Hillclimbing a 996Turbo
Discussion
Having retired [ again ] from rallying early 2014 I decided to sell my self built Mk2 Escort which had a 2.3 XE engine built by my Mate Tom New which had 295 bhp in a 925 kg car along with 6 speed sequential box and low gearing, it was a “lively” motor car
The wife did not like the rallying [understatement of the year!! ] but we did do a couple of Hillclimbs in the Mk2 last year which she enjoyed, bonus!
So, after some time, the Escort sold for Very decent money, what to buy next??????
The “new” car had to be decent on the road as I couldn’t be arsed with trailering anymore and competitive ish on the hillclimbs.
I had a list in order of preference of a R5 Turbo 2, Gardner Douglass cobra with monster LS engine, TVR, T350 and a 911 of some sorts!
I quickly ticked off the other cars for various reasons and decided it had to be another 911, as i used to race / rally a road legal [ always driven to events and back ] 2.8 RSR replica which NEVER broke.
Looked at various Air cooled 911’s but the prices, IMO are just plain daft, especially for something modded with plenty of grunt.
Looking through PH used car section like you do, I saw a Very interesting 996 turbo with lots of interesting extras, arranged a view and test drive, suitably impressed and after a brief consultation with the wife, bought the car.
The spec was 2003 factory X50 with KW3 suspension GT3 front brakes, Tubi exhaust system, 997 short shift, sachs 740nm clutch, 20mm rear wheel spacers and 17mm front, sports seats and many good options fitted from new.
In the deal i had miltek manifolds fitted and a re-map, oil and filter and brake fluid change all done by Matt at Fearnsports.
Runs 1.4 bar boost and does go well! Not sure on power, been told 550 ish, but the torque is immense, Matt says could be 580 ish!
It had an almost new set of PS2’s fitted which are good tyres for the road. On a particular cold fresh winter drive the clutch stated to slip, quick chat to the dealer and we agree they would pay toward a new 890nm clutch which I took to Matt’s to be fitted, MUCH better, no slip, but now, wheelspin! IMO the standard set up with no rear LSD is poor, using the brakes to control slippage with that amount of torque was not beneficial to forward movement.
So, after a chat to my old mate Bob Watson, he fitted a Wavetrack Diff to the rear, now it just goes but the car will move around under power, so I understand why Porsche did not fit one, however this does not bother me.
I also acquired another set of wheels and fitted them with Kumho’s excellent V700 road legal list 1b race tyre.
What with this year’s Hillclimbing season approaching fast I thought it best to have a proper play with the 996t so booked Curborough for ½ a day, IMO the perfect place to get to know your car’s limits.
Blimy the grip was VERY impressive so much so I could not stay in my seat, as I do not wish to alter the interior of the car I fitted a quick release full harness safety belt which stopped me falling out of the seat !
1st Hillclimb, Prescott April, fastest in class in practise 0.8 off the record, but made a mistake on my final run to finish 3rd, 0.5 from 1st. 15 cars in the class, another 997 t, Subaru’s, Evos, lotus etc a good selection of fast road cars, although some are trailered.
I entered a Sprint at Goodwood in May just for fun as its long time I had driven around there without numerous artificial chicanes. Great fun, the 996t REALLY coming into its own on the fast flowing track, 160 mph being recorded at the end of the Lavent strait!
2nd in class behind a very rapid latest spec GTR by 0.9, 3 seconds in front of a GT3 with a time from a standing start of 1.28.7, almost 100 mph average, not bad for a comfy air conditioned road car!!
Gurston down in May, not my favourite hill although as with all hillclimbs everyone is Very friendly and helpful, lots of good humoured P-taking and great banter.
Being local-ish I commuted both days, the road from Winchester to Salisbury being fairly decent early in the morning!
Good weekend, 1st in class 0.5 in front of another very well driven 600bhp GTR, the 996t doing 105 mph over the line!
Loton Park in June, this is one of the best, if not the best Hill in the UK, decent length with all sorts of corners. Another great weekend with 1st in class of 12 with similar cars at Prescott, 0.4 away from the class record which is definitely on if I can get the car off the line better as I can lose up to 0’5 to some in class.
The front tends to tramp, so I have now, after discussing with those that know better than I, upped the front rebound a bit which after a “test” locally seems to have improved starts.
More events to come.
What’s the 996 like to drive? Thankfully, NO understeer at all, power oversteer is very controllable, at No time at all does it feel it is going to bite you, unlike my old 2.8.
TBH I cannot imagine any other care that does all this so well, I have not driven any GT3 or derivative so cannot vouch for them, but as my car is mainly used on the road, I suspect as a comfy car that is fuss free, comfortable, keeps the wife happy
[ Most important ] decent on fuel [ I get 27 mpg on the way back from Loton ] there would be Nothing for the price I paid that could do all so well.
I am happy to answer any questions here or via pm, these cars really are amazing and I fully encourage you to have a go if you get that itch that track days etc cannot scratch.
cheers
Mark.
The wife did not like the rallying [understatement of the year!! ] but we did do a couple of Hillclimbs in the Mk2 last year which she enjoyed, bonus!
So, after some time, the Escort sold for Very decent money, what to buy next??????
The “new” car had to be decent on the road as I couldn’t be arsed with trailering anymore and competitive ish on the hillclimbs.
I had a list in order of preference of a R5 Turbo 2, Gardner Douglass cobra with monster LS engine, TVR, T350 and a 911 of some sorts!
I quickly ticked off the other cars for various reasons and decided it had to be another 911, as i used to race / rally a road legal [ always driven to events and back ] 2.8 RSR replica which NEVER broke.
Looked at various Air cooled 911’s but the prices, IMO are just plain daft, especially for something modded with plenty of grunt.
Looking through PH used car section like you do, I saw a Very interesting 996 turbo with lots of interesting extras, arranged a view and test drive, suitably impressed and after a brief consultation with the wife, bought the car.
The spec was 2003 factory X50 with KW3 suspension GT3 front brakes, Tubi exhaust system, 997 short shift, sachs 740nm clutch, 20mm rear wheel spacers and 17mm front, sports seats and many good options fitted from new.
In the deal i had miltek manifolds fitted and a re-map, oil and filter and brake fluid change all done by Matt at Fearnsports.
Runs 1.4 bar boost and does go well! Not sure on power, been told 550 ish, but the torque is immense, Matt says could be 580 ish!
It had an almost new set of PS2’s fitted which are good tyres for the road. On a particular cold fresh winter drive the clutch stated to slip, quick chat to the dealer and we agree they would pay toward a new 890nm clutch which I took to Matt’s to be fitted, MUCH better, no slip, but now, wheelspin! IMO the standard set up with no rear LSD is poor, using the brakes to control slippage with that amount of torque was not beneficial to forward movement.
So, after a chat to my old mate Bob Watson, he fitted a Wavetrack Diff to the rear, now it just goes but the car will move around under power, so I understand why Porsche did not fit one, however this does not bother me.
I also acquired another set of wheels and fitted them with Kumho’s excellent V700 road legal list 1b race tyre.
What with this year’s Hillclimbing season approaching fast I thought it best to have a proper play with the 996t so booked Curborough for ½ a day, IMO the perfect place to get to know your car’s limits.
Blimy the grip was VERY impressive so much so I could not stay in my seat, as I do not wish to alter the interior of the car I fitted a quick release full harness safety belt which stopped me falling out of the seat !
1st Hillclimb, Prescott April, fastest in class in practise 0.8 off the record, but made a mistake on my final run to finish 3rd, 0.5 from 1st. 15 cars in the class, another 997 t, Subaru’s, Evos, lotus etc a good selection of fast road cars, although some are trailered.
I entered a Sprint at Goodwood in May just for fun as its long time I had driven around there without numerous artificial chicanes. Great fun, the 996t REALLY coming into its own on the fast flowing track, 160 mph being recorded at the end of the Lavent strait!
2nd in class behind a very rapid latest spec GTR by 0.9, 3 seconds in front of a GT3 with a time from a standing start of 1.28.7, almost 100 mph average, not bad for a comfy air conditioned road car!!
Gurston down in May, not my favourite hill although as with all hillclimbs everyone is Very friendly and helpful, lots of good humoured P-taking and great banter.
Being local-ish I commuted both days, the road from Winchester to Salisbury being fairly decent early in the morning!
Good weekend, 1st in class 0.5 in front of another very well driven 600bhp GTR, the 996t doing 105 mph over the line!
Loton Park in June, this is one of the best, if not the best Hill in the UK, decent length with all sorts of corners. Another great weekend with 1st in class of 12 with similar cars at Prescott, 0.4 away from the class record which is definitely on if I can get the car off the line better as I can lose up to 0’5 to some in class.
The front tends to tramp, so I have now, after discussing with those that know better than I, upped the front rebound a bit which after a “test” locally seems to have improved starts.
More events to come.
What’s the 996 like to drive? Thankfully, NO understeer at all, power oversteer is very controllable, at No time at all does it feel it is going to bite you, unlike my old 2.8.
TBH I cannot imagine any other care that does all this so well, I have not driven any GT3 or derivative so cannot vouch for them, but as my car is mainly used on the road, I suspect as a comfy car that is fuss free, comfortable, keeps the wife happy
[ Most important ] decent on fuel [ I get 27 mpg on the way back from Loton ] there would be Nothing for the price I paid that could do all so well.
I am happy to answer any questions here or via pm, these cars really are amazing and I fully encourage you to have a go if you get that itch that track days etc cannot scratch.
cheers
Mark.
All going to plan I will be at Shelsley August 15th /16th
Can’t say re the brakes better as I have not driven another 996t, but for a 1560 kg car it stops well.
Yes, I did compare with the other Porsches at Loton, like you do, I was 2nd fastest Porsche O/A beaten by a very quick little 3.0lt 2.8 RSR replica that was running on Avon super sticky hillclimb slicks, I was the fastest road legal spec car. Saturday in the rain was “fun”, like you say Dam slippy!
Have a go, no matter what in, Hillclimbing is great fun, with the timing system used with all your splits, speeds etc you can understand where you can make up time loose it etc and what driving “style” works.
I bought a 4 point harness from Demon Tweeks, comes with eye bolts that replace the standard seat belt anchorage bolts, so you just clip it in. Mine has a rear release from the back stays as well handy for moving the rear seat up/down.
Car is GREAT fun
Can’t say re the brakes better as I have not driven another 996t, but for a 1560 kg car it stops well.
Yes, I did compare with the other Porsches at Loton, like you do, I was 2nd fastest Porsche O/A beaten by a very quick little 3.0lt 2.8 RSR replica that was running on Avon super sticky hillclimb slicks, I was the fastest road legal spec car. Saturday in the rain was “fun”, like you say Dam slippy!
Have a go, no matter what in, Hillclimbing is great fun, with the timing system used with all your splits, speeds etc you can understand where you can make up time loose it etc and what driving “style” works.
I bought a 4 point harness from Demon Tweeks, comes with eye bolts that replace the standard seat belt anchorage bolts, so you just clip it in. Mine has a rear release from the back stays as well handy for moving the rear seat up/down.
Car is GREAT fun
Yellow491 said:
Yes, I did compare with the other Porsches at Loton, like you do, I was 2nd fastest Porsche O/A beaten by a very quick little 3.0lt 2.8 RSR replica that was running on Avon super sticky hillclimb slicks, I was the fastest road legal spec car. Saturday in the rain was “fun”, like you say Dam slippy!??
The slicks were not super sticky but soft cross plys,only worth 1% over the modern soft track radial tyres with half the bhp and 500 kg less.
Good to see you out playing,as you say great fun and very competative if you want it to be,i am sure robert will get to grips with his 997 turbo as soon as
OK, I know who you are now :-) Another Porsche chap told me about your tyres, I just saw the Avon marks on them The slicks were not super sticky but soft cross plys,only worth 1% over the modern soft track radial tyres with half the bhp and 500 kg less.
Good to see you out playing,as you say great fun and very competative if you want it to be,i am sure robert will get to grips with his 997 turbo as soon as
I Think Robert is about there already with his turbo Like your car, reminds me of my old car which like yours would have made a VERY effective Hillclimb Car, 296 bhp, 970 kgs, photo taken 1988
RWD cossie wil said:
Hi Mark, great write up & just goes to show what a capable car the turbo is! I'm smitten with mine, but next upgrade for me is brakes as my standard ones didn't like the nurburgring very much at all, however I am running circa 600Bhp!
I'd be really interested to hear more about your diff, costs involved & how it's affected the handling characteristics.
The Diff was £1100, a Very nice piece of kit. Bob fitted it for me plus a few other little jobs for about the same money, just to fit I would say £400 ish, he fitted it in situ.I'd be really interested to hear more about your diff, costs involved & how it's affected the handling characteristics.
Handling is fantastic, NO understeer, and great traction, but as said, in 1st and 2nd and sometimes 3rd if its not too grippy the arse will move around a bit, but not in an un-predicable way.
Just returned from the Channel Island hillclimbs, what a HUGE amount of fun they are
Saw a lovely 997 turbo in light blue with ceramics down in Bouley Bay the day before the hillclimb which is on the Thursday, pity it was not competing.
The Hill at Bouley is superb, the start line right outside the Black Dog Pub, with suitably inebriated spectators cheering you on!
A great section of cars, the locals all VERY friendly and helpful, not to mention the loons on there motorbikes, great fun to watch.
Unfortunately I was the only one in my class, but I still managed a win!
A new class record was some consolation though.
Sadly one of the top single seater competitors had a disagreement with a large tree which put him in hospital, thankfully he is ok but will take a time to mend. The event stopped after that understandably so.
Guernsey on the Saturday up Val Des Terres, one hell over a place, a bit like driving up a helter-skelter, difficult to get right, on virtually bald rear tyres made for quite a few "skids" resulting in a class win.
Loads of spectators at both climbs, clearly seen in this photo at the finish line in Guernsey,
The paddock in St Peter Port was right on the coastline, not only another great selection of cars and bikes romping up the hill, but in the bay there was a power boat race as well, a true petrol heads dream
On the Sunday in St Peter Port there was a motoring bonanza with bikes doing an auto test and a superb stunt bike [ who was also at the hillclimb ] many vehicles on display military, supercars and classics.
There was quite a few Porsches, in particular another V nice yellow 997 t, a white 997 GT2, and a black 997 GT3, hopefully they get off the Island frequently to open them up
Cheers
Saw a lovely 997 turbo in light blue with ceramics down in Bouley Bay the day before the hillclimb which is on the Thursday, pity it was not competing.
The Hill at Bouley is superb, the start line right outside the Black Dog Pub, with suitably inebriated spectators cheering you on!
A great section of cars, the locals all VERY friendly and helpful, not to mention the loons on there motorbikes, great fun to watch.
Unfortunately I was the only one in my class, but I still managed a win!
A new class record was some consolation though.
Sadly one of the top single seater competitors had a disagreement with a large tree which put him in hospital, thankfully he is ok but will take a time to mend. The event stopped after that understandably so.
Guernsey on the Saturday up Val Des Terres, one hell over a place, a bit like driving up a helter-skelter, difficult to get right, on virtually bald rear tyres made for quite a few "skids" resulting in a class win.
Loads of spectators at both climbs, clearly seen in this photo at the finish line in Guernsey,
The paddock in St Peter Port was right on the coastline, not only another great selection of cars and bikes romping up the hill, but in the bay there was a power boat race as well, a true petrol heads dream
On the Sunday in St Peter Port there was a motoring bonanza with bikes doing an auto test and a superb stunt bike [ who was also at the hillclimb ] many vehicles on display military, supercars and classics.
There was quite a few Porsches, in particular another V nice yellow 997 t, a white 997 GT2, and a black 997 GT3, hopefully they get off the Island frequently to open them up
Cheers
Well done, and good to see you out.
My next event is Shelsley August 15th /16th with a VERY strong entry in my class so Really looking forward to it. Hillclimbing takes some time to get the best out of your car due to trying to find those last 10ths, the times come with enough practise.
I was at a wet and windy Wiscombe park last weekend, a beautiful place and an awesome climb. On my last run my 996t popped out of second gear all on its own much to my surprise ! After I figured out what happened I then put it back in 4th! Eventually back into second, but the damage had been done time wise, I lost out to 1st by just over a second to Roy Bray in his superb Escort Cosworth.
Car is now with Matt at Fearnsport to re do the 2nd gear bulk ring and fit an uprated detent that will prevent this happening again. Fortunately Matt found one of the Alley water tubes just starting to weep near the engine, so there being changed as well.
Hope to see you out soon.
cheers
My next event is Shelsley August 15th /16th with a VERY strong entry in my class so Really looking forward to it. Hillclimbing takes some time to get the best out of your car due to trying to find those last 10ths, the times come with enough practise.
I was at a wet and windy Wiscombe park last weekend, a beautiful place and an awesome climb. On my last run my 996t popped out of second gear all on its own much to my surprise ! After I figured out what happened I then put it back in 4th! Eventually back into second, but the damage had been done time wise, I lost out to 1st by just over a second to Roy Bray in his superb Escort Cosworth.
Car is now with Matt at Fearnsport to re do the 2nd gear bulk ring and fit an uprated detent that will prevent this happening again. Fortunately Matt found one of the Alley water tubes just starting to weep near the engine, so there being changed as well.
Hope to see you out soon.
cheers
Just like to say a HUGE thank you to Matt at Fearnsports for all his stirling work in fixing my 2nd gear and replacing several water pipes and a few other little jobs, many thanks Matt
All Ready for Shelsley next weekend now, a cracking entry in my class so really looking forward to returning there after 18 years!
All Ready for Shelsley next weekend now, a cracking entry in my class so really looking forward to returning there after 18 years!
Had a Very good day at Shelsley just gone, great to be back, the place just oozes atmosphere. A full entry with some stunning cars and 16 in my class ranging from Audi TT's, loti, TVR, GTR, Evos, Scoobies etc, and myself and Robert in our Turbo's
Biggest surprise was Al and David who do the PH articles on different cars at each round in there ENORMOUS Audi S8, my god that thing was fast for what it is, well driven as well, almost 2 ton and 0-64' in 1.98 secs
The weather was almost prefect and I have never seen sooooo many spectators up a hill, car park was full with many lovely cars as well, a true PH's nirvana!
Your all be pleased to know that Porsche came out on top, with myself 1st with a new class record of 31.50, with Robert 3rd who had to miss his second run due to having to attend a wedding! [ not his own I might add ]
Photo borrowed [ thank you ] from the club motorsport section.
P.S Some YT footage of most of the class https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URCRZZoX2p8
Biggest surprise was Al and David who do the PH articles on different cars at each round in there ENORMOUS Audi S8, my god that thing was fast for what it is, well driven as well, almost 2 ton and 0-64' in 1.98 secs
The weather was almost prefect and I have never seen sooooo many spectators up a hill, car park was full with many lovely cars as well, a true PH's nirvana!
Your all be pleased to know that Porsche came out on top, with myself 1st with a new class record of 31.50, with Robert 3rd who had to miss his second run due to having to attend a wedding! [ not his own I might add ]
Photo borrowed [ thank you ] from the club motorsport section.
P.S Some YT footage of most of the class https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URCRZZoX2p8
Edited by Mark A S on Tuesday 18th August 12:29
Top weekend just gone by at Prescott Hillclimb, fabulous weather on the Sunday and some great competition.
My first timed run, was going well until i was red flagged at the last bend, semi circle due to what appeard to be a small piece of black plastic. Appologies to the Marshall after i rather rudely said " is that it" much to the amusment of onlookers
Anyway, i then thought, great i will get a re-run on warm tyres, so strait back out and off for another crack.
Good start and LOADS of grip into the first fast left [ Orchard? ] a nice tidy run. Could not believe the time after the finish of a 46.08, new class record,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, so,,,,,,,,,,,,,, many thanks to whoever deposited the "debris"
That's it for me this year now, the 996T has been ace all year, the new RSS engine mounts have not eliminated the tramping off the line but have improved it enabling me to pull away gently ish at first then floor it, result my best 0 to 64 ft time of 2.34 at Prescott.
Photos to come if and when.
cheers
My first timed run, was going well until i was red flagged at the last bend, semi circle due to what appeard to be a small piece of black plastic. Appologies to the Marshall after i rather rudely said " is that it" much to the amusment of onlookers
Anyway, i then thought, great i will get a re-run on warm tyres, so strait back out and off for another crack.
Good start and LOADS of grip into the first fast left [ Orchard? ] a nice tidy run. Could not believe the time after the finish of a 46.08, new class record,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, so,,,,,,,,,,,,,, many thanks to whoever deposited the "debris"
That's it for me this year now, the 996T has been ace all year, the new RSS engine mounts have not eliminated the tramping off the line but have improved it enabling me to pull away gently ish at first then floor it, result my best 0 to 64 ft time of 2.34 at Prescott.
Photos to come if and when.
cheers
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