Mumtalakat to take over McLaren
Discussion
supersport said:
You only need to sit in a McLaren to realise how special they are.
The fact that the engines are “the same” isn’t an issue. They are incredible machines and to my mind just as exotic and stunning to look at as other supercars.
I also think that they are actually all different. Yes there is a family and family look, come on Porsche same look for 60 years, and that makes each model desirable for different reasons.
They do feel special to sit in. But unfortunately for me (and many others I suspect) the fact that almost every car they do has an AMG v8 TT in various states of tune means that as a package it doesn't feel special enough for the price.The fact that the engines are “the same” isn’t an issue. They are incredible machines and to my mind just as exotic and stunning to look at as other supercars.
I also think that they are actually all different. Yes there is a family and family look, come on Porsche same look for 60 years, and that makes each model desirable for different reasons.
Couple that with ongoing ownership and profitability uncertainty and I just don't feel comfortable splurging that kind of money on one.
Hammersia said:
I'm not getting into the argument of whether McLarens are good or bad, but the point I've made elsewhere is more about brand value -
I believe as electrification takes over, more components are shared, and new rapid low volume manufacturing techniques are developed (3D metal deposition etc.) all "brands" will find it easier and cheaper to continue producing cars, and we will have some long lost brands (Lancia, Triumph etc.) resurrected.
I would be pretty sure whatever happens that McLaren (and Aston) have enough brand value to continue in some form, they will always make a comeback , some investors will get wiped out of course but others will profit.
Incidentally by the same logic I think it's far from a given that the Ferrari brand value will continue at it's current stratospheric levels. A Ferrari without a Ferrari IC engine, is there the same market size potential as currently? I doubt it, yes Ferrari will have eternal brand value but I'm guessing it will decline a little in the medium term as electrification spreads.
Yes absolutely agreed. Electrification feels odd to me in a Ferrari. Having driven the 296 it is a great car but not for me for several reasons, partly looks but also partly hybridisation. I'm sure the younger people will be fine with it though.I believe as electrification takes over, more components are shared, and new rapid low volume manufacturing techniques are developed (3D metal deposition etc.) all "brands" will find it easier and cheaper to continue producing cars, and we will have some long lost brands (Lancia, Triumph etc.) resurrected.
I would be pretty sure whatever happens that McLaren (and Aston) have enough brand value to continue in some form, they will always make a comeback , some investors will get wiped out of course but others will profit.
Incidentally by the same logic I think it's far from a given that the Ferrari brand value will continue at it's current stratospheric levels. A Ferrari without a Ferrari IC engine, is there the same market size potential as currently? I doubt it, yes Ferrari will have eternal brand value but I'm guessing it will decline a little in the medium term as electrification spreads.
Streetbeat said:
Did you also assume they were sh*t to drive too????
Im afraid you are the perfect example of the Mclaren troll, never owned one, clearly no knowledge of them but happy to tell everyone why you dont want one, regurgitating "stuff" youve read on the internet or assumed. If you actually spent a little of your wasted ramblings doing some proper research, talking to long standing owners, dare i say even drive one you "might" actually have some constructive cristiscm or at the very least a valued opinion.
In the broader term to said people, if you are more concerned with pub bragging rights over engine configuration and the noise it makes or are too concerned about protecting your hard earned without a bit of depreciation stick to the familiar, but if you actually want a car that has in very a brief time made the competiton have to pull its socks up (Ferrari still not caught up with the 720s 7 years later) perhaps Mclaren is the car for you, irrespective of the "brand".
Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche are well established, how was their first decade in production??
I've driven them so didn't need to assume. They're simply not for me, which is why I tend to buy Ferrari's rather than McLaren's. Don't think that makes me a troll, just means I have a different opinion to people that prefer them to Ferrari's etc. My cars generally depreciate so it's not about that, but the total package is important to me, that includes sound and yes, i prefer a naturally aspirated v12 to a tt v8. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯Im afraid you are the perfect example of the Mclaren troll, never owned one, clearly no knowledge of them but happy to tell everyone why you dont want one, regurgitating "stuff" youve read on the internet or assumed. If you actually spent a little of your wasted ramblings doing some proper research, talking to long standing owners, dare i say even drive one you "might" actually have some constructive cristiscm or at the very least a valued opinion.
In the broader term to said people, if you are more concerned with pub bragging rights over engine configuration and the noise it makes or are too concerned about protecting your hard earned without a bit of depreciation stick to the familiar, but if you actually want a car that has in very a brief time made the competiton have to pull its socks up (Ferrari still not caught up with the 720s 7 years later) perhaps Mclaren is the car for you, irrespective of the "brand".
Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche are well established, how was their first decade in production??
Streetbeat said:
As i said, if you presumed the engine was an amg lump, it shows your interest or lack of, i doubt driving any was going to make any difference, whether that was in reality or not. We all like a na v12, but there is so so much more to a car than the engine pushing it.
Not really, it shows my lack of understanding of who manufactured the engine but doesn't change that they basically use the same engine across the range which feels cheap.My personal preference is generally for FR GT cars which is why McLaren's are not for me, same reason I didn't buy a 488, f8. I'd like a mid engine at some point but would likely go for something more comfortable than both the McLaren or Ferrari options along the lines of an MC20 for example.
I think you just need to accept that different people's buying criteria differs from yours.
davek_964 said:
Different people like different things. Some like McLaren, some don't - and for sure, McLaren have made some mistakes in their business model.
What's different about McLaren - on PH and many other car forums - is the apparent need for people who don't like McLaren, and have no interest in buying one - to tell everybody what's wrong with them.
I've had a couple of 911s in the past. It made me realise I'm not a great fan of Porsche - but I haven't felt the need to post on 911 posts to highlight why I think they're overrated.
I had an Evora for a week - before I drove it, I fully expected to be buying one soon after that week. For various reasons, I hated it - yet I've never joined a Lotus / Evora thread to point out how s
t I think they are.
That is why McLaren owners get a bit defensive on here - and why many I know left PH a long time ago. Look through some Ferrari and Lambo threads - can you find many posts from non-owners pointing out why they're crap, and why they bought something else? But look through a few McLaren threads (not just here) and you'd struggle to find one where there isn't at least one non-owner telling you what a pile of crap they are.
I don't post much on the supercar section anymore for that reason - and I imagine I'll regret this post, because I have better things to do than feed the anti-McLaren brigade.
If you don't like them - fine, don't buy one, and I'm sure you'll have a party if they go down the toilet. But FFS - give it a rest.
I mean, McLaren doesn't have the monopoly in non owners explaining why they didn't like and buy a car. Plenty of Ferrari's, Aston's and Porsche's lots of people don't like and regularly state as much, me included.What's different about McLaren - on PH and many other car forums - is the apparent need for people who don't like McLaren, and have no interest in buying one - to tell everybody what's wrong with them.
I've had a couple of 911s in the past. It made me realise I'm not a great fan of Porsche - but I haven't felt the need to post on 911 posts to highlight why I think they're overrated.
I had an Evora for a week - before I drove it, I fully expected to be buying one soon after that week. For various reasons, I hated it - yet I've never joined a Lotus / Evora thread to point out how s
t I think they are.That is why McLaren owners get a bit defensive on here - and why many I know left PH a long time ago. Look through some Ferrari and Lambo threads - can you find many posts from non-owners pointing out why they're crap, and why they bought something else? But look through a few McLaren threads (not just here) and you'd struggle to find one where there isn't at least one non-owner telling you what a pile of crap they are.
I don't post much on the supercar section anymore for that reason - and I imagine I'll regret this post, because I have better things to do than feed the anti-McLaren brigade.
If you don't like them - fine, don't buy one, and I'm sure you'll have a party if they go down the toilet. But FFS - give it a rest.
I get it, nobody likes stuff they like being disliked or criticised but guess what, everyone's different and their purchase or not motivations are just as valid as yours. It's a forum after all.
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