect that may dent values a little at the high end.

Other option is a 135i but they are still very expensive as well, its weird really we have all these cars down as a cheap lease model but they seem to get expensive again when second hand.

[J4CKO]

daemon said:

J4CKO said:

Where are they ?

had a quick nosey last night and most are 20k plus even for a leggy 2013, most seem to be 25k for anything more recent and arent they available from a broker for 28 ish new ? anything less than 20 seems to be Cat D or some other dodgyness. Was hoping there would be a good number dipping into the mid high teens by now.

Am I missing something ? but to me, looks like the predicted droves of Cheap Golf R's arent happening as predicted, or is it still too early, or my expectations on price a bit unrealistic ?

Wonder if, despite the numbers leased the R will follow the pattern of previous fast Golf's/VAG stuff, 6'rs are still expensive, R32s also ?

On what reasoning were you expecting them to be cheap?

Did you expect them to be less than equivalent GTIs?

As they come back off lease, they'll be sold at trade auctions, and resold on dealer forecourts at market value.

Yeah, I agree, not sure what I was expecting but preferably more than three grand cheaper than a new one from a broker, like Johnno02 mentioned its probably a bit early as a lot of the deal wont have ended yet, I have said in the past that the glut of unwanted ones on the used market wont happen, they are still desirable was just hoping they had dropped into the high teens but that is a little while off yet, the old 260 bhp S3 and MK6 R are still occupying that price range it seems.

I think as has been said that the GTI is a rare sight due to the R, still a decent car in its own right but the R steals its thunder, especially when you can get 80 bhp and 4wd for no more money on a lease, it makes the GTI seem a bit underendowed and expensive rather than the R being overkill.

[J4CKO]

Thats a fair point I would imagine, without the mileage coming up on MOTs and mileage allowances it doesnt take a genius to realise that "mileage correction" may occur but depends how easy that is to tamper with nowadays, I know the Golf is good at registering boost going over thresholds so does it record the mileage being messes with, is it possible.

The flies of a thousand camels to those who do it though.



Edit, looks like its rife,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rC51SgFWrA

Obviously there are legitimate reasons for mileage correction but that is probably like 0.1 percent of the market.

Edited by J4CKO on Monday 17th October 20:05

[J4CKO]

Sheepshanks said:

daemon said:

Because the used market tend to be fairly blind to what new cars can be PCP'd / leased for, and in fact, probably doesnt care.

That's a what a VW dealer salesman told me last year when buying a Tiguan.

We needed it quickly so I initially thought I'd buy a stock car nearly new. Inchcape had over 100 of them but it quickly became apparent that very recent ones (same spec at new) were anything up to £3K more than discounted new. You had to go back over 12mth before they were cheaper, and they had the previous engine and no sat-nav.

And it's not like you could negotiate a lower price - tried two branches and got stone-walled.

I find it hard to believe but the salesman said people just don't make the comparison - they come in thinking they want used and that's what they focus on. I guess in most dealers it's a different sales team so it's not in their interest to swap people around.

Seems to be two completely separate markets almost !

I think leasing is more company/user choosers and those wanting maximum car for the monthly, one/two/three yearold used it perhaps the more "Steady Eddie" approach, my wife wouldnt leave but was happy buying a year old/11k Fiesta, was massively cheaper than new.

[J4CKO]

lewisf182 said:

daemon said:

lewisf182 said:

5k miles per anumm and a mileage correction on handing back looks a pretty easy option!

Is it though?

Surely the car is due a service every year, so you'd need to clock it 3 times, and also any time it was in for any repairs under warranty you'd need to clock it then too.

I don't think it's due a service every year, if BMW it's mileage based so say 18k miles so you could have a 2 year lease without a service potentially? And the kind of person who'd clock a car would probably have it serviced somewhere cheap and not get it stamped etc so no record of it, then "correct" the mileage back to say 10k for the 2 year term? I'd probably guess it happens more than we think, I'd also suspect there's certain regional "hot spots"......

What I don't understand is why the golf R hold's it's value so much better than an M135i, if you look compare both side by side for sale the R's are usually worth multiple of K's more, just seem's odd to me! even the Mk6 Golf R are as expensive as 2012/13 M135i's. They hold their value extremely well and I can't see the huge amount of ex lease cars coming onto the market changing that, as they will be snapped up quickly - to me it seems leasing was a bad option considering how they have held their value.

Edited by lewisf182 on Tuesday 18th October 08:45

Yeah, weird isnt it, the MK6 is really expensive, even 2009/2010, the M135i seems much better value, there was a immaculate, low miler 2013 at a posh and quite expensive dealers locally for £19,995, probably 2k more than when compared to private examples but didnt seem that bad.

Suspect the Golf R has more image and desirability, its packaged better for family use, arguably better looking and I think the six cylinders might put some off, plus it doesnt have AWD like the Golf, traction is an issue with them in the wet, made me think coming in this morning, mine will light the traction control light at 60 mph or more, on decent tyres, the 135i is smaller and lighter.

[J4CKO]

culpz said:

J4CKO said:

Yeah, weird isnt it, the MK6 is really expensive, even 2009/2010, the M135i seems much better value, there was a immaculate, low miler 2013 at a posh and quite expensive dealers locally for £19,995, probably 2k more than when compared to private examples but didnt seem that bad.

The MK6 R's never came out new with attractive cheap leases like they did with the 7R's so VW couldn't shift them by the bucket-load like they did with the new ones. It makes perfect sense really.

Not many people wanna spend sub 30k on a Golf, fast or not, outright in cash brand-new and without any decent value leases/PCPs meant that they have become quite rare and their values have held firmly.

Yeah, they are fairly uncommon, more S3's about which is the same thing but strangely seem a bit cheaper, I would imagine the 6 will drop as the 7's become more numerous used unless its some strange VAG scene thing about having a 6 over the more common, but better 7 ?

[J4CKO]

av185 said:

jimi said:

VW will be setting the RV for these and throttling the supply into the used market to sustain it. Remember they will sell these at closed auctions to dealers. The manufacturer controls the used price - this is essential for them as they are holding that RV risk, last thing they want to do is flood the market then they couldn't offer cheap monthlies as the figures simply wouldn't add up.

Hardly call 15 to 20 cars a week through BCAs open auctions throttling the supply....

15 to 20 across the country isnt many, how many left says there are 14,000 out there, suspect that there is probably quite a few.

[J4CKO]

mrfunex said:

FN2TypeR said:

Tryke3 said:

Think it goes something like this at every red light

Yo blud let me show u blow this fiesta
Next traffic light
Yo blud le me show mans blow this s5
Next traffic light
What mans thinks hes a bad man in his bentley, ill blow u
Next traffic light
Man thinks hes sick in his pos 1995 nissan, watch this
Next traffic light
Chicks hot in that mini, ill show her whos the man
Next traffic light
What an r8, man thinks hes tuff in that, ill smash him over the humps ( while flying 60 mph over humps)
I could go on, but im bored

I woulnt buy it, younguns seem to love s3 golfs and a45s

If you think that is true, you are clearly in need of some sort of medical assistance IMO.

Most of the ones round here that I've noticed have been driven in more or less that manner. I think he's pretty much on the money...

Seen a couple being driven badly but by and large not.

[J4CKO]

A guy on FB I know said he got offered a new Black 5 Door R for £23,500, VW Manchester ?

Is that even possible ?

[J4CKO]

daemon said:

J4CKO said:

A guy on FB I know said he got offered a new Black 5 Door R for £23,500, VW Manchester ?

Is that even possible ?

Well its on facebook so it must be true

Sorry, back to reality, i would very much doubt it. It wasnt a Golf R-Line was it? That would be more in line with that price. I cant see why a dealer would be punting them out at that price

He did seem convinced but also did have a bit of a reputation for tall tales as a kid.

[J4CKO]

daemon said:

J4CKO said:

daemon said:

J4CKO said:

A guy on FB I know said he got offered a new Black 5 Door R for £23,500, VW Manchester ?

Is that even possible ?

Well its on facebook so it must be true

Sorry, back to reality, i would very much doubt it. It wasnt a Golf R-Line was it? That would be more in line with that price. I cant see why a dealer would be punting them out at that price

He did seem convinced but also did have a bit of a reputation for tall tales as a kid.

You should push him for evidence. I cant see it personally.

Presumably if hes went to the trouble of hammering out a deal with a dealer on one, and hes been offered a once-in-a-lifetime price on one, hes actually bought it?

He just put a general post on FB, he said,

"I've been offered an X50 M50d, pre registered 1st Dec 16. 23 miles on the clock, all the bells and whistles. Invoice price 85k
Offered it to me 59k
A 16 plate M3 saloon for 48 list 70. A new golf R with 15 k knocked of it "


The Golf bit piqued my interest, as though I am not in a position to buy currently it will (or a 135/140) be my next car, I keep changing my mind, but I think I want the 4wd, buy one outright and do a few mods.

I said that with 15 grand off it must be like 20 grand or not much more, he said it was a lovely black 5 door at VW Manchester for £23,500, but there is nothing even close to that, low milers are like 27k, new ones 35.


So, I guess they may negotiate but cant see them doing a brand new one for £23,500.

[J4CKO]

He just posted a picture of him picking up a Golf from the same dealers, it had a cover over it and was silver, not black.

It had these wheels on,



They arent R wheels are they, GTI upgrade from the standard ones ?

[J4CKO]

imdeman87 said:

J4CKO said:

Where are they ?

had a quick nosey last night and most are 20k plus even for a leggy 2013, most seem to be 25k for anything more recent and arent they available from a broker for 28 ish new ? anything less than 20 seems to be Cat D or some other dodgyness. Was hoping there would be a good number dipping into the mid high teens by now.

Am I missing something ? but to me, looks like the predicted droves of Cheap Golf R's arent happening as predicted, or is it still too early, or my expectations on price a bit unrealistic ?

Wonder if, despite the numbers leased the R will follow the pattern of previous fast Golf's/VAG stuff, 6'rs are still expensive, R32s also ?

Been keeping an eye on this and the prices are certainly coming down now and it will get worse around March/April when most 15 plate leases go back.

Several non-Cat C/D cars just under £19k with around 20k miles on the clock - all 14/64 plates. There's always been around 300 Golf Rs mk7 for sale on auto trader - this has gone up to 450 in the past month.

No doubt that these lease deals have devalued the R. They're everywhere on the roads now too - around 15,000 registered on UK roads.

Feel bad for those who bought the car outright before the 'cheap' lease deals...

Well, they had the car early, and I expect enjoyed it.

I think my CLS will be worth perhaps 5 and if I put 15 to it would get me a pretty decent R, the CLS is nice but its a bit big and not that practical so the next car has to be a bit of a jack of all trades and the R fits, as does the 135i but I believe the rear room is pretty bad and I quite like the idea of 4wd for a change, needs to be able to cart five people occasionally, not long journeys but they need to be able to fit in and not sure a 1 series fits that particular bill.

Fancy getting an R and doing a bit of tuning, anyone know what the standard approach is beyond a remap/tuning box ?

[J4CKO]

Hainey said:

Tuvra said:

J4CKO said:

I said that with 15 grand off it must be like 20 grand or not much more, he said it was a lovely black 5 door at VW Manchester for £23,500, but there is nothing even close to that, low milers are like 27k, new ones 35.


So, I guess they may negotiate but cant see them doing a brand new one for £23,500.

Even at £23,500 with £15k off that's a £38,500 car, that would have had every single option ticked. Absolute bks.

At £23,500, even in basic form it would be the best pound for pound car money can buy, IMO.

Tuvra nails it

Yeah, thought it sounded too good to be true, Golf was for his missus apparently.

[J4CKO]

Most folk wouldn't really know the difference, R, GTI, GTE, GTD or any other, its just a Golf, not sure why an R is more "Council" than a GTI, its a very similar car, or is it the cheap-ish lease deals that have done that ?

I will just get the faster, more capable version with 4WD.

[J4CKO]

Q Car said:

Hmmm, had my R Estate for exactly 28 days. Then some nice gentlemen came round to the house at 2.15pm on Thursday afternoon in October, ripped the back patio door out with crow bars, turned the house upside down looking for the keys and took it for a nice shopping spree in Liverpool. They did three post offices and discharged firearms at two of them. The car was somehow recovered by the police from a hotel car park 48 hours later on false plates. My New Best Mate DC Dave in the Serious Crime Squad then impounded it for two weeks while a temporary key was obtained from the factory (can't submit the evidence if we break in) and then went over every micron of the car for another week as it was the only piece of evidence in two attempted murder cases. As he later said to me "These are the perfect car for armed robberies - nice heated seat for the driver, plenty of room for three more crims, massive boot for sorn off's and cash bags and unless the 'copter is already in the air and in the area, we don't stand a chance of keeping up."

The crime squad officer who came to the house to dust everything said he'd done 13 similar that week - all Golf R's and S3's apart from one M3 in South Manchester.

There's only two good things about this situation in that we were all out of the house and over 100 miles away when it happened and the police have contacted VWFS to advise them that we shouldn't have the car back due to the nature of what it's been used for.

Kids having nightmares. Wife scared to be left alone in the house. Utter nightmare.

that does concern me but on our road there are Focus ST, Fiesta ST, brand new Audi Q7, M4, 650i, 235i, M Class, Evoque and various other decent cars, not sure if the R is more of an issue but wouldnt want to attract too much attention, to be honest I would rather it didnt look like an R anyway, but am guessing other than removing badges that would be quite hard.