2009 N54 335i - Rough Idle and misfiring when cold
Discussion
Hi all,
I picked up my 335i on 9th July from a trader some 200 miles away from where I live. All seemed well, save for the alignment being out and a slightly rough idle when cold. It felt as though it was coughing or hiccuping first thing in the morning. I had assumed this to be a characteristic as my old car (also turbocharged direct injection) did the same for the 2 1/2 years I had it..
However a few days later it got much worse as it stuttered badly and thew up an engine management light. It also sounded like a bag of spanners, had no power and shook whenever I touched the throttle. I pulled over and scanned the car with Carista which gave me the following codes:
29D1 Cylinder 5 Misfire
20D0 Cylinder 4 Misfire
29CC Random / Multiple Misfire
After saving the results I restarted the car and all seemed fine again, no engine management light and no major misfires. That evening after work (it was a hot day and parked in the sun) it started 'on the button' and was fine all the way home. This was last week Thursday and I have not driven it since as have been able to get lifts into work with my wife. Using all my will power I am being overly cautious and not playing with my new toy...
I have booked the car into a local specialist for diagnostic work this Friday (soonest they could do). I hope they can diagnose the issue pretty quickly. I shall be looking to get the seller to cover the cost hopefully (they indicate that they probably will) under their 3 month warranty. Obviously I can't just take it back to the seller as that is unpractical.
Having looked online it seems that the most probable cause if cold misfires is injector issues at around £200 each. Does anyone have any experience of this on N54 engines? Are their any other likely candidates that could be the cause of the issue? Is this likely to be covered under the 'warranty' that trade seller's provide?
Thanks for reading and any thoughts would be appreciated. Have posted on BMW forums already but no response as yet.
I picked up my 335i on 9th July from a trader some 200 miles away from where I live. All seemed well, save for the alignment being out and a slightly rough idle when cold. It felt as though it was coughing or hiccuping first thing in the morning. I had assumed this to be a characteristic as my old car (also turbocharged direct injection) did the same for the 2 1/2 years I had it..
However a few days later it got much worse as it stuttered badly and thew up an engine management light. It also sounded like a bag of spanners, had no power and shook whenever I touched the throttle. I pulled over and scanned the car with Carista which gave me the following codes:
29D1 Cylinder 5 Misfire
20D0 Cylinder 4 Misfire
29CC Random / Multiple Misfire
After saving the results I restarted the car and all seemed fine again, no engine management light and no major misfires. That evening after work (it was a hot day and parked in the sun) it started 'on the button' and was fine all the way home. This was last week Thursday and I have not driven it since as have been able to get lifts into work with my wife. Using all my will power I am being overly cautious and not playing with my new toy...
I have booked the car into a local specialist for diagnostic work this Friday (soonest they could do). I hope they can diagnose the issue pretty quickly. I shall be looking to get the seller to cover the cost hopefully (they indicate that they probably will) under their 3 month warranty. Obviously I can't just take it back to the seller as that is unpractical.
Having looked online it seems that the most probable cause if cold misfires is injector issues at around £200 each. Does anyone have any experience of this on N54 engines? Are their any other likely candidates that could be the cause of the issue? Is this likely to be covered under the 'warranty' that trade seller's provide?
Thanks for reading and any thoughts would be appreciated. Have posted on BMW forums already but no response as yet.
GregK2 said:
Just asking as I know owners of other turbocharged cars that have recently had rough idle from cold using V-power which has mysteriously disappeared after using Tesco 99. It's a long shot though. Your injector suggestion is probably more plausible.
Interesting, I had not heard that before! Might look into this further. I had heard something like that and I know BMW USA had a further recalls. My build date was November 2009 so outside any recalls.
If only I had bought my BMW warranty earlier, doesn't kick in to August (as it is a lapsed warranty). Otherwise it would be so much easier to sort it out!
If only I had bought my BMW warranty earlier, doesn't kick in to August (as it is a lapsed warranty). Otherwise it would be so much easier to sort it out!
They were definitely there at point of sale so confident about that, it will be a case of how easy or hard it is to get the money from them! Cant wait to have it all resolved, so frustrating to have it just sat there waiting to be driven!
I know injectors are not wear and tear, but if it's just plugs and coils they surely will be?
I know injectors are not wear and tear, but if it's just plugs and coils they surely will be?
Edited by MikeTFSI on Wednesday 20th July 18:21
Thanks, really useful stuff on autotrader about the change in law last October
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/content/advice/how-doe...
This makes it much easier for me to seek redress or, worst case scenario, seek a refund from the seller for full asking price.
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/content/advice/how-doe...
This makes it much easier for me to seek redress or, worst case scenario, seek a refund from the seller for full asking price.
It's going to a very highly regarded BMW specialist in Lincoln for diagnostics, so will ask for a once over to check for other issues.
I started the car up this evening and it was spluttering when idling, even when the idle dropped to 600rpm it fluctuated back up to 750rpm and was coughing a little. I've got to use it tomorrow then it's being dropped off for diagnostics. They will have it overnight so will be able to see how it is at stone cold.
Will update the thread when I get some results.
I started the car up this evening and it was spluttering when idling, even when the idle dropped to 600rpm it fluctuated back up to 750rpm and was coughing a little. I've got to use it tomorrow then it's being dropped off for diagnostics. They will have it overnight so will be able to see how it is at stone cold.
Will update the thread when I get some results.
Just by way of update,
Injectors 2 and 4 are knackered so need replacing. Garage correctly recommended all 6 and plugs and total cost including labour, vat and diagnostic check is £1754.
The seller won't return my calls and every time I ring the manager is on his way in and of course will ring me ASAP. I know I'm being fobbed off here but running out of options.
Am putting something in writing to them shortly but that won't illicit a response any quicker I'm sure. I would pay them a visit, but that would be 7 hours of driving in a car that shouldnt be driven. Any ideas?
Injectors 2 and 4 are knackered so need replacing. Garage correctly recommended all 6 and plugs and total cost including labour, vat and diagnostic check is £1754.
The seller won't return my calls and every time I ring the manager is on his way in and of course will ring me ASAP. I know I'm being fobbed off here but running out of options.
Am putting something in writing to them shortly but that won't illicit a response any quicker I'm sure. I would pay them a visit, but that would be 7 hours of driving in a car that shouldnt be driven. Any ideas?
Thanks for the advice guys, bmw say no recalls or quality enhancements apply to my car. I have tried!
Rejecting the car is an option, but for that to work they would need to answer the phone! I can't see them handing any money over at present, either to pay for the repair or a refund.
Legal action is an option, but an expensive and time consuming option. I have solicitor friends who I will talk to, but I guess the reality is that it would cost me more than I will gain back.
At present I will be putting my position to them in writing and then seeking advice from Trading Standards. Who knows, they might come good in the end....
I guess I can't name and shame, but if you were to look for 'prestige' cars for sale in Bristol you might find them.
Rejecting the car is an option, but for that to work they would need to answer the phone! I can't see them handing any money over at present, either to pay for the repair or a refund.
Legal action is an option, but an expensive and time consuming option. I have solicitor friends who I will talk to, but I guess the reality is that it would cost me more than I will gain back.
At present I will be putting my position to them in writing and then seeking advice from Trading Standards. Who knows, they might come good in the end....
I guess I can't name and shame, but if you were to look for 'prestige' cars for sale in Bristol you might find them.
Thanks, HPFP was changed in 2012 so at least that was done.
I have found out a lot about this trader now, whilst they trade under one name now, they have often used differing ones and the reviews on Google really tell the story.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?client=ms-android-...
I have found out a lot about this trader now, whilst they trade under one name now, they have often used differing ones and the reviews on Google really tell the story.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?client=ms-android-...
Diagnostics showed the codes that I know were generated on 14th July 2016 when the misfires became so bad that the ecu shut down cylinders 4 and 5 to protect itself.
Other codes still present in Ecu from previous faults with DSC system that are not current, alarm battery fault and that the battery was disconnected sometime in the past.
I want to avoid legal proceedings as I work I
Law and I know that this has to be the last resort for all concerned. Only solicitors win haha.
I will be involving trading standards if I need to.
However, whilst I can't speak to them, my wife has managed it. Still fobbing us off and not phoning back when they promise to, but have asked for the problem in writing so maybe a step forward.
The have been told that if I do not have this problem resolved I will be rejecting the car for a full refund. They did not like this at all but seemed to take it seriously, which they might as well as I am deadly serious now. Of course the car is not drivable for that distance in present condition so would need to be transported at their expense.
I really want this car to be fixed, but I have has enough of this stress so must be live to the option of hunting around for another car.
I will say that if they do come good I will be fair and post that outcome. We shall see....
Other codes still present in Ecu from previous faults with DSC system that are not current, alarm battery fault and that the battery was disconnected sometime in the past.
I want to avoid legal proceedings as I work I
Law and I know that this has to be the last resort for all concerned. Only solicitors win haha.
I will be involving trading standards if I need to.
However, whilst I can't speak to them, my wife has managed it. Still fobbing us off and not phoning back when they promise to, but have asked for the problem in writing so maybe a step forward.
The have been told that if I do not have this problem resolved I will be rejecting the car for a full refund. They did not like this at all but seemed to take it seriously, which they might as well as I am deadly serious now. Of course the car is not drivable for that distance in present condition so would need to be transported at their expense.
I really want this car to be fixed, but I have has enough of this stress so must be live to the option of hunting around for another car.
I will say that if they do come good I will be fair and post that outcome. We shall see....
Thanks for the advice. I have selected a local specialist to do the work:
Forrest Motors in Lincoln, as they are highly regarded and have diagnosed the issue already.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=forrest+motors+l...
Situation has been put in writing to the seller and hopefully they will respond. I really want to keep the car but I have to be willing to let if go if need be.
Forrest Motors in Lincoln, as they are highly regarded and have diagnosed the issue already.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=forrest+motors+l...
Situation has been put in writing to the seller and hopefully they will respond. I really want to keep the car but I have to be willing to let if go if need be.
Edited by MikeTFSI on Monday 25th July 12:20
Further update if anyone is still reading my ramblings haha....
Useful but predicable advice from Trading Standards:
1. Put the complaint in writing to seller and send this recorded delivery (previously I sent emails)
Include in the letter:
2. Advise them that I sought legal advice from Trading Standards and that I have been advised that the Consumer Rights Act 2015 gives me:
a. right to argue the car is not of a satisfactory quality or free from fault,
b. That I am entitled to seek short term right to reject within 30 days if goods are faulty (onus is on me to prove that the issue is not fair wear and tear) or;
c. Give opportunity to repair or replace (they should be able to inspect the vehicle and it would be my responsibility to transport the vehicle to them as I collected this);
d. Clarify if they are a member of an 'alternative dispute resolution' scheme.
3. If no further response then seek further advice from Trading Standards under the reference above.
Useful but predicable advice from Trading Standards:
1. Put the complaint in writing to seller and send this recorded delivery (previously I sent emails)
Include in the letter:
2. Advise them that I sought legal advice from Trading Standards and that I have been advised that the Consumer Rights Act 2015 gives me:
a. right to argue the car is not of a satisfactory quality or free from fault,
b. That I am entitled to seek short term right to reject within 30 days if goods are faulty (onus is on me to prove that the issue is not fair wear and tear) or;
c. Give opportunity to repair or replace (they should be able to inspect the vehicle and it would be my responsibility to transport the vehicle to them as I collected this);
d. Clarify if they are a member of an 'alternative dispute resolution' scheme.
3. If no further response then seek further advice from Trading Standards under the reference above.
Very interesting. It is indeed a black, manual LCI 3 series. What made you pass it over? Familiarity with the seller maybe haha?
I have a Mondial extended warranty too... That kicks in on 6th August and I would guess it would be tricky / dishonest to convince them that this is not a pre-existing fault.
I have a Mondial extended warranty too... That kicks in on 6th August and I would guess it would be tricky / dishonest to convince them that this is not a pre-existing fault.
Have finally succumbed and booked the car in for the work to be done at local BMW dealer. Including an oil change + filter change the total damage is £1818.46 aftet discount. From my back pocket....
I just simply cannot do without a car anymore, so need it done. I will be naming and shaming soon, all over the internet and leaving reviews wherever I can. These cowboys must be dealt with.
I will also be reporting to trading standards and the new ombudsman that covers this. Hopefully someone else will be spared from these dodgy dealers.
On the plus side I will finally have a working car again! Haven't driven it for weeks so can't wait to have it running again.
I just simply cannot do without a car anymore, so need it done. I will be naming and shaming soon, all over the internet and leaving reviews wherever I can. These cowboys must be dealt with.
I will also be reporting to trading standards and the new ombudsman that covers this. Hopefully someone else will be spared from these dodgy dealers.
On the plus side I will finally have a working car again! Haven't driven it for weeks so can't wait to have it running again.
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