Can't afford a 964 then buy a 993

[C4ME]

Reading the 306GTI front article today (Peugeot 309 GTI: Spotted) and it was discussing how the values of certain models get pulled up by their more desirable siblings. In this case the 306GTI getting dragged up by the rise of the 205GTI. To illustrate the point the following was written

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Because in 2016, another three-door 309 GTI - with a much lower mileage, granted - is for sale at £10,000. Sure, it's a nicer example, but not that much so. What's happened then?

The 205 GTI, essentially. As values for that have skyrocketed, so the mechanically similar 309 has been brought up by association. It's happened elsewhere too: E28 M5s appreciated to a crazy level, drawing attention to the E34 M5 with which its engine was shared. As 964s became out of reach, so buyers moved to 993s to get their air-cooled 911 fix. And as Ferrari 355s continue to head towards six figures, the 360 Modena becomes more desirable as the next (and slightly more attainable) V8 berlinetta down the Ferrari line.
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Reality ?

Edited by C4ME on Tuesday 11th October 10:42

[C4ME]

JamesBrown123 said:

A few years ago the early SWB 911's were unwanted, the 70-73 models were more expensive. Over time the earlier cars overtook the later cars, they now command more money. The 993 and the 964 will follow the same path in my opinion. A few years ago the 993 was more expensive, they are now like for like when you find a good example. In time the 964 will be more valuable. They made less of them, they are far prettier, the faults they had were minor and generally have been fixed by now, and in my opinion they are the pinnacle in terms of looks, time will determine that the 993's lines are not pure enough and are watered down...

Production volumes 993 vs 964 very similar.

[C4ME]

IMI A said:

Long term I agree 964 C2 will outperform both 3.2 Carrera and 993 C2. World wide there was only 18000 964s made and about 10% of them were RHD. UK supplied RHD 964 C2 manual have become relatively rare and sought after. Having said that I don't think 993 C2 will be far behind and I'd love to own a nice one. Saw a slate grey 993 C2 yesterday and to my eye it looked stunning...

Isn't the 18,000 produced the figure for the 964 C2 Coupe only? Corresponding number for 993 C2 Coupe is approx 23,000 (14,500 NVR plus 8,500 VR).

The UK numbers for the RHD 993 C2 Coupe is 857. If 10% of 964 were RHD that would equate to 1,800 RHD 964 Carrera 2 which seems high. Never seen accurate UK numbers for the 964. Anybody know them?

Both 993 and 964 were over 60,000 produced in total.

[C4ME]

Looking at production numbers for the other aircooled eras there are approx 20K pre-impact SWB, 64K pre-impact LWB, 45K 2.7/3.0, 58K SC. It has been fairly consistent all along once the 911 caught on.

[C4ME]

Of course the 993 has six gears to the five in the 964 so maybe that makes a difference to the acceleration. The Varioram in the 285 engines does change the torque characteristic as well and they feel different to the non varioram 993 and 964. To me the non varioram 993 feels very similar in feel to the 964 and has that distinct surge up the rev range so it sort of feels faster than it is. By the time they get going the varioram engine is already on it so it feels more linear.

[C4ME]

I have never seen the gear analysis charts for 993 VR, 993 NVR and 964 overlaid on one another.

[C4ME]

I see the latest issue of Total911 has a 964 vs 993 head to head.

"Elsewhere, in the new issue, two of the most popular air-cooled Porsche 911s of all time, the 964 Carrera and its 993 successor go head-to-head in a definitive battle to find the better driver’s car."

Edited by C4ME on Tuesday 22 November 11:00