Another body off - build thread and questions
Discussion
I've had my 450 Chimaera for a couple of years. When I bought it, I managed to put a screwdriver through the O/S outrigger and knocked the seller down accordingly (expecting just an outrigger replacement). It's been a great car and drives well (made it to Beligium and back for Spa GP last year) but has been off the road since the MOT ran out in November.
I took the car to RT Racing to have the outriggers replaced with the body on on Sunday last week, hoping to have the car back on the road and ready to enjoy the summer this week. Unfortunately I got a call on Monday to tell me that repairs will also be needed to some of the main chassis rail and the body needed to come off - not good!! I had wanted to do this since I bought the car (and read all of the other threads on here) but was thinking I had another few years before it would need to be done.
So, car was brought back down on the Friday, garage rented (I don't have anywhere at home to do it) and work has begun.
I'm following the guide to taking the body off from Autogasp, and taking lots of pictures and notes as I go. The most I have done before is replacing wishbones, discs and pads etc so this is definitely on the ambitious side.
I thought I would start a thread as I enjoy reading others, and will no doubt have lots of questions as time goes by that can be kept in one place - hopefully some that have done this before will be able to assist!
Saturday
The car was taken to the rented unit, jacked up, put on axle stands and wheels removed.
Car before work started:
I thought I would tackle removing bonnet and spray penetrating spray on any accessible bolt to try and make the ongoing job easier.
Unfortunately, even the easy jobs aren't necessarily so - the allen bolts on the bonnet assembly wouldn't come off.
I got a couple of pictures of the O/S outrigger - the entire corner has fallen away and missing a few inches under the car.
I took the car to RT Racing to have the outriggers replaced with the body on on Sunday last week, hoping to have the car back on the road and ready to enjoy the summer this week. Unfortunately I got a call on Monday to tell me that repairs will also be needed to some of the main chassis rail and the body needed to come off - not good!! I had wanted to do this since I bought the car (and read all of the other threads on here) but was thinking I had another few years before it would need to be done.
So, car was brought back down on the Friday, garage rented (I don't have anywhere at home to do it) and work has begun.
I'm following the guide to taking the body off from Autogasp, and taking lots of pictures and notes as I go. The most I have done before is replacing wishbones, discs and pads etc so this is definitely on the ambitious side.
I thought I would start a thread as I enjoy reading others, and will no doubt have lots of questions as time goes by that can be kept in one place - hopefully some that have done this before will be able to assist!
Saturday
The car was taken to the rented unit, jacked up, put on axle stands and wheels removed.
Car before work started:
I thought I would tackle removing bonnet and spray penetrating spray on any accessible bolt to try and make the ongoing job easier.
Unfortunately, even the easy jobs aren't necessarily so - the allen bolts on the bonnet assembly wouldn't come off.
I got a couple of pictures of the O/S outrigger - the entire corner has fallen away and missing a few inches under the car.
[b]Sunday[b/]
The first proper day on the car and I'm happy with the progress made.
Main parts that were tackled were:
- Removing exhaust
- Remove Y-Piece
- Remove N/S Manifold
- Remove rad and some bits of the cooling system
Manifold and expansion tank removed
Engine bay at the end of day one
The first proper day on the car and I'm happy with the progress made.
Main parts that were tackled were:
- Removing exhaust
- Remove Y-Piece
- Remove N/S Manifold
- Remove rad and some bits of the cooling system
Manifold and expansion tank removed
Engine bay at the end of day one
[b]Monday[b/]
Day two and a second pair of hands (dad) to assist.
Managed to get the bonnet off and out of the way on the wall
Both seats out
Starter motor and other O/S manifold removed (some bolts are a little inaccessible and have to be resigned to very small turns of a spanner)
Fuel tank drained, disconnected and removed
Plenum, coil and a few other bits removed
A few questions for those in the know:
I have tried bleeding brakes using bleed nipple on the calipers and pumping down pedal (with just one and more than one open). Not getting huge amounts out (sounds like air) and still plenty of fluid in the reservoir. What am I doing wrong?!
Clutch bleeding - any tricks here or just use bleed nipple on top of slave cylinder?
Chassis bolts in front of gear knob (the inaccessible ones). What tools are needed? What's the best approach?
Power steering - bleed system and remove reservoir before removing body or worry about it later?
How much does the engine weigh? I need to get an engine stand and want to make sure it is appropriate.
That it at the end of day two. Less time to work on the car for the next couple of days but will keep updates coming....
Day two and a second pair of hands (dad) to assist.
Managed to get the bonnet off and out of the way on the wall
Both seats out
Starter motor and other O/S manifold removed (some bolts are a little inaccessible and have to be resigned to very small turns of a spanner)
Fuel tank drained, disconnected and removed
Plenum, coil and a few other bits removed
A few questions for those in the know:
I have tried bleeding brakes using bleed nipple on the calipers and pumping down pedal (with just one and more than one open). Not getting huge amounts out (sounds like air) and still plenty of fluid in the reservoir. What am I doing wrong?!
Clutch bleeding - any tricks here or just use bleed nipple on top of slave cylinder?
Chassis bolts in front of gear knob (the inaccessible ones). What tools are needed? What's the best approach?
Power steering - bleed system and remove reservoir before removing body or worry about it later?
How much does the engine weigh? I need to get an engine stand and want to make sure it is appropriate.
That it at the end of day two. Less time to work on the car for the next couple of days but will keep updates coming....
The last couple of days have seen far less obvious changes as a lot of time has been spent under the car or spending ages trying to resolve small issues! Thanks for the advice so far, plenty more will be needed! The garage isn't too bad for what it is, and having the space definitely makes life a lot easier. It does however put an element of time pressure on the whole job.
Tuesday
Now that a lot of the larger bits are removed, it is now a case of going round and ensuring all the small bits have been done. The main bits that were attacked were:
- Washer bottle and carbon cannister removed from front O/S wing and pipework (carbon cannister) fed through to engine bay
- Alternator and associated wiring removed
- Power steering drained and PAS reservoir removed
Although it could have been left until the car is dismantled, it was much easier to remove PAS and hoses to give space to work.
Wednesday
I'm hoping to get the body lifted at the weekend so plenty still to do.
Most importantly, those chassis bolts in the centre tunnel are now free and out (god only knows how they will be reconnected with cables etc in place) - in the end I went with cutting the carpet method as I would probably make more mess trying to unstick/restick it around the dash later. Surprisingly easy, the first part of the car that didn't seem entirely welded together with rust!
Unfortunately, the wiring loom for the N/S injectors is fed between the fuel rail and the engine and with all of the connectors, will not feed back through (if that makes any sense, pic below). Therefore i need to remove fuel rail and trumpet base, made more challenging by silicon or equivalent - all bolts on the trumpet base are removed but it is not shifting.....
I have also disconnected most of the wiring from the underside of the car, but pictures of single cables are really dull!
Now to bleeding the brakes again and seeing if I can free the loom on the top of the engine......
Tuesday
Now that a lot of the larger bits are removed, it is now a case of going round and ensuring all the small bits have been done. The main bits that were attacked were:
- Washer bottle and carbon cannister removed from front O/S wing and pipework (carbon cannister) fed through to engine bay
- Alternator and associated wiring removed
- Power steering drained and PAS reservoir removed
Although it could have been left until the car is dismantled, it was much easier to remove PAS and hoses to give space to work.
Wednesday
I'm hoping to get the body lifted at the weekend so plenty still to do.
Most importantly, those chassis bolts in the centre tunnel are now free and out (god only knows how they will be reconnected with cables etc in place) - in the end I went with cutting the carpet method as I would probably make more mess trying to unstick/restick it around the dash later. Surprisingly easy, the first part of the car that didn't seem entirely welded together with rust!
Unfortunately, the wiring loom for the N/S injectors is fed between the fuel rail and the engine and with all of the connectors, will not feed back through (if that makes any sense, pic below). Therefore i need to remove fuel rail and trumpet base, made more challenging by silicon or equivalent - all bolts on the trumpet base are removed but it is not shifting.....
I have also disconnected most of the wiring from the underside of the car, but pictures of single cables are really dull!
Now to bleeding the brakes again and seeing if I can free the loom on the top of the engine......
Quite a productive last few days, although I haven't been great at keeping this thread up to date.
Thanks for all of the offers of assistance/words of support - so far everything seems to be going ok ish (few grazed knuckles and head scratching aside!)
Query on the engine - when removing the ignition leads from the near side of the engine, the middle two have got evidence of coolant on the bottom of them. Not sure what could be causing this??
Everything has now been drained down, the last few cables disconnected and the body is off! Had issues with a couple of the chassis bolts that wouldn't come out or decided to shear (one of the lower ones behind fuel tank and passenger side seat belt mounting) but we were able to slice through both with a large angle grinder (a normal 4.5" wouldn't chop all the way through).
Having read lots of similar threads and approaches to lifting the body and storing the body when off the car, I eventually settled on using a chain winch (attached to an I beam) at the rear and and engine stand at the front to lift the body. A body stand was fashioned out of CLS timber, with some casters on the bottom to allow me to move it around to clean, repaint the underside and replace heat shielding. Everything seems stable so far..........
I'll let the pictures do the talking but it's fair to say that the outriggers have definitely seen better days and are made predominately out of iron oxide. The rest of the chassis looks ok, with the exception of a patch by the N/S exhaust manifold that has disintegrated a little and the rear upper wishbones that are more than a little flaky. The full extent of what is needed will be clear once shot blasted, but hopefully not too many surprises.
Having removed the body yesterday, we managed to get the engine and gearbox out today (although need to buy some bolts before I'm able to mount the engine to the engine stand). I'm hoping that I will be able to get the chassis stripped this week and then the process of cleaning, replacing and rebuilding can start.
Thanks for all of the offers of assistance/words of support - so far everything seems to be going ok ish (few grazed knuckles and head scratching aside!)
Query on the engine - when removing the ignition leads from the near side of the engine, the middle two have got evidence of coolant on the bottom of them. Not sure what could be causing this??
Everything has now been drained down, the last few cables disconnected and the body is off! Had issues with a couple of the chassis bolts that wouldn't come out or decided to shear (one of the lower ones behind fuel tank and passenger side seat belt mounting) but we were able to slice through both with a large angle grinder (a normal 4.5" wouldn't chop all the way through).
Having read lots of similar threads and approaches to lifting the body and storing the body when off the car, I eventually settled on using a chain winch (attached to an I beam) at the rear and and engine stand at the front to lift the body. A body stand was fashioned out of CLS timber, with some casters on the bottom to allow me to move it around to clean, repaint the underside and replace heat shielding. Everything seems stable so far..........
I'll let the pictures do the talking but it's fair to say that the outriggers have definitely seen better days and are made predominately out of iron oxide. The rest of the chassis looks ok, with the exception of a patch by the N/S exhaust manifold that has disintegrated a little and the rear upper wishbones that are more than a little flaky. The full extent of what is needed will be clear once shot blasted, but hopefully not too many surprises.
Having removed the body yesterday, we managed to get the engine and gearbox out today (although need to buy some bolts before I'm able to mount the engine to the engine stand). I'm hoping that I will be able to get the chassis stripped this week and then the process of cleaning, replacing and rebuilding can start.
I have a number of things in mind to do whilst the body is off and everything is accessible (list below). What am I missing? Should I be doing anything else whilst it is relatively easy?
- Renew all fuel lines, brake lines and power steering hoses
- Replace all mounts (engine, gearbox, diff)
- Replace all bushes (thinking standard bushes all round with the exception of poly bushes for the diff) - the car is a road car with the occasionally track day thrown in so want the ride to still be reasonable
- Shot blast and paint anything that stays still for long enough
- New clutch as the old one is on it's way out (although not slipping as of yet)
- Engine - the cam was replaced fairly recently so shouldn't need doing. I'm planning on replacing the valley gasket, possibly head gaskets. Anything else will depend on the reason for coolant in the spark plug wells as per previous post
- Replace CV joints - small amount of shunting previously and much easier to do with the car in parts. Diff was rebuilt a couple of years ago so should be good with a paint and oil change
- All bolts
- Repaint the underside of the car and replace heat shielding in engine bay and transmission tunnel
- Renew all fuel lines, brake lines and power steering hoses
- Replace all mounts (engine, gearbox, diff)
- Replace all bushes (thinking standard bushes all round with the exception of poly bushes for the diff) - the car is a road car with the occasionally track day thrown in so want the ride to still be reasonable
- Shot blast and paint anything that stays still for long enough
- New clutch as the old one is on it's way out (although not slipping as of yet)
- Engine - the cam was replaced fairly recently so shouldn't need doing. I'm planning on replacing the valley gasket, possibly head gaskets. Anything else will depend on the reason for coolant in the spark plug wells as per previous post
- Replace CV joints - small amount of shunting previously and much easier to do with the car in parts. Diff was rebuilt a couple of years ago so should be good with a paint and oil change
- All bolts
- Repaint the underside of the car and replace heat shielding in engine bay and transmission tunnel
Some more progress has been made, now just need to get somewhere local to shot blast it to see exactly what we are dealing with.
The rear of the car is looking mostly dismantled (diff still to go). I had some issues with a couple of bolts rounding off which will need to be taken out in the vice but no major catastrophes.
I think the chassis definitely looks repairable - outriggers need replacing along with some lower chassis tube that runs past the N/S manifold but haven't managed to put a screwdriver anywhere else as yet.
Headlights are on the list to do (forgot to include them on previous post) - I have had new reflectors sitting in the kitchen for the last few months as the old ones are badly corroded
Going to look into seat mounting plates - have seen them on some body offs before and look like a good idea - does anyone have any measurements/drawings for these?
I hopefully should be ok with dampers - currently has Gaz Golds on which are a few years old.
With any luck, everything should be fully stripped by the end of the weekend, then on with the fun task of removing bushes........
The rear of the car is looking mostly dismantled (diff still to go). I had some issues with a couple of bolts rounding off which will need to be taken out in the vice but no major catastrophes.
I think the chassis definitely looks repairable - outriggers need replacing along with some lower chassis tube that runs past the N/S manifold but haven't managed to put a screwdriver anywhere else as yet.
Headlights are on the list to do (forgot to include them on previous post) - I have had new reflectors sitting in the kitchen for the last few months as the old ones are badly corroded
Going to look into seat mounting plates - have seen them on some body offs before and look like a good idea - does anyone have any measurements/drawings for these?
I hopefully should be ok with dampers - currently has Gaz Golds on which are a few years old.
With any luck, everything should be fully stripped by the end of the weekend, then on with the fun task of removing bushes........
Thought I should probably update this for the last weeks worth of work.
The chassis is now totally stripped and ready for shot blasting which should be happening later this week. The diff came out a lot easier than expected - mounting brackets all done up tightly but once these were removed, the diff was rotated 90 degrees and dropped out of the bottom with no issue.
Once the diff was out, we set to splitting the engine and gearbox. The clutch was removed along with the flywheel to enable us to mount the engine on the stand.
Another slightly better view of the underside of the chassis
I spent quite a while dismantling things further to get them ready for shotblasting and painting but it's fairly hard to get interesting pictures of them - drop links removed from ARBs, front and rear wishbones and ball joints taken apart. There were a few challenging bolts along the way, including a few rounding off and shearing but all removed now.
As I wanted to see some progress rather than just taking things apart, I have been cleaning the engine and gearbox up a bit, see below
I have a fun few evenings removing bushes planned for this week along with ordering lots of new parts
The chassis is now totally stripped and ready for shot blasting which should be happening later this week. The diff came out a lot easier than expected - mounting brackets all done up tightly but once these were removed, the diff was rotated 90 degrees and dropped out of the bottom with no issue.
Once the diff was out, we set to splitting the engine and gearbox. The clutch was removed along with the flywheel to enable us to mount the engine on the stand.
Another slightly better view of the underside of the chassis
I spent quite a while dismantling things further to get them ready for shotblasting and painting but it's fairly hard to get interesting pictures of them - drop links removed from ARBs, front and rear wishbones and ball joints taken apart. There were a few challenging bolts along the way, including a few rounding off and shearing but all removed now.
As I wanted to see some progress rather than just taking things apart, I have been cleaning the engine and gearbox up a bit, see below
I have a fun few evenings removing bushes planned for this week along with ordering lots of new parts
Few questions to gauge opinion from those in the know:
- Brake lines - all look in decent condition (dirty but serviceable). Polish up and put back on the car or replace with new?
- Fuel lines - why is some run in copper and some in rubber? What advantage does this give? Should I replace like for like or run rubber tube for all?
- Heatshielding - am I best off buying preformed from PH classifieds or making up myself (if so, what is needed)?
- Wrapping exhaust manifolds - worthwhile whilst I have them off the car?
- CV joints - small amount of play in one, others appear ok -- worth replacing whilst everything is dismantled or pointless?
Seatbelt mounting brackets sounds good but a lot of extra work. I will have a chat to the welder to decide whether to do or not. Thanks for feedback
- Brake lines - all look in decent condition (dirty but serviceable). Polish up and put back on the car or replace with new?
- Fuel lines - why is some run in copper and some in rubber? What advantage does this give? Should I replace like for like or run rubber tube for all?
- Heatshielding - am I best off buying preformed from PH classifieds or making up myself (if so, what is needed)?
- Wrapping exhaust manifolds - worthwhile whilst I have them off the car?
- CV joints - small amount of play in one, others appear ok -- worth replacing whilst everything is dismantled or pointless?
Seatbelt mounting brackets sounds good but a lot of extra work. I will have a chat to the welder to decide whether to do or not. Thanks for feedback
Thanks for all the input guys - looks like I've put the cat amongst the pigeons regarding refit/replace brake lines. The car is definitely a keeper, so worth replacing perishables whilst access is easy. How much work is involved in making/flaring brake lines? Still slightly undecided on this as existing lines don't appear to be corroded.
Fuel lines will be replaces like for like and I'll look at APT/GPR for heatshield. Anyone got any idea how many metres will be needed to do both front wings, bulkhead and then running back along transmission tunnel? Ideally would like to reduce the amount of heat soak in the cabin.
What's everyone's opinion on lightening and balancing the flywheel whilst it is off the car - JE can do this via post?
Fuel lines will be replaces like for like and I'll look at APT/GPR for heatshield. Anyone got any idea how many metres will be needed to do both front wings, bulkhead and then running back along transmission tunnel? Ideally would like to reduce the amount of heat soak in the cabin.
What's everyone's opinion on lightening and balancing the flywheel whilst it is off the car - JE can do this via post?
Twistygit said:
If you don't mind me asking what did you use to clean the engine and box they have come up well. I started this task last night, many more nights ahead I think
I used a combination of a can of Jizer, some spray engine degreaser, assorted brushes and a small steam cleaner. Just make sure everything is well masked off!!Few more things have now been dismantled and even got the paint brush out to try and tidy some bits up a little. The chassis should be going away in the next couple of days to get shotblasted and worked on - hopefully have a chassis looking like Ged's in not too long!
Calipers have been taken apart and seals removed to be painted and rebuilt. The pistons on the front are looking rusted so will be replaced, rears are looking ok so will be cleaned and refitted
I also thought I would tidy drive shafts and diff up, before's and after's below:
Calipers have been taken apart and seals removed to be painted and rebuilt. The pistons on the front are looking rusted so will be replaced, rears are looking ok so will be cleaned and refitted
I also thought I would tidy drive shafts and diff up, before's and after's below:
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