New member, old cerb
Discussion
Hello chaps,
Just bought a 4.2 off a member on here. Genuine guy, unfortunately after 400 miles I suffered a near simultaneous master and slave clutch failure! How annoying. Changed the master unit, drove 1 mile and lost clutch again. Got to a friends race car building garage a few miles down the road and found fluid coming out of the bell housing.
Ordered a new slave assembly, was thinking of just doing the seals but may as well tick it off as never been replaced according to history.
So then, it drives like a cerb should so I am told, but I find it a bit weak. I have an E39 M5 and although I haven't had the chance to put them side by side yet, which I will do, i'd say the M is quicker, and on paper it shouldn't be.
I am going to keep the car and as such have the following planned;
HID light upgrade but keep the lights original style.
Brake and possible wheel size increase as the standard brakes are shocking unless there is a problem with them, but the previous keeper agrees they are not very good!
Interior update, not sure of what exactly yet, but probably a full leather re trim, I hear there is a pic thread on here somewhere which may give some ideas.
The chassis is good so minimal work required.
Engine management update to include twin turbo conversion, looking for 500bhp, so full ecu, knock senors, manifolds, intercooler, injectors e.t.c!
Should be a great project and the car will be fantastic, it is good now but I thought it was going to scare me silly. The brakes are especially disappointing!
The car is going on a dyno next week once the slave is fixed so I will let you all know if you are interested what it's putting out.
Given the above it has lovely ACT performance headers with barely any miles on them which are going to be available for someone around jan/feb time so bare that in mind if you are thinking of going for them.
I look forward to getting to know you all and hope you are all interested in what I have planned for the car!
Just bought a 4.2 off a member on here. Genuine guy, unfortunately after 400 miles I suffered a near simultaneous master and slave clutch failure! How annoying. Changed the master unit, drove 1 mile and lost clutch again. Got to a friends race car building garage a few miles down the road and found fluid coming out of the bell housing.
Ordered a new slave assembly, was thinking of just doing the seals but may as well tick it off as never been replaced according to history.
So then, it drives like a cerb should so I am told, but I find it a bit weak. I have an E39 M5 and although I haven't had the chance to put them side by side yet, which I will do, i'd say the M is quicker, and on paper it shouldn't be.
I am going to keep the car and as such have the following planned;
HID light upgrade but keep the lights original style.
Brake and possible wheel size increase as the standard brakes are shocking unless there is a problem with them, but the previous keeper agrees they are not very good!
Interior update, not sure of what exactly yet, but probably a full leather re trim, I hear there is a pic thread on here somewhere which may give some ideas.
The chassis is good so minimal work required.
Engine management update to include twin turbo conversion, looking for 500bhp, so full ecu, knock senors, manifolds, intercooler, injectors e.t.c!
Should be a great project and the car will be fantastic, it is good now but I thought it was going to scare me silly. The brakes are especially disappointing!
The car is going on a dyno next week once the slave is fixed so I will let you all know if you are interested what it's putting out.
Given the above it has lovely ACT performance headers with barely any miles on them which are going to be available for someone around jan/feb time so bare that in mind if you are thinking of going for them.
I look forward to getting to know you all and hope you are all interested in what I have planned for the car!
coco79 said:
Who is doing your twin turbo conversion? 
Hi coco,I will be doing it myself except for the electronics which will be done by a company called MTEC who make management systems for various setups and also custom work, so they will be taking care of the electronics side and i'll be doing the fab! They are going to use mine as a proto to run the flat plane on their software.
It's tricky to tell which is quicker. The 0-60 times are close and I haven't had a good chance to test the Cerbera out yet. I'll be doing a little 10-100 test on a runway on monday or Tuesday with them both together which I'll film if anyone is interested!
It's going on the dyno as soon as slave is fixed so probably Tues/wed.
I'll be checking the servo etc on monday when I get access as it's on ramps in a garage at the moment and they are racing this weekend so I can't get to her!
It's going on the dyno as soon as slave is fixed so probably Tues/wed.
I'll be checking the servo etc on monday when I get access as it's on ramps in a garage at the moment and they are racing this weekend so I can't get to her!
Byker28i said:
This, 4.2 cerb will have 340bhp ish in standard form E39 M5 about 380, but the M5 weighs 500Kg more, which is quite significant on a light car. If it isn't running right then this would be the first port of call.
Brakes, probably just brake compound. Get some CL pads from Brummie.
Who's 4.2 did you buy?
I have N7GTX's car.Brakes, probably just brake compound. Get some CL pads from Brummie.
Who's 4.2 did you buy?
I may be wrong about the car. I have just watched a little video I did of pickup between 80 - 100 and it looks pretty rapid.
They deliver power completely differently so it is hard to tell. I'm not saying it's slow by any means. It may just be the TVR folklore that I was expecting too much! I don't find the M5 quick anymore though so it's probably just me!
Any suggestions for interior colours if I go for the full refit?
They deliver power completely differently so it is hard to tell. I'm not saying it's slow by any means. It may just be the TVR folklore that I was expecting too much! I don't find the M5 quick anymore though so it's probably just me!
Any suggestions for interior colours if I go for the full refit?
jamieduff1981 said:
As above. Even a mediocre performing Cerb will make an E39 M5 look positively pensionable. Likewise, Cerb brakes should have no trouble in locking up good quality tyres in the dry.
I would honestly suggest putting the twin turbo idea to one side until you have had some insight in to the existing defects because neither brakes nor engine sound even close to being right.
By the way - I had the same clutch fun and games as you, albeit on my drive home from buying it. It was useful to get to know how the car is put together to be honest I didn't exactly see it that way at the time!
P.S. you'll get to the bottom of the engine running problems very much faster if you enlist the help of one of a few experts on the subject such as Joolz (Kits and Classics) or Dom at Powers. I know many like to tinker, myself included but it's worth getting AJP experience involved if the car is as slow as you describe. An E39 M5 really shouldn't be worrying a Cerbera.
Hi Jamie, thanks for that, as above will be checking the servo on the brakes out tomorrow and work from there. Once clutch is fixed the M and Cerb will be having a little roll on, then the cerb will be on the dyno on tuesday or wednesday. I may be wrong about the cerb, it's pretty hard to tell as the M has so much torque.I would honestly suggest putting the twin turbo idea to one side until you have had some insight in to the existing defects because neither brakes nor engine sound even close to being right.
By the way - I had the same clutch fun and games as you, albeit on my drive home from buying it. It was useful to get to know how the car is put together to be honest
I didn't exactly see it that way at the time!P.S. you'll get to the bottom of the engine running problems very much faster if you enlist the help of one of a few experts on the subject such as Joolz (Kits and Classics) or Dom at Powers. I know many like to tinker, myself included but it's worth getting AJP experience involved if the car is as slow as you describe. An E39 M5 really shouldn't be worrying a Cerbera.
Edited by jamieduff1981 on Sunday 5th October 02:16
The guys I work with for engine management are very very good. They mapped a stock cerbie hill climb car which is fastest in class so they know what they are doing.
Hi Byker,
My chap wasn't keen on touching the mbe ecu, are there people who will? quite bizarre curve isn't it.
I think the cam timing is probably off also, there is 60k on the clock and chain has probably stretched a fair bit. Also using a fair whack of oil so guides, seals and rings are probably not brilliant.
Your torque comes in much later than mine, i'm between 300 and 320 between 2500 to 5500 then dropping quick. Yours is hitting 300 at 3500 but staying above 300 till 6700ish then only dropping to 275 at redline.
very rich smell of fuel in the dyno cell also.
I'm west wales based but travel to cardiff and m4 sometimes, who's my best contact for further investigation?
My chap wasn't keen on touching the mbe ecu, are there people who will? quite bizarre curve isn't it.
I think the cam timing is probably off also, there is 60k on the clock and chain has probably stretched a fair bit. Also using a fair whack of oil so guides, seals and rings are probably not brilliant.
Your torque comes in much later than mine, i'm between 300 and 320 between 2500 to 5500 then dropping quick. Yours is hitting 300 at 3500 but staying above 300 till 6700ish then only dropping to 275 at redline.
very rich smell of fuel in the dyno cell also.
I'm west wales based but travel to cardiff and m4 sometimes, who's my best contact for further investigation?
N7GTX said:
gruffalo said:
those traces looks all over the place and a noisy throttle pot or something similar could cause that, so could a failing coil pack, the software will help you diagnose the issues.
The coil packs are new - not cheap Chinese either - (had only done around 600 mile) and the throttle pots are brand new items from Clevor Trevor (about a month old). The lambdas are new NGK, the plug leads are 8mm and new. The plugs are NGK and as new.As for the comment, 'neglected', I spent £4,000 in 12 months and the previous owner just under £7,000 and he covered around 1,500 miles I think. All the work for him was done by a TVR dealer up Selby way (according to the invoices).
The car was virtually unused for 4 years. So all the hassle that Scerbera has had - the heatshield held on with self tappers, the screws not coming out of the housing and suchlike - just shows how good some of these specialists really are.
The brakes may well have a tired servo but I never tracked the car and having nothing to compare it with they seemed fine to me. Always managed to stop okay but then I didn't drive like Lewis. On the MOT - 6 weeks or so ago - the tester said they were balanced and pulled a good reading on his brake tester, except the handbrake of course. This was not a 'TVR Friendly MOT Station' either so to achieve CO of 0.08, HC somewhere around 20ppm (can't remember the exact figure) and Lambda of 1.02 for a neglected engine is nonsense.
Agree with Jamie. Needs to go to the top people for the correct advice.
Edited by N7GTX on Friday 10th October 17:20
The dyno trace is similar to bykers first when bought but not the same issue I think.
I am going to put her away for winter soon so will check all the grounds, valve clearances, possibly have the head off and check the valves e.t.c
Unless anyone else has any suggestions to look at?
gruffalo said:
8mm plug leads you say, I think we may have just found the issue.
Cerbs don't like 8mm leads, there have been many threads about miss fires after people have fitted new plugs and leads, often magnecor leads, for some reason they cause a problem not on every car but on many.
Very interesting and thanks for the response. They are cheap enough to try!Cerbs don't like 8mm leads, there have been many threads about miss fires after people have fitted new plugs and leads, often magnecor leads, for some reason they cause a problem not on every car but on many.
Thanks Gruffalo, I have ordered a set so will see if I can notice a difference. Will try a new lead prior and if app works can compare before and after.
It does rather smell of fuel especially on the dyno.
Another question, how much oil should they use?
It seems to be going through it, the oil pressure gauge drops to zero after around 300 miles when your going down a hill, I have then topped up and it's then fine. No obvious oil leak, I'm not familiar with the oil pickup on this engine, is it a problem commonly reported?
There is a little smoke when pushed hard above 5k and a fair bit on the over run between 5 and 6k but nothing too bad. Could be worn guides or stem seals.
I'm also wondering if it's getting pulled through the breather which I haven't investigated.
I'm not talking litres but probably 300 ml I've put in 2 or three times in 1000 miles.
It does rather smell of fuel especially on the dyno.
Another question, how much oil should they use?
It seems to be going through it, the oil pressure gauge drops to zero after around 300 miles when your going down a hill, I have then topped up and it's then fine. No obvious oil leak, I'm not familiar with the oil pickup on this engine, is it a problem commonly reported?
There is a little smoke when pushed hard above 5k and a fair bit on the over run between 5 and 6k but nothing too bad. Could be worn guides or stem seals.
I'm also wondering if it's getting pulled through the breather which I haven't investigated.
I'm not talking litres but probably 300 ml I've put in 2 or three times in 1000 miles.
Link attached to recording of ecu diagnostic software.
Lambda 2 looks faulty, Lambda 1 was jumping around a fair bit also.
Which side do they call bank 1 or 2 on the engine, and also please give me your thoughts on the vid.
Many thanks
http://youtu.be/cdja_n6oxDc
Lambda 2 looks faulty, Lambda 1 was jumping around a fair bit also.
Which side do they call bank 1 or 2 on the engine, and also please give me your thoughts on the vid.
Many thanks
http://youtu.be/cdja_n6oxDc
Edited by scerbera on Saturday 18th October 13:58
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