Max's shed of a TT600
Discussion
Having sold my Tiger in January, and waiting for a new 765 Street Triple R in May, I was itching for a bike to fill the gap. The plan was for something I could ride, but that would also act as a bit of a project, and something I could start to tinker with.
After a false start initially looking at 100cc 2-Strokes, a test ride made me realise I wanted something with a bit more oomph. Budget was a lowly £1000 but after a few weeks of keeping an eye on the classifieds, I spotted a Triumph TT 600 which I went and had a look at. Having been given a lift to pick it up this morning, and a £900 lighter wallet I have just ridden home on this:
First impressions, not quite the rocket breathing monster the seller made it out to be, but it'll keep me entertained in the mean time. I am already developing a to-do list:
1. Sort out the front brake - It needs new pads, and the master cylinder needs rebuilding.
2. It died when idling of the motorway, so need to check all the vacuum pipes and idle (I think)
3. The RSU is more like a pogo stick, so work out why it has lost all damping / replace.
4. New chain and sprockets.
5. New rear tyre.
6. I'm sure I will find some other things wrong with it.
I went with Triumph, as I can get good discount on genuine parts, and access to an OEM Service manual and code checker, and you don't have much choice of bikes under £1000.
After a false start initially looking at 100cc 2-Strokes, a test ride made me realise I wanted something with a bit more oomph. Budget was a lowly £1000 but after a few weeks of keeping an eye on the classifieds, I spotted a Triumph TT 600 which I went and had a look at. Having been given a lift to pick it up this morning, and a £900 lighter wallet I have just ridden home on this:
First impressions, not quite the rocket breathing monster the seller made it out to be, but it'll keep me entertained in the mean time. I am already developing a to-do list:
1. Sort out the front brake - It needs new pads, and the master cylinder needs rebuilding.
2. It died when idling of the motorway, so need to check all the vacuum pipes and idle (I think)
3. The RSU is more like a pogo stick, so work out why it has lost all damping / replace.
4. New chain and sprockets.
5. New rear tyre.
6. I'm sure I will find some other things wrong with it.
I went with Triumph, as I can get good discount on genuine parts, and access to an OEM Service manual and code checker, and you don't have much choice of bikes under £1000.
spookly said:
Chassis yes. Brakes not so much. Great just after you bleed them, but then seem to go spongy. Change master cylinder or regular bleeding seems to be the cure.
Any recommendation on which master cylinder to change to? I was going to rebuild it, but its £30 for a rebuild kit, or I can get a brand new master cylinder assembly for £45, I was tempted more towards the later, although the theme for this project is budget, brakes are pretty important.The seller had kindly showed the bike a sponge, but not really cleaned it, so this morning I went over it myself, with the intention of spotting anything else I need to consider on it.
After I had put a little bit of elbow grease into cleaning it
After cleaning the chain, I retensioned it, as it had a good 4 inches of play. While tensioning it, I found the RHS chain adjuster has been bodged with a much larger screw and nut. In addition once the rear axle was tightened (it was pretty loose before) the wheel becomes stiff, so I need to take the wheel out and check the bearings / and spacers are all correct. And investigate the adjuster at the same time. There was a lovely bit of corrosion hidden under the swingarm paint, it flaked off with a delicate touch.
Thanks for all the advice on master clyinders. For now I'm going to rebuild the standard one, once I've got everything else working satisfactorily I will investigate a radial master cylinder for it.
After I had put a little bit of elbow grease into cleaning it
After cleaning the chain, I retensioned it, as it had a good 4 inches of play. While tensioning it, I found the RHS chain adjuster has been bodged with a much larger screw and nut. In addition once the rear axle was tightened (it was pretty loose before) the wheel becomes stiff, so I need to take the wheel out and check the bearings / and spacers are all correct. And investigate the adjuster at the same time. There was a lovely bit of corrosion hidden under the swingarm paint, it flaked off with a delicate touch.
Thanks for all the advice on master clyinders. For now I'm going to rebuild the standard one, once I've got everything else working satisfactorily I will investigate a radial master cylinder for it.
With storm Doris behind us, and finishing early on a Friday, I rode in today, and took the long way home. A couple of issues reinforced themselves, primarily the rough running at low revs, and subsequent regular stalling at Idle is terrible. This was particularly fun when you pull up behind a queue of traffic, stop, engine cuts out, start, idle for 10 seconds, engine cuts out. Give it some revs, it picks up and goes to 6000 and deafens everyone in the vicinity.
Additionally the rear shock is as bouncy as ever, so I need to find somewhere in the midlands that will rebuild at reasonable cost, or budget £300 for a new one. Seems little point in buying one from Ebay, as no guarantee it will be any better damped.
When I got home my first package of bits had turned up
, ordered some new brake pads, arrived with a small bottle of brake fluid and copper slip, which was nice, but I would have rather saved the £2 on postage and for the extras I didn't need.
Firstly gloves to keep hands relatively clean
Firstly undo the pin, and give it a good push to remove it from the calipers
Pull out the old pads, they weren't fully warn, but not much meat left on them, so worth replacing
Push the pistons back into the calipers (noting that they could do with the calipers splitting and rebuilding at one point, lets sort the idle and shock first), and drop the new pads back in place
Still waiting on the master cylinder rebuild kit, and will order some new vacuum line for the idle air control valve tonight, which will hopefully improve the poor idle.
Additionally the rear shock is as bouncy as ever, so I need to find somewhere in the midlands that will rebuild at reasonable cost, or budget £300 for a new one. Seems little point in buying one from Ebay, as no guarantee it will be any better damped.
When I got home my first package of bits had turned up
, ordered some new brake pads, arrived with a small bottle of brake fluid and copper slip, which was nice, but I would have rather saved the £2 on postage and for the extras I didn't need.Firstly gloves to keep hands relatively clean
Firstly undo the pin, and give it a good push to remove it from the calipers
Pull out the old pads, they weren't fully warn, but not much meat left on them, so worth replacing
Push the pistons back into the calipers (noting that they could do with the calipers splitting and rebuilding at one point, lets sort the idle and shock first), and drop the new pads back in place
Still waiting on the master cylinder rebuild kit, and will order some new vacuum line for the idle air control valve tonight, which will hopefully improve the poor idle.
underwhelmist said:
Nice project.
If you're still looking for a shock rebuild/suspension work in the midlands, try Revs Racing in Halesowen. I've had some forks rebuilt by them, they did a good job and it was a quick turnaround.
Thanks, I was planning on sending them an email, I had seen their website with a quick google, good to hear a recommendation as well though.If you're still looking for a shock rebuild/suspension work in the midlands, try Revs Racing in Halesowen. I've had some forks rebuilt by them, they did a good job and it was a quick turnaround.
More bits have arrived front master cylinder rebuild kit and a new position light and rear light to replace missing bulbs. The position light was missing its holder so had to order a new one of those as well.
The master cylinder will wait until the weekend, but I fitted the bulbs today.
Someone at Triumph did too good a job optimising the harness length, its a right faff to fit. I've ordered an LED position light, as I didn't expect a bulb with the bulb holder, however I'm not sure I will bother fitting it when it arrives.
The master cylinder will wait until the weekend, but I fitted the bulbs today.
Someone at Triumph did too good a job optimising the harness length, its a right faff to fit. I've ordered an LED position light, as I didn't expect a bulb with the bulb holder, however I'm not sure I will bother fitting it when it arrives.
Mr2Mike said:
Did you check out why the rear wheel becomes stiff when the spindle is tightened? That would be no.1 priority for me, if there is a spacer missing then the bearings will collapse pretty quickly.
It's on my to do list, having received the brake master cylinder earlier in the week, I decided to start with that.
First off, a rag to protect the paintwork, because it's in such excellent condition
Next removal of the master cylinder
I gave the clip-ons a clean while they were accessible, while draining the brake fluid from the reservoir. The fluid was a little cloudy so worth replacing as well.
I took off the reservoir, brake switch and brake lever, and pulled off the broken dust shield.
There had clearly been water ingress, as the circlip was pretty rusty, so I took the piston out and gave it all a good clean
Parts to reassembly it.
Reassembly, and cleaned everything as I bolted it back on
Back on the bike, with new crush washers
Reservoir fitted and topped up
And then on to my least favourite, and least successful job, bleeding the brakes. It didn't start well, I got out my vacuum pump only to find it wouldn't vacuum. I lent it to a friend previously, so no idea what he did to it, to stop it from vacuuming. So I took it all apart, and finally worked out the valve had got stuck closed. Once working I started bleeding the brakes.
And bleeding the brakes, and bleeding the brakes, and no success. The lever still pulls back to the bar. I managed to run through 1l of brake fluid without building up the pressure. Somewhere there is a bubble which does not want to dislodge.
Currently I have left it cable tied to the bar over night, and will order a syringe to fill from the calipers if it's still soft tomorrow.
Edited to correct image link.
Edited by Max5476 on Tuesday 14th March 17:28
So I still hadn't got any brake pressure on my tt600, so I tackled it again this weekend. I had ordered a syringe in the week to try reverse bleeding the brakes.
This made no difference at all, so after trying some normal bleeding again, and still not getting anywhere, I decided to rebuild the master cylinder. Upon disassembly I found the bottom seal had slipped and wasn't sealing. Hence no brake pressure! So I put it back together, with the seal the other way up to stop it slipping again and... It still wouldn't flipping pressurise. Deciding I had done it right (but wrong) the first time. I took it apart once again, reassembled, and finally, it bled and I had front brakes back. Thirds times the charm and all that.
Riding the wave of success, I flushed the fluid for the rear brake, with no problems at all, and replaced the front brake caliper bolts. The previous owner had lost one of the bolts, and replaced it with a random one that had gone very rusty, so I treated it to a new bolt.
Next up is checking the tune, vacuum pipes and getting it running smoothly.
This made no difference at all, so after trying some normal bleeding again, and still not getting anywhere, I decided to rebuild the master cylinder. Upon disassembly I found the bottom seal had slipped and wasn't sealing. Hence no brake pressure! So I put it back together, with the seal the other way up to stop it slipping again and... It still wouldn't flipping pressurise. Deciding I had done it right (but wrong) the first time. I took it apart once again, reassembled, and finally, it bled and I had front brakes back
. Thirds times the charm and all that.Riding the wave of success, I flushed the fluid for the rear brake, with no problems at all, and replaced the front brake caliper bolts. The previous owner had lost one of the bolts, and replaced it with a random one that had gone very rusty, so I treated it to a new bolt.
Next up is checking the tune, vacuum pipes and getting it running smoothly.
So checked out the tune on the bike, and was pleased to see it had the latest TT600 tune, which confirmed my suspicion cutting out was due to the IACV.
Next was to lift the tank to see what was underneath it. I was expecting to have to replace the vacuum lines to get in running correctly
What I discovered was that the main IACV pipe had been left unplugged.
Everything underneath the tank appears to have a lovely film of oil, so need to work out where that is coming from but I reconnected everything ready to try starting it up again. I still plan to balance the throttle bodies, but following an incident where I punched the wall trying to remove a wardrobe and bruised the knuckle of my RH, I have lost a bit of my usual dexterity, so that can wait for another day.
Once reassembled the bike started on the button, and idled at 1700 when cold, dropping to 1300 when warm as expected. Unfortunately there is still some hunting on idle +/- 300 or so. so it does need a bit of work to make it a bit more rock solid, but looking forward to taking it out for a test ride again.
I remembered to check the oil after running it, and have a suspicion it has been overfilled, but need to check again once cold.
One of the many previous owners had gone a bit sticker mad, and stuck extra triumph stickers all over the bike perhaps to draw peoples eyes away from the terrible condition of the rest of the bike. I think they make it look worse so I have been slowly removing them all.
The only stickers left are on the rear panel under the grabrail. Someone has sprayed this black, so they will leave horrid yellow marks if peeled of. The panel is cracked, so I have my eye out for a replacement.
Next was to lift the tank to see what was underneath it. I was expecting to have to replace the vacuum lines to get in running correctly
What I discovered was that the main IACV pipe had been left unplugged.
Everything underneath the tank appears to have a lovely film of oil, so need to work out where that is coming from but I reconnected everything ready to try starting it up again. I still plan to balance the throttle bodies, but following an incident where I punched the wall trying to remove a wardrobe and bruised the knuckle of my RH, I have lost a bit of my usual dexterity, so that can wait for another day.
Once reassembled the bike started on the button, and idled at 1700 when cold, dropping to 1300 when warm as expected. Unfortunately there is still some hunting on idle +/- 300 or so. so it does need a bit of work to make it a bit more rock solid, but looking forward to taking it out for a test ride again.
I remembered to check the oil after running it, and have a suspicion it has been overfilled, but need to check again once cold.
One of the many previous owners had gone a bit sticker mad, and stuck extra triumph stickers all over the bike perhaps to draw peoples eyes away from the terrible condition of the rest of the bike. I think they make it look worse so I have been slowly removing them all.
The only stickers left are on the rear panel under the grabrail. Someone has sprayed this black, so they will leave horrid yellow marks if peeled of. The panel is cracked, so I have my eye out for a replacement.
Edited by Max5476 on Tuesday 14th March 17:43
Jazoli said:
I'd still be replacing the IACV hoses, they may look ok but they perish and split and are still the most likely suspect of your poor idle.
Also if you plan on removing the tank treat the quick release fuel hose clips very gently, and replace the o rings every time you do, they can be an utter b
h.
Should have listened, took the bike for a quick trip to halfords to replace the oil, but it's still cutting out, so tank needs to come off, I have ordered the o rings though. Undeterred I dropped the oil, and refilled with Halfords finest (cheapest) 10w40. Once its running better and i've put some miles on it, Ill give it another oil change in 100 miles or so, giving the engine a bit of a flush. The oil filter hadn't arrived, but I wanted to get the correct amount in, ill change it with the next oil change.Also if you plan on removing the tank treat the quick release fuel hose clips very gently, and replace the o rings every time you do, they can be an utter b
h.Edited by Jazoli on Tuesday 14th March 18:11
gareth_r said:
According to the handbook for the Speed Four/TT600, the recommended oil is 15w/50 fully synthetic.
The service manual says its fine:"All Triumph fuel injected engines must be filled with 10W-40, 15W-40 or 15W-50 semi-synthetic motorcycle engine oil which meets API-SG or API-SH specification, or fully-synthetic oil which exceeds these minimum requirements."
Im only using this oil as an bit of flush, so haven't decided what to use next, however as its done 51000 miles already, I don't think I will see a difference, althought it would probably prefere the thicker 15W-50
So everyone knows you can't polish a turd, but that didn't stop me replacing rear bodywork panel, to get rid of the flaking spray paint and stickers, and it was cracked in half.
Lets forget I'm not riding the bike while it won't idle when hot
Just need to keep an eye out for a new seat, to replace the taped up current one.
Lets forget I'm not riding the bike while it won't idle when hot
Just need to keep an eye out for a new seat, to replace the taped up current one.
Pothole said:
Pothole said:
underwhelmist said:
Pothole said:
Do they do hard chroming?
I don't think so, but they rebuilt my forks with a new pair of stanchions. I don't think having the old stanchions hard chromed would have worked out much cheaper and the job would have taken a lot longer.Rubin215 said:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/182530561726?ssPageName=...
Had a set of these on Mrs 215's first TT; did a great job of protecting the rear end from throw-overs and bungees.
It's not really worth protecting the rear bodywork on this, its not exactly mint.Had a set of these on Mrs 215's first TT; did a great job of protecting the rear end from throw-overs and bungees.
Pothole said:
Took my battery out to charge it at the weekend and noticed oil in the tray...blockage/blowback from somewhere...need to get the tank off to fit the iridium plugs I've had in the drawer for about a year so I'll investigate that as well.
Oops, my engine has a fine film of oil (probably from being over filled) so I wouldn't be spotting a small puddle. I leave the battery in the bike to charge it as well. - That reminds me, a new battery strap is on the to-do list as well, not that the battery appears to move anywhere.Pothole said:
I'm moving slowly towards the kind of refurb you're doing, really, only I work crappy shifts and am a lazy bugger. No huge incentive now I don't need to sell it and I have a 1050 Tiger Sport as a daily. I'm great at taking stuff off and stripping it down...
It wasn't supposed to be a slow refurb until I had picked up a second bike to use regularly, but never mind, i've not really had much time to get out and ride anyway. Been given a date of mid-june for my second bike, so its on its waySo I had a spare friday afternoon, so started working on the bike again.
Tank off to replace the IACV pipe work.
new colour matched silicon hose (very important) to replace the old pipes
I put in some t-pieces to balance the throttle bodies
Some assembly required on the vacuum gauges. I forgot to take any more photos at this point, but connected them up. The needles currently bounce all over the place, so I need to clamp the hose to restrict the flow a little. I was out of time at this point, so will do that next weekend probably. It sounds great without the air box installed. I don't fully understand if I should have the IACV connected or not. The manual suggests the IACV is bypassed which means the bike won't run without a little throttle opening, but the T-pieces meant I didn't worry about that so it appeared to fire up ok. More investigation required i think.
I discovered the air box is missing a rubber strap to hold it in place, so I ordered a new one with the hope it will seat on the throttle bodies better as well.
(these photos are a little out of focus, sorry)
Tank off to replace the IACV pipe work.
new colour matched silicon hose (very important) to replace the old pipes
I put in some t-pieces to balance the throttle bodies
Some assembly required on the vacuum gauges. I forgot to take any more photos at this point, but connected them up. The needles currently bounce all over the place, so I need to clamp the hose to restrict the flow a little. I was out of time at this point, so will do that next weekend probably. It sounds great without the air box installed. I don't fully understand if I should have the IACV connected or not. The manual suggests the IACV is bypassed which means the bike won't run without a little throttle opening, but the T-pieces meant I didn't worry about that so it appeared to fire up ok. More investigation required i think.
I discovered the air box is missing a rubber strap to hold it in place, so I ordered a new one with the hope it will seat on the throttle bodies better as well.
(these photos are a little out of focus, sorry)
Bit of a late update, but I managed to find the time to finish balancing the throttle bodies, and replace a lot of the pipe work. It runs a lot better at low revs now, but is still struggling to start, particularly when hot, so needs some further work.
The fuel tank fittings didn't cause me any issues, until final reassembly, at which point the return pin snapped. I was able to correctly locate the fuel line, but next time the tank comes off will be a pain.
I mocked up a tank strap tank with some cable ties, and have ordered the rubber strap that someone has lost previously to replace it with.
In more exciting news, my new bike has turned up at the dealers today but i have a 3 week wait until they PDI it.
The fuel tank fittings didn't cause me any issues, until final reassembly, at which point the return pin snapped. I was able to correctly locate the fuel line, but next time the tank comes off will be a pain.
I mocked up a tank strap tank with some cable ties, and have ordered the rubber strap that someone has lost previously to replace it with.
In more exciting news, my new bike has turned up at the dealers today
but i have a 3 week wait until they PDI it.So i got an action camera and stuck it to my helmet, a short video from my first ride is uploaded here, nothing to exciting, just some local country lanes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYJpGLSWbeg
My new bike is being PDId today, and I will be going to pick it up tomorrow (as long as I can get a reasonable insurance quote this afternoon...). Pictures to follow.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYJpGLSWbeg
My new bike is being PDId today, and I will be going to pick it up tomorrow (as long as I can get a reasonable insurance quote this afternoon...). Pictures to follow.
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