Won't start - won't even turn over
Discussion
Went out to start the car today to go to work (it's in use every day) and something weird happened.
The alarm has been replaced at some stage with a TOAD system. I pressed the key fob button and the doors made the "unlock" noise but the door button didn't work (so the car was still locked). Pressed the button again and the door unlocked so I got in (assuming i'd forgotten to lock it last night).
The alarm went off...
I pressed the button again and it silenced the alarm.
Key in ignition, turn it.... and the alarm went off again..
Pressed the button and it went off.
Got out, closed the door. Pressed the button on the alarm and the doors locked.
Pressed the alarm button again and they unlocked.
Went to start the car, fuel pump primed, turned the key to start and "Click"
I can hear the starter solenoid engage but the starter motor isn't spinning.
Pressed the "immobiliser" tag to the ring beside the keyhole (just in case) but this doesn't seem to achieve anything.
The symptom now is that the fuel pum primes but the engine does not turn over. Unfortunately I am not sure if it is the alarm or the starter motor.
I am leaning towards the starter motor but it is a new one, fitted less than 18 months ago (around 500 miles) by the PO.
I Can "just" see the starter from above but there is no real room to get to it on my drive (I'm sure you all know what I mean).
Am i correct in thinkingt hat as the fuel pump primes it is unlikely to be the alarm? I'd have thought the immobiliser circuit cuts the fuel pump off and not the starter circuit but unfortunately I don't know which model of TOAD alarm it is (an old one by the looks of it).
I tried putting thr car in gear and rocking it but that didn't do anything to help - but I couldn't rock it too far because of where it is parked.
In the end I walked over to my S1, started that and drove it to work leaving the Chimaera parked "in disgrace".
I guess it's possible that it is the alarm but I hope not, I hope it is the starter motor as that's simpler.
I know this is a newb question but where is the battery - is it in the passenger footwell somewhere (1996 Chimaera 400).
I'll go home at lunchtime for another look and to call a breakdown service but any pointers you might be able to provide inadvance would be gratefully received.
Jules
The alarm has been replaced at some stage with a TOAD system. I pressed the key fob button and the doors made the "unlock" noise but the door button didn't work (so the car was still locked). Pressed the button again and the door unlocked so I got in (assuming i'd forgotten to lock it last night).
The alarm went off...
I pressed the button again and it silenced the alarm.
Key in ignition, turn it.... and the alarm went off again..
Pressed the button and it went off.
Got out, closed the door. Pressed the button on the alarm and the doors locked.
Pressed the alarm button again and they unlocked.
Went to start the car, fuel pump primed, turned the key to start and "Click"
I can hear the starter solenoid engage but the starter motor isn't spinning.
Pressed the "immobiliser" tag to the ring beside the keyhole (just in case) but this doesn't seem to achieve anything.
The symptom now is that the fuel pum primes but the engine does not turn over. Unfortunately I am not sure if it is the alarm or the starter motor.
I am leaning towards the starter motor but it is a new one, fitted less than 18 months ago (around 500 miles) by the PO.
I Can "just" see the starter from above but there is no real room to get to it on my drive (I'm sure you all know what I mean).
Am i correct in thinkingt hat as the fuel pump primes it is unlikely to be the alarm? I'd have thought the immobiliser circuit cuts the fuel pump off and not the starter circuit but unfortunately I don't know which model of TOAD alarm it is (an old one by the looks of it).
I tried putting thr car in gear and rocking it but that didn't do anything to help - but I couldn't rock it too far because of where it is parked.
In the end I walked over to my S1, started that and drove it to work leaving the Chimaera parked "in disgrace".
I guess it's possible that it is the alarm but I hope not, I hope it is the starter motor as that's simpler.
I know this is a newb question but where is the battery - is it in the passenger footwell somewhere (1996 Chimaera 400).
I'll go home at lunchtime for another look and to call a breakdown service but any pointers you might be able to provide inadvance would be gratefully received.
Jules
Gorvid said:
One of mine once did this and it was just a dead batter (although it was still reading 12v it wasn't up to the job).
Battery behind a pull-out section of floor in passenger footwell. Quite a bugger to get out unless you are a snake-like, lithe individual.
Oh Dear, "snake like" and "lithe" does not in any way describe me... Think I'll pop home and have a look though. PO said he'd fitted a connector in the engine bay for jump leads - might try to track down where that is first LOL...Battery behind a pull-out section of floor in passenger footwell. Quite a bugger to get out unless you are a snake-like, lithe individual.
Well I have had it running 4 or 5 times now so I know the battery is good. It's hit & miss whether it will start or just "click". I have read some interesting stuff on the net about the original immobiliser relay sticking, apparently according to that the immobiliser does in fact shut of the feed to the fuel pump and the feed to the starter.
I still don't think it's that as I am pretty sure if it was the immobiliser then the solenoid wouldn't even attempt to engage, certainly if I were designing an immobiliser I'd cut off the low amperage fedd to the pump and starter circuit - so there's be no "noise" of any type when the key is turned.
One way to test that will be to see whether thumping the top of the passenger dash helps LOL
I've booked the car in for tomorrow for a new starter and solenoid, I'll keep the old one as a spare and stip and regrease the solenoid piston, hopefully that'll solve this issue..
I still don't think it's that as I am pretty sure if it was the immobiliser then the solenoid wouldn't even attempt to engage, certainly if I were designing an immobiliser I'd cut off the low amperage fedd to the pump and starter circuit - so there's be no "noise" of any type when the key is turned.
One way to test that will be to see whether thumping the top of the passenger dash helps LOL
I've booked the car in for tomorrow for a new starter and solenoid, I'll keep the old one as a spare and stip and regrease the solenoid piston, hopefully that'll solve this issue..
Battery connections are all good (a PITA to check though LOL). The battery is pretty new (12 months old) and had lived on a tender up 'til I bought the car.
Car now starts 3 out of 5 times, I'm hoping it'll get better with use but as a precaution I am still going to change the starter and solenoid.
Car now starts 3 out of 5 times, I'm hoping it'll get better with use but as a precaution I am still going to change the starter and solenoid.
Speedo was working fine, in fact I did remark to my wife that it was very accurate when compared to the satnav reading on the weekend.
The battery withstood a lot of abuse today and still manged to get the car started w/o resorting to jumpleads so I am pretty sure the battery is good, the alternator is good and electrics are generally good (apart from the starter circuit LOL)
I would like to thank everyone for their input today, I was a bit miffed this morning when she wouldn't start especially so soon into the relationship. The moral support & advice is very much appreciated.
The battery withstood a lot of abuse today and still manged to get the car started w/o resorting to jumpleads so I am pretty sure the battery is good, the alternator is good and electrics are generally good (apart from the starter circuit LOL)
I would like to thank everyone for their input today, I was a bit miffed this morning when she wouldn't start especially so soon into the relationship. The moral support & advice is very much appreciated.
ChimpofDarkness said:
This gives the following symptom - Disengage the immobiliser and turn the key to the start position, the car fails to start but you hear a faint click from the starter solenoid
Cheers. The original battery to starter cable has been replaced by a PO and an extra earth is routed to the engine so I assume the PO must've been a PH fan LOLIt's not so much a "faint click" as a solid "clang" when I turn the key so I reckon the solenoid is engaging but not the motor.
Wish I could get in there with a multimeter to confirm but I can't do that on the drive, I really need to be under the car...
Thanks again for the help guys. New starter fitted today and all is well in the world. I miss the sound of the old one (like a Spitfire winding up) as the new one spins a lot faster... Guess it goes to show how the old one was duff.... Weird considering it was less than 18 months old..
Never mind, I'm just glad it was done in time to get it to the exhaust place
Never mind, I'm just glad it was done in time to get it to the exhaust place
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