New bike incoming - Triumph Daytona T595
Discussion
Well, after a lot of looking, and trying to decide what I want, I've put a deposit down on a T595 Daytona. It's been my dream bike since I first saw one, and although I recently had decided to get a 955i Speed Triple, I really wanted the Daytona. Well, the sums worked heavily in the T595's favour, which is to my benefit. Comparing like for like bikes, you get a lot more T595 for your money than you do Speed Triple, and the insurance is only slightly more expensive on the Daytona which still leaves me quids in, with the bike I had really wanted...
I'm hoping to get it picked up next week, once it's had the usual dealer prep work and new MOT. It's in Scarborough, which means I'll have to work out transportation down there and take my time for a pleasant ride back - fingers crossed it doesn't f
king rain on collection day! If worst came to worst, I could have it shipped to me at £200.
It's getting that late in the season now, it'll soon be tucked up for winter with an Optimate hooked up to it!
I'm hoping to get it picked up next week, once it's had the usual dealer prep work and new MOT. It's in Scarborough, which means I'll have to work out transportation down there and take my time for a pleasant ride back - fingers crossed it doesn't f
king rain on collection day! If worst came to worst, I could have it shipped to me at £200.It's getting that late in the season now, it'll soon be tucked up for winter with an Optimate hooked up to it!
I've read up on the starter sprag clutch issues. One of the things that was a selling point for the bike was a recent new starter clutch and it's having a new battery fitted before MOT.
What is the best plan for avoiding trouble? I gather that, when the battery runs low, repeatedly trying to turn the engine over on the starter without it firing will loosen bolts on the sprag clutch and can blow the engine up. So the advice is, I gather, that if it won't start, check the battery output first with a multimeter to see what the output is and work out if that's what's causing the issue.
In terms of prevention, I'd be looking to get a Motobatt battery fitted before it goes away for winter, and then keep it on a battery conditioner when it's going to be standing for a while.
I still see a good number of these bikes around and I say, I know a bloke who uses his as a daily bike over the summer, so obviously nothing is terminal.
Just looking forward to getting out for a ride on it now. It comes with an aftermarket carbon can, as well as the standard can, and I also have a colleague who has a spare Triumph race can, so I may end up getting a sexier carbon can fitted and have the mapping adjusted to suit the new pipe - unless I could do that myself with some home software?
What is the best plan for avoiding trouble? I gather that, when the battery runs low, repeatedly trying to turn the engine over on the starter without it firing will loosen bolts on the sprag clutch and can blow the engine up. So the advice is, I gather, that if it won't start, check the battery output first with a multimeter to see what the output is and work out if that's what's causing the issue.
In terms of prevention, I'd be looking to get a Motobatt battery fitted before it goes away for winter, and then keep it on a battery conditioner when it's going to be standing for a while.
I still see a good number of these bikes around and I say, I know a bloke who uses his as a daily bike over the summer, so obviously nothing is terminal.
Just looking forward to getting out for a ride on it now. It comes with an aftermarket carbon can, as well as the standard can, and I also have a colleague who has a spare Triumph race can, so I may end up getting a sexier carbon can fitted and have the mapping adjusted to suit the new pipe - unless I could do that myself with some home software?
Thanks for the tips, lads. I'll look into the rewiring kit and I'll definitely keep an Optimate handy (along with the Motobatt battery). I was speaking to the lad at work today who has one, I know his had suffered a flat battery issue which turned out to be the alarm draining the battery when it was switched off. Aside from that, he's had no real issues over the years and the appraisal of these bikes tends to be 'owned well and built to last', which provides a little reassurance.
I still can't believe they're cheaper than a Speed Triple though, that just doesn't make sense to me, as nice as the contemporary Speed Triple is.
I still can't believe they're cheaper than a Speed Triple though, that just doesn't make sense to me, as nice as the contemporary Speed Triple is.
Insurance sorted this afternoon. What a chew on that was, just trying to get to speak to someone who wanted to take my money!
Luckily, it's sorted now. £484 for a year's cover with legal and pillion provision thrown in. For a first time big bike in your mid 20's, I'm pleased with that. Now, to collect and get it home.
Luckily, it's sorted now. £484 for a year's cover with legal and pillion provision thrown in. For a first time big bike in your mid 20's, I'm pleased with that. Now, to collect and get it home.
Mogsmex said:
you'll love it, best colour Strontium is too 
the high level can and Triumph tune to go with it are a must (pops and farts sorted
)
Yes, all the material I've read advises updating the map after changing the can to make sure the bike is making peak power. One source quotes a lad as having changed his standard exhaust to a race can and found the bike making 80bhp on a dyno, which was quickly remapped to where it should have been. I gather that because there is no Lambda sensor in the exhaust, the bike can't adjust it's fuelling based on what happens after combustion, so it'll run roughly until you update the engine map. the high level can and Triumph tune to go with it are a must (pops and farts sorted
)Pops and bangs from the exhaust, are they characteristic of a bad state of tune caused by swapping the exhaust on a standard map, or does a properly fuelling, remapped T595 with a different exhaust pop and bang too?
Well, this has all come to nothing. The bike is faulty, and I'll be sending it back.
I noticed as I left Scarborough it was running hot. I thought at first that it might just not like traffic, despite being water cooled, and after getting through five minutes worth of tailbacks, I hit the open road and the bike cooled right down, maybe 1/4 reading or less on the temperature gauge. It stayed this way until I got to Gateshead on the way home, which is where the real trouble started. Stuck in traffic on the Felling Bypass, the temperature gauge soared again and steam was shooting out of the back of the bike.
I limped it home, cooling it as it went, rather than stranding it in the heat. Inspection showed that the cap had come off the coolant filler tank, there was coolant splashed around inside where it had boiled over and was dripping down onto the exhaust and swing arm.
I'm guessing, giving the temperature fluctuations and the fact it's boiled the coolant and popped the tank, that it must be a knackered head gasket? I've rang the garage to see if there was an answer machine function as they shut at 1300 hrs, I'm going to email the dealer now and outline the circumstances and see if they'll pick the bike up. I know the first thing to do is usually to give the dealer a chance to make repairs, but I think given the distance between us, they may be amenable to just taking the bike back, refunding me and fixing it in their own time, otherwise the costs of carriage could spiral.
A very disappointing end to the day.
I noticed as I left Scarborough it was running hot. I thought at first that it might just not like traffic, despite being water cooled, and after getting through five minutes worth of tailbacks, I hit the open road and the bike cooled right down, maybe 1/4 reading or less on the temperature gauge. It stayed this way until I got to Gateshead on the way home, which is where the real trouble started. Stuck in traffic on the Felling Bypass, the temperature gauge soared again and steam was shooting out of the back of the bike.
I limped it home, cooling it as it went, rather than stranding it in the heat. Inspection showed that the cap had come off the coolant filler tank, there was coolant splashed around inside where it had boiled over and was dripping down onto the exhaust and swing arm.
I'm guessing, giving the temperature fluctuations and the fact it's boiled the coolant and popped the tank, that it must be a knackered head gasket? I've rang the garage to see if there was an answer machine function as they shut at 1300 hrs, I'm going to email the dealer now and outline the circumstances and see if they'll pick the bike up. I know the first thing to do is usually to give the dealer a chance to make repairs, but I think given the distance between us, they may be amenable to just taking the bike back, refunding me and fixing it in their own time, otherwise the costs of carriage could spiral.
A very disappointing end to the day.
To lighten the mood of misery...
So, aside from the mechanical failure at the end of the day, you might want to know how the rest of the escapade went?
Getting down there took a while, as the fog was so thick that you could often scarcely see more than a car's length in front of you. I was dreading riding back in that, as there were plenty of gumps out and about with no lights on. I discussed with my brother whether or not we should head for the A1 on the way back, and he left it up to me, so I thought we'd brave the A171.
Picking the bike up in Scarborough, my brother sat on the bike before I did and remarked on how low it was at the front. I have to say, at that point I did quickly question the credibility of my plan to buy a bike, starting with an old litre bike and never having ridden a sports bike before. As I sat on it on the forecourt and pulled away to the side of the road to follow my brother out (he was navigating the home leg) I was taken aback by the seating position, but it was remarkably comfortable and after 20 seconds riding down the road I was at home.
I wouldn't say that the bike is uncomfortable. It's not a Goldwing, but it's not a torture device despite it apparently having the look of one when you ride it. I found my hands a little tingly when I got home, and my arse was a bit numb from the hard seat. My hamstrings were tight, but that's off doing a leg session before work yesterday - I've had my cramp riding a CBF600 than I got on the Daytona today! It was a little wristy around town, but I had always assumed that sore wrists would mean you couldn't ride on. This was a little ache, countered by gripping the tank with my knees. I've got a good core, so I never felt like flopping off the bike or giving out. My clutch hand got sore in a traffic jam early on, but I don't intend on spending much time in traffic on the bike.
On the open road, it was mightily impressive. Protection from the fairing was good, and mercifully the weather lifted to glorious sunshine. The pace the bike will pile on felt unreal. There is thunderous roll on power at any position or speed, but wind it to 5000rpm and it comes alive. The warm, woofling sound of the bike burbling along changes almost instantly as it comes on cam, the induction note takes over and sounds raspy and guttural. It reminded me of the sound of crackling air that precedes a massive 'BOOM' after a bolt of lightning. Sometimes you'd creep on cam without realising, and the noise of the engine waking up would alert you that it was there. I only took it to the top of a given gear once or twice, but the top end rush was insane. The 'grunt of a twin and top end rush of a four' analogy is often trotted out but it holds true. It's more like an inline four than a twin though, because although it's very tractable at low speeds, its the midrange that blossoms into a violently fast crescendo at the top of the clock that dominates the ride. Handling wise, it wasn't a quick paced ride but the bike felt superb. Stiff enough to maintain good control but soft enough to avoid jarring you over every ripple in the tarmac. Pointy and stable, it felt like a talented rider could really get a lot from it and I'd love to grow into it.
I've calmed considerably since I got in and my overriding feeling now is that I just want it fixed.
So, aside from the mechanical failure at the end of the day, you might want to know how the rest of the escapade went?
Getting down there took a while, as the fog was so thick that you could often scarcely see more than a car's length in front of you. I was dreading riding back in that, as there were plenty of gumps out and about with no lights on. I discussed with my brother whether or not we should head for the A1 on the way back, and he left it up to me, so I thought we'd brave the A171.
Picking the bike up in Scarborough, my brother sat on the bike before I did and remarked on how low it was at the front. I have to say, at that point I did quickly question the credibility of my plan to buy a bike, starting with an old litre bike and never having ridden a sports bike before. As I sat on it on the forecourt and pulled away to the side of the road to follow my brother out (he was navigating the home leg) I was taken aback by the seating position, but it was remarkably comfortable and after 20 seconds riding down the road I was at home.
I wouldn't say that the bike is uncomfortable. It's not a Goldwing, but it's not a torture device despite it apparently having the look of one when you ride it. I found my hands a little tingly when I got home, and my arse was a bit numb from the hard seat. My hamstrings were tight, but that's off doing a leg session before work yesterday - I've had my cramp riding a CBF600 than I got on the Daytona today! It was a little wristy around town, but I had always assumed that sore wrists would mean you couldn't ride on. This was a little ache, countered by gripping the tank with my knees. I've got a good core, so I never felt like flopping off the bike or giving out. My clutch hand got sore in a traffic jam early on, but I don't intend on spending much time in traffic on the bike.
On the open road, it was mightily impressive. Protection from the fairing was good, and mercifully the weather lifted to glorious sunshine. The pace the bike will pile on felt unreal. There is thunderous roll on power at any position or speed, but wind it to 5000rpm and it comes alive. The warm, woofling sound of the bike burbling along changes almost instantly as it comes on cam, the induction note takes over and sounds raspy and guttural. It reminded me of the sound of crackling air that precedes a massive 'BOOM' after a bolt of lightning. Sometimes you'd creep on cam without realising, and the noise of the engine waking up would alert you that it was there. I only took it to the top of a given gear once or twice, but the top end rush was insane. The 'grunt of a twin and top end rush of a four' analogy is often trotted out but it holds true. It's more like an inline four than a twin though, because although it's very tractable at low speeds, its the midrange that blossoms into a violently fast crescendo at the top of the clock that dominates the ride. Handling wise, it wasn't a quick paced ride but the bike felt superb. Stiff enough to maintain good control but soft enough to avoid jarring you over every ripple in the tarmac. Pointy and stable, it felt like a talented rider could really get a lot from it and I'd love to grow into it.
I've calmed considerably since I got in and my overriding feeling now is that I just want it fixed.
I've spoken with the garage on the phone, they were more than happy to arrange a solution. The first port of call is they're going to collect the bike on Thursday and take it back for a look. Now, they offered me a refund up front, or a chance at fixing the bike and seeing where we go from there.
I'm still mulling it over, but the suggestion I had made was that they take the bike for a look, see what's going on and if they are confident they can fix it, I'll keep it. If it looks as though it's a bigger problem, they're happy to refund me. I'm impressed by their attitude, most certainly, they put the ball in my court for how we would progress this. If it can be fixed, I'd love to keep it but if it's big trouble, then I'll walk away.
If it does go, lord knows what I'd get to replace it. I absolutely love that bike, the looks and the sound are outrageous and it's a dream to ride when it's not blowing coolant out of the header tank. It was the best of the lot of the T595's that I could see for sale and I probably wouldn't look for another one after that. Who knows what else I could look at? The 600cc bikes at that sort of price range don't really grab me and I'm not sure what sort of Japanese litre bike you'd get for the same cash.
ETA: It may be of interest to note that I didn't hear the fan at all during this episode. I've checked the oil, and that's in good condition. There is no evidence of coolant having mixed with it. However, I would have expected the fan to kick in, and be really bloody loud, as bike fans often are. I didn't hear it all, which makes me wonder if it's not that which is broken.
I'm still mulling it over, but the suggestion I had made was that they take the bike for a look, see what's going on and if they are confident they can fix it, I'll keep it. If it looks as though it's a bigger problem, they're happy to refund me. I'm impressed by their attitude, most certainly, they put the ball in my court for how we would progress this. If it can be fixed, I'd love to keep it but if it's big trouble, then I'll walk away.
If it does go, lord knows what I'd get to replace it. I absolutely love that bike, the looks and the sound are outrageous and it's a dream to ride when it's not blowing coolant out of the header tank. It was the best of the lot of the T595's that I could see for sale and I probably wouldn't look for another one after that. Who knows what else I could look at? The 600cc bikes at that sort of price range don't really grab me and I'm not sure what sort of Japanese litre bike you'd get for the same cash.
ETA: It may be of interest to note that I didn't hear the fan at all during this episode. I've checked the oil, and that's in good condition. There is no evidence of coolant having mixed with it. However, I would have expected the fan to kick in, and be really bloody loud, as bike fans often are. I didn't hear it all, which makes me wonder if it's not that which is broken.
Edited by Baryonyx on Monday 6th July 11:44
The temps were up high in traffic and cool on the open road. So I don't think it's just plain overfilling, that wouldn't account for the super hot reading at standstill or when crawling. The gather the fan is a known weak spot, and having not heard it once the other day, I suspect that's what's done it.
I'm eager to see if the garage can fix it, as I'd love to have the bike back. In spite of this fault, I love it and I absolutely loved riding it the other day. If I had to think of chucking it in and replacing it, I don't know what I'd get instead. A Super Blackbird? A K1200S? They've had loads of pace but I doubt they'd have the handling of the Daytona. So really, I just want to keep the Daytona!
I'm eager to see if the garage can fix it, as I'd love to have the bike back. In spite of this fault, I love it and I absolutely loved riding it the other day. If I had to think of chucking it in and replacing it, I don't know what I'd get instead. A Super Blackbird? A K1200S? They've had loads of pace but I doubt they'd have the handling of the Daytona. So really, I just want to keep the Daytona!
I've checked the oil, it's in good shape. The steam wasn't coming from the exhaust, rather it was dripping down from the coolant header tank onto the exhaust. The tank is concealed at the back of the bike, under the rear seat pod. When it boiled over, the coolant splashed down onto the exhaust pipe and steamed off from there. I'd be a lot more worried if the steam was actually shooting out of the exhaust itself!
I've not checked the fuses yet. I would have went to them as a next port of call given my suspicions over the fan. But given that I've made arrangements to have it picked up on Thursday, I'm not going to go fiddling with it. I'd be overjoyed if it was that. You have no idea how badly I just want to be out riding this thing.
CaptainSlow said:
You won't go to the effort of spending five minutes checking fuses? I suspect a bike of this age may not be for you.
Given that the arrangements have been made to have the bike collected, inspected and fixed FOC, I'm going to leave it as is for now. Of course, when the dealer comes to collect it we may well have a quick look through the fuses. But having ran so hot, I'd rather it were given a proper going over. EDIT: I had also read of the radiator cap being the fault that lets the hot coolant through to the header, causing boil over. So that'll need addressing. But I wouldn't have thought that alone would have been the cause of the over-heating.
If I had bought it privately, I'd have started with fuses, checking the fan assembly, draining and flushing the coolant, replacing the thermostat, and I'd have taken it to Triumph for a compression test. However, I'm happy to leave it to the dealer, and we'll see where we go after that initial assessment. I know they say that old Triumphs can run a little hot. Maybe I'll eventually get a fan override switch fitted, or even use the tuning software to lower the fan engagement threshold (I've read of people doing this to good effect).
I had looked at older Fireblades as a potential replacement. I'm struggling to see one that looks in great shape, but I wouldn't rule one out. I really want the Triumph to work though, on account of it being a sports bike like no other. It's got that triple engine that I love, the looks, the feel of it, all resonate with me. The midrange power is just incredible. The top end, just seems ludicrous to me at the moment. I'm keeping everything crossed it can be easily fixed and returned to me.
The dealer has since been back on the phone to me. It appears a stone was stuck in the fan assembly, stopping it from rotating and the fuse had gone. This has been unpicked and it now seems to be working fine. They've advised me it'll be getting a proper shakedown over the weekend before arrangements are made to get it back to me. Indeed, I've urged them, and will do so again, to be completely sure it's right before bringing it back. I'll be giving it a proper road test then too, to make sure everything is as it should be. Hopefully, the end is in sight.
Since shelling out something like three weeks ago, I've ridden my new bike for about 100 miles.
Since shelling out something like three weeks ago, I've ridden my new bike for about 100 miles.
It's back, and fingers crossed, it seems to be fixed...
I had it out for a ride to work the other day and it seemed nice. It was very cool that morning (frost on my car!), and there was no stopping on the way to work, but it seemed in order. The ride home equally was without issue.
My brother commented on the low, wide position of the bars at the time. I can see what he means. I sat on a Thundercat the same day and was surprised at how tall and upright it felt (more sports tourer, I know, but it was Yamaha's sports bike of the time). The T595 draws you into a low, hunkered position where you're sitting on the tank, and I suppose that was always the intention given the low front screen.
I'm hoping that I'll get some more rides in soon, perhaps tomorrow and then use it for work over the weekend. The weather has been absolutely appalling these past couple of days, wet to the point of just spoiling the prospect of any enjoyment. Localised flooding has also played a part.
I had it out for a ride to work the other day and it seemed nice. It was very cool that morning (frost on my car!), and there was no stopping on the way to work, but it seemed in order. The ride home equally was without issue.
My brother commented on the low, wide position of the bars at the time. I can see what he means. I sat on a Thundercat the same day and was surprised at how tall and upright it felt (more sports tourer, I know, but it was Yamaha's sports bike of the time). The T595 draws you into a low, hunkered position where you're sitting on the tank, and I suppose that was always the intention given the low front screen.
I'm hoping that I'll get some more rides in soon, perhaps tomorrow and then use it for work over the weekend. The weather has been absolutely appalling these past couple of days, wet to the point of just spoiling the prospect of any enjoyment. Localised flooding has also played a part.
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