B8 RS4 - 24hr test drive with report/pics
Discussion
Right, I'll try and cover as much as I reasonably can within this ramble as it's still all fresh in my head (I still have a semi numb arse and back from 9hrs of Driving)
Anyway, the best way to start this off to try and explain both my requirement and expectation of the car as well as my RS4 experience to date.
I currently have an 07 model RS4 Avant in Black with Black Buckets and Black optics and I cover around 15k a year in it as a day to car for lugging around kids, doing the shopping and also my carrying my downhill mountain bike, road bike, occasional BMX and generally muddy duties. I don't need the car to be knife edge in terms of dynamics as A) most of my driving is done in crappy conditions and on fairly boring roads and I need the security of AWD where I can safely overtake or 'push on a bit' without worrying about the back end taking over the front end suddenly, B) Although I class myself as a decent road and track driver, cutting edge steering input is secondary to comfort and I don't need the car to be super dynamic as it's just not the sort of driving I do in a day to day car and it won't ever see the track, and finally C) I have a weekend car which is noisier and goes sideways (and also sometimes backwards) everywhere, so drifting and oversteer isn't needed. If Anything, I don't mind the security of a wiff of understeer as at least it'll never catch me out when I'm not concentrating.
I hope that paints a picture of what I was hoping for in the car and basically what my B7 provides me with.
I'd taken a drive on the road and track in the B8 RS4 at the Milbrook Audi day, so I knew basically what to expect. howver, that day was foggy and not ideal conditions, so I didn't really get a feel for the car
I also find that you need to go shopping in it and trapse the kids and parents around in a car and rack up some miles on your own before you get a decent feel for it.
I've got a good relationship with the friendly guys at Swindon Audi, so when they said they had a demo car coming in and would let me have it overnight, I bit their hand off as I've been really keen to get a good test of the car properly
I'd already sat with the sales guys, and we'd basically outlined a spec and package for what I'm looking at, so testing the car was effectively the rubber stamp.
I picked the car up yesterday afternoon, which is a 400mile old daytona grey car fitted with 20" rotor Wheels, Dynamic Suspension, Dynamic Steering (I didn't think it did yesterday, but it soon materialised that it was fitted once I fiddled with the set up today) with a black optics pack, privacy glass and not much else.
I used the day yesterday to do the ferrying around of mrs, kids as well as my elderly parents, and although the Mrs hates it (she generally does when it comes to cars - Unless I'm buying one for her), general impressions were good and it managed all the mundane tasks with ease without showing any of the diff grinding and rolling you get with B7's and R8's - I think Audi have sanitised it a bit, which may or may not be a good thing depending on your perspective.
The car certainly has more space in the back than mine as it's not fitted with the optional bucket seats, which I might add that although I was convinced I'd need them in the B8 after loving them in my B7, the standard seats are very comfortable indeed and offer plenty of support for the sort of driving I do.
Today, I needed to pop up to North Wales to go see a lake (long story), so I decided to kill two birds with one stone and use it as my day with the car and go and find some of the best driving roads the UK has to offer (including a few laps of the 'Evo triangle', which is a small loop of around 20miles that they use in many of their features - It's a mix of tight mountain roads, long sweeping A road and a long fast A road stretch and has no cameras and hardly any traffic). It's a long old trek from my place in Swindon and has been about a 500mile round trip, but although the driving roads were still icy in any areas where there was shade (the temps today hovered around -2 all day), I did enough miles and found enough dry road to really get a feel for the car and cover most of its performance envelope and traffic cruising ability.
I'll attached a few of the pics I took today below, but here I'll try and cover the various aspects of the car and what I felt where positives and negatives
Aesthetics ;
I know that beauty is well and truly in the eye of the beholder and everyone sees things in different ways, but to me the RS4 looks are stunning. It's common theme that you'll see as I go on through this, but I felt that the car looks less 'RS' special and more incognito. For me this is a good thing as I like my day to day car to blend in and only be obvious to those 'in the know', but to others this might detract from the experience. The demo car had the 20" 5spoke wheels which i think gives a much more aggressive look that the standard or 20" multi spoke wheels, but the general styling of the car is less aggressive than my B7 Avant (my mrs felt it was the other way, but being a women, what does she know about car styling, eh? haha)
Interior is certainly more modern and the ergonomics are better than my B7. There were a couple of minor frustrations though. In the RS4, the buttons for the MMI are all chrome, and where they sit flat around the gear stick, in daylight the sun reflects off them and you can't see what they do. They'll become second nature sooner or later and you'll not need to look at them to see what they do, but it was not good today as I had to keep shading them with one hand to see what they do.
Also, there's a small gloss flat area inside the instrument panel in the dash that reflects light from the window and looks like an emergency light flickering on the dash behind the steering wheel. If/when I get mine, I'll put a small square of matt tape there as that annoyed me a little today. I know it sounds small, but for to be honest, it did my head in as for all intents and purposes, it's where a traction control or engine light would be, so it immediately makes you stop and look.
As said above, the seats were very comfortable, they still have that RS4 unique look and feel to them and the extra space they offer in the back means I'll save myself £2.5k and untick the buckets option.
Traffic Driving and general cruising
The car I had didn't have the sports exhaust fitted that I tried at the Audi day, and to be honest it didn't sound too great. However, the trade off is that for motorway and general cruising, you could well be in an automatic 2ltr car. The DSG box handles the mundaneness of general cruising around in Automatic handsomely and behaves like any large capacity slush box Torque converter auto. For motorway cruising, it was certainly a smoother affair than my standard exhausted B7.
On the MMI, I would put the car in comfort mode, which puts the suspension and steering onto it's softest settings and quitens down the exhaust (not that it's loud on dynamic setting) and lowers the throttle response.
Dynamic Steering
I'll be brutally honest, it's pretty crap if you're looking for any form of real feedback.
it has two settings, comfort and dynamic and the only perceivable difference was the weighting of the wheel. The feedback levels are not great and you tend to feel a little disjointed from what's happening at the front wheels. I can see why they've done it and the extra weight adds a somewhat artificial involvment, but the dymanic setting is too weighty when not up to real speeds and the comfort setting is too light until you're at motorway speeds where it's actually at it's best. I found when pushing on, the dynamic setting was best, but it was a little too heaving. I'll not be speccing that on my car as I understand the standard steering is not far off my B7 steering, which in my eyes is about perfect for weight and feel.
The new wheel is very tactile though and it's a nice size with the paddles sitting perfectly at qtr to three. It's a small issue, but I'd personally prefer the paddles to be a little larger and cover more of the wheel circumference, ala Ferrari 458 or Maser Paddles which cover about 8-11 and 1-4 on a clock rather than 8.30-9.30 and 2.30-3.30 as they do on an audi. If you're two hands on the wheel, then it's no probs, but there was times where I had to reach for the paddle that wasn't there.
Dynamic Suspension
Like the steering, it has two settings
The comfort setting is really very comfortably indeed and the damping is at a very similar rate that in my B7 (The DRC was changed in mine in 2010, so it's still fairly fresh), but the spring rate is a little softer, which is no bad thing. You still don't get much body roll and it suits the majority of UK roads. This setting does a wonderful job of cruising as well as keeping things tight when you're pushing on. I actually found that in custom settings, you can switch engine, steering etc to dynamic and keep the suspension on confort, which was the best for most types of 'spirited' driving, unless you wanted to go past 85-90% in which case the dynamic setting just sharpens up the damping a little and also seems to keep the body role reigned in a little more (it's already very good in comfort) - For a smooth track or really well surfaced road, Dynamic is good, but for general pushing on at 80% or so, comfort is fine and the back end of the car will track the bumps a little better too for more traction.
The car isn't as inspiring when pressing on a bit as the B7 and it's much more a case of knowing where the adhesion limits are rather than feeling them. I'm sure it'll cover a lap of any track just as quick, but it's not as involving as the B7 and although I understand it has the same 60/40 drive bias as my car and the engine is slightly further back, it's still a natural under steerer and this is pronounced by the mildly inert steering.
Still, there's plenty of grip and the pace over covering ground in all conditions is equally as present as the B7.
if you did want to drift it, then you can get the back end out, but it takes some serious effort and it's not a particularly pleasant an experience as there's some serious physics trying to stop you playing. For me, that's not a bad thing as if I wanted a hooligans car, I'd have bought an M3 or C63
Engine/gearbox
I'd struggle to tell you that (gear change apart) it's any faster than my B7. My car has recently had a full carbon clean (read as top end engine rebuild courtesy of Audi) and makes 409BHP. There'd be nothing in it other than marginal gains through DSG changes.
The only real differences, well apart from the somewhat muted standard exhaust compared to my standard exhaust, is that the power delivery is more linear. B7's have a noticable kick at 5,500rpm where the inlet flap opens and the exhaust valve also opens up. In the B8 engine, it's not there and you get that marginal gain in power from around 4,000rpm as the torque builds that you don't in the older engine. Personally, I like the kick at 5.5k as I've grown up with turbo cars, but for others it's less important.
It may also be that the test cars engine was still very new and would probably loosen up over a further 2-3000miles, so maybe was few BHP down
The DSG gearbox worked seamlessly, and makes a genuine case for the end of a manual stick. There's certainly less involvement in tugging a paddle, but I think (purities aside) it's progress. The only real concern I could level at it was that even in comfort, it was a little too keen to drop a few cogs when you're on the motorway and you just need a quick blip of the throttle to overtake and change lanes. I know I could stick it in manual and it'll stay in whichever gear I've put it in, but there's times when you're on the motorway or dual carriageway and you just need to stay one hand on the wheel and give the throttle a quick prod to get past something without going down 3 gears and passing at 7,000rpm.
General duties are good though and in manual it'll let you bounce of the rev limiter and change faster than you can blink with no perceivable let up in power. It's also quite nice to be able to go 2nd to 3rd mid powerslide if that's your thing.
General impression
I really liked the car and it's certainly a move forward from the B7, but I can honestly say that there were times today when I was pressing on a bit that I would rather be in my own car where the feedback through the wheel is there and I know that the front suspension is doing the same thing as the rear. As much as I like the DSG, the 7 speeds take away that 50-100 third gear window that my car has.
It's certainly a cracking car though, and as an everyday car, it's slightly diluted the RS experience to a point where it can be exactly that. A car that blends in, yet still gives you the power to overtake long lines of traffic or to leave a leather skinned old bloke in a C4S Cab standing at the lights with a bike on the roofrack and two kids in the car
I'm hoping that a car ordered with a sports exhaust and no Dynamic steering will get rid of two frustrations and the 20" Multi spoke wheels should make it look (in my eyes) perfectly blended between aggression to those that know and incognito to those that don't so I can leave it places at night without worrying that it'll attract unwanted attention like an M3 or Maser would.
If I wasn't the law abiding citizen that I am, I would be able to tell you that the limiter doesn't cut in at an indicated 155mph too, but of course I am, so I can't :wink:
My dilemma now is do I order the car straight away and take delivery next Summer (6-7months lead time) which will mean re-warranty'ing my car, which is going to cost a fortune through the dealer I expect, or just take the warranty and run it for the full year and only lose maybe a further £2-3k on it as it's taken most of it's depreciation and then order in the summer for delivery next winter ( a little birdy in the know also told me that there may just be a minor model change one year in with a steering change)
Whichever way I do it, I'll have to sell my car privately, as although the finance rates quoted at the dealer are very good, the part ex value they'd give me on mine is depressing. Still, I'd have 6 months to sell it.
Oh, one more thing. Not really important, but all the paint starting falling off one rear wheel. Dealer said it must be a defect and of course would be changed without quible on a customer car, but a concern none the less.
Anyway, sorry if this became longer that I'd hoped, I hope you enjoy the pictures ;
6am -5 start to the day ;
Out on the Evo triangle - a truly stunning bit of road, but much better in the summer (in my TVR :beerchug: )
I can see why Evo Choose this road and area for pictures
Shiny buttons you can't read ;
500 miles later, a rather mucky car on my drive tonight before going back to the dealer
My beloved B7. If I let this go for a B8, it's going to be a sad day to see someone else drive away in this, but if anyone wants to make me an offer, it's soon to be up for sale I think - wink wink
Anyway, the best way to start this off to try and explain both my requirement and expectation of the car as well as my RS4 experience to date.
I currently have an 07 model RS4 Avant in Black with Black Buckets and Black optics and I cover around 15k a year in it as a day to car for lugging around kids, doing the shopping and also my carrying my downhill mountain bike, road bike, occasional BMX and generally muddy duties. I don't need the car to be knife edge in terms of dynamics as A) most of my driving is done in crappy conditions and on fairly boring roads and I need the security of AWD where I can safely overtake or 'push on a bit' without worrying about the back end taking over the front end suddenly, B) Although I class myself as a decent road and track driver, cutting edge steering input is secondary to comfort and I don't need the car to be super dynamic as it's just not the sort of driving I do in a day to day car and it won't ever see the track, and finally C) I have a weekend car which is noisier and goes sideways (and also sometimes backwards) everywhere, so drifting and oversteer isn't needed. If Anything, I don't mind the security of a wiff of understeer as at least it'll never catch me out when I'm not concentrating.
I hope that paints a picture of what I was hoping for in the car and basically what my B7 provides me with.
I'd taken a drive on the road and track in the B8 RS4 at the Milbrook Audi day, so I knew basically what to expect. howver, that day was foggy and not ideal conditions, so I didn't really get a feel for the car
I also find that you need to go shopping in it and trapse the kids and parents around in a car and rack up some miles on your own before you get a decent feel for it.
I've got a good relationship with the friendly guys at Swindon Audi, so when they said they had a demo car coming in and would let me have it overnight, I bit their hand off as I've been really keen to get a good test of the car properly
I'd already sat with the sales guys, and we'd basically outlined a spec and package for what I'm looking at, so testing the car was effectively the rubber stamp.
I picked the car up yesterday afternoon, which is a 400mile old daytona grey car fitted with 20" rotor Wheels, Dynamic Suspension, Dynamic Steering (I didn't think it did yesterday, but it soon materialised that it was fitted once I fiddled with the set up today) with a black optics pack, privacy glass and not much else.
I used the day yesterday to do the ferrying around of mrs, kids as well as my elderly parents, and although the Mrs hates it (she generally does when it comes to cars - Unless I'm buying one for her), general impressions were good and it managed all the mundane tasks with ease without showing any of the diff grinding and rolling you get with B7's and R8's - I think Audi have sanitised it a bit, which may or may not be a good thing depending on your perspective.
The car certainly has more space in the back than mine as it's not fitted with the optional bucket seats, which I might add that although I was convinced I'd need them in the B8 after loving them in my B7, the standard seats are very comfortable indeed and offer plenty of support for the sort of driving I do.
Today, I needed to pop up to North Wales to go see a lake (long story), so I decided to kill two birds with one stone and use it as my day with the car and go and find some of the best driving roads the UK has to offer (including a few laps of the 'Evo triangle', which is a small loop of around 20miles that they use in many of their features - It's a mix of tight mountain roads, long sweeping A road and a long fast A road stretch and has no cameras and hardly any traffic). It's a long old trek from my place in Swindon and has been about a 500mile round trip, but although the driving roads were still icy in any areas where there was shade (the temps today hovered around -2 all day), I did enough miles and found enough dry road to really get a feel for the car and cover most of its performance envelope and traffic cruising ability.
I'll attached a few of the pics I took today below, but here I'll try and cover the various aspects of the car and what I felt where positives and negatives
Aesthetics ;
I know that beauty is well and truly in the eye of the beholder and everyone sees things in different ways, but to me the RS4 looks are stunning. It's common theme that you'll see as I go on through this, but I felt that the car looks less 'RS' special and more incognito. For me this is a good thing as I like my day to day car to blend in and only be obvious to those 'in the know', but to others this might detract from the experience. The demo car had the 20" 5spoke wheels which i think gives a much more aggressive look that the standard or 20" multi spoke wheels, but the general styling of the car is less aggressive than my B7 Avant (my mrs felt it was the other way, but being a women, what does she know about car styling, eh? haha)
Interior is certainly more modern and the ergonomics are better than my B7. There were a couple of minor frustrations though. In the RS4, the buttons for the MMI are all chrome, and where they sit flat around the gear stick, in daylight the sun reflects off them and you can't see what they do. They'll become second nature sooner or later and you'll not need to look at them to see what they do, but it was not good today as I had to keep shading them with one hand to see what they do.
Also, there's a small gloss flat area inside the instrument panel in the dash that reflects light from the window and looks like an emergency light flickering on the dash behind the steering wheel. If/when I get mine, I'll put a small square of matt tape there as that annoyed me a little today. I know it sounds small, but for to be honest, it did my head in as for all intents and purposes, it's where a traction control or engine light would be, so it immediately makes you stop and look.
As said above, the seats were very comfortable, they still have that RS4 unique look and feel to them and the extra space they offer in the back means I'll save myself £2.5k and untick the buckets option.
Traffic Driving and general cruising
The car I had didn't have the sports exhaust fitted that I tried at the Audi day, and to be honest it didn't sound too great. However, the trade off is that for motorway and general cruising, you could well be in an automatic 2ltr car. The DSG box handles the mundaneness of general cruising around in Automatic handsomely and behaves like any large capacity slush box Torque converter auto. For motorway cruising, it was certainly a smoother affair than my standard exhausted B7.
On the MMI, I would put the car in comfort mode, which puts the suspension and steering onto it's softest settings and quitens down the exhaust (not that it's loud on dynamic setting) and lowers the throttle response.
Dynamic Steering
I'll be brutally honest, it's pretty crap if you're looking for any form of real feedback.
it has two settings, comfort and dynamic and the only perceivable difference was the weighting of the wheel. The feedback levels are not great and you tend to feel a little disjointed from what's happening at the front wheels. I can see why they've done it and the extra weight adds a somewhat artificial involvment, but the dymanic setting is too weighty when not up to real speeds and the comfort setting is too light until you're at motorway speeds where it's actually at it's best. I found when pushing on, the dynamic setting was best, but it was a little too heaving. I'll not be speccing that on my car as I understand the standard steering is not far off my B7 steering, which in my eyes is about perfect for weight and feel.
The new wheel is very tactile though and it's a nice size with the paddles sitting perfectly at qtr to three. It's a small issue, but I'd personally prefer the paddles to be a little larger and cover more of the wheel circumference, ala Ferrari 458 or Maser Paddles which cover about 8-11 and 1-4 on a clock rather than 8.30-9.30 and 2.30-3.30 as they do on an audi. If you're two hands on the wheel, then it's no probs, but there was times where I had to reach for the paddle that wasn't there.
Dynamic Suspension
Like the steering, it has two settings
The comfort setting is really very comfortably indeed and the damping is at a very similar rate that in my B7 (The DRC was changed in mine in 2010, so it's still fairly fresh), but the spring rate is a little softer, which is no bad thing. You still don't get much body roll and it suits the majority of UK roads. This setting does a wonderful job of cruising as well as keeping things tight when you're pushing on. I actually found that in custom settings, you can switch engine, steering etc to dynamic and keep the suspension on confort, which was the best for most types of 'spirited' driving, unless you wanted to go past 85-90% in which case the dynamic setting just sharpens up the damping a little and also seems to keep the body role reigned in a little more (it's already very good in comfort) - For a smooth track or really well surfaced road, Dynamic is good, but for general pushing on at 80% or so, comfort is fine and the back end of the car will track the bumps a little better too for more traction.
The car isn't as inspiring when pressing on a bit as the B7 and it's much more a case of knowing where the adhesion limits are rather than feeling them. I'm sure it'll cover a lap of any track just as quick, but it's not as involving as the B7 and although I understand it has the same 60/40 drive bias as my car and the engine is slightly further back, it's still a natural under steerer and this is pronounced by the mildly inert steering.
Still, there's plenty of grip and the pace over covering ground in all conditions is equally as present as the B7.
if you did want to drift it, then you can get the back end out, but it takes some serious effort and it's not a particularly pleasant an experience as there's some serious physics trying to stop you playing. For me, that's not a bad thing as if I wanted a hooligans car, I'd have bought an M3 or C63
Engine/gearbox
I'd struggle to tell you that (gear change apart) it's any faster than my B7. My car has recently had a full carbon clean (read as top end engine rebuild courtesy of Audi) and makes 409BHP. There'd be nothing in it other than marginal gains through DSG changes.
The only real differences, well apart from the somewhat muted standard exhaust compared to my standard exhaust, is that the power delivery is more linear. B7's have a noticable kick at 5,500rpm where the inlet flap opens and the exhaust valve also opens up. In the B8 engine, it's not there and you get that marginal gain in power from around 4,000rpm as the torque builds that you don't in the older engine. Personally, I like the kick at 5.5k as I've grown up with turbo cars, but for others it's less important.
It may also be that the test cars engine was still very new and would probably loosen up over a further 2-3000miles, so maybe was few BHP down
The DSG gearbox worked seamlessly, and makes a genuine case for the end of a manual stick. There's certainly less involvement in tugging a paddle, but I think (purities aside) it's progress. The only real concern I could level at it was that even in comfort, it was a little too keen to drop a few cogs when you're on the motorway and you just need a quick blip of the throttle to overtake and change lanes. I know I could stick it in manual and it'll stay in whichever gear I've put it in, but there's times when you're on the motorway or dual carriageway and you just need to stay one hand on the wheel and give the throttle a quick prod to get past something without going down 3 gears and passing at 7,000rpm.
General duties are good though and in manual it'll let you bounce of the rev limiter and change faster than you can blink with no perceivable let up in power. It's also quite nice to be able to go 2nd to 3rd mid powerslide if that's your thing.
General impression
I really liked the car and it's certainly a move forward from the B7, but I can honestly say that there were times today when I was pressing on a bit that I would rather be in my own car where the feedback through the wheel is there and I know that the front suspension is doing the same thing as the rear. As much as I like the DSG, the 7 speeds take away that 50-100 third gear window that my car has.
It's certainly a cracking car though, and as an everyday car, it's slightly diluted the RS experience to a point where it can be exactly that. A car that blends in, yet still gives you the power to overtake long lines of traffic or to leave a leather skinned old bloke in a C4S Cab standing at the lights with a bike on the roofrack and two kids in the car
I'm hoping that a car ordered with a sports exhaust and no Dynamic steering will get rid of two frustrations and the 20" Multi spoke wheels should make it look (in my eyes) perfectly blended between aggression to those that know and incognito to those that don't so I can leave it places at night without worrying that it'll attract unwanted attention like an M3 or Maser would.
If I wasn't the law abiding citizen that I am, I would be able to tell you that the limiter doesn't cut in at an indicated 155mph too, but of course I am, so I can't :wink:
My dilemma now is do I order the car straight away and take delivery next Summer (6-7months lead time) which will mean re-warranty'ing my car, which is going to cost a fortune through the dealer I expect, or just take the warranty and run it for the full year and only lose maybe a further £2-3k on it as it's taken most of it's depreciation and then order in the summer for delivery next winter ( a little birdy in the know also told me that there may just be a minor model change one year in with a steering change)
Whichever way I do it, I'll have to sell my car privately, as although the finance rates quoted at the dealer are very good, the part ex value they'd give me on mine is depressing. Still, I'd have 6 months to sell it.
Oh, one more thing. Not really important, but all the paint starting falling off one rear wheel. Dealer said it must be a defect and of course would be changed without quible on a customer car, but a concern none the less.
Anyway, sorry if this became longer that I'd hoped, I hope you enjoy the pictures ;
6am -5 start to the day ;
Out on the Evo triangle - a truly stunning bit of road, but much better in the summer (in my TVR :beerchug: )
I can see why Evo Choose this road and area for pictures
Shiny buttons you can't read ;
500 miles later, a rather mucky car on my drive tonight before going back to the dealer
My beloved B7. If I let this go for a B8, it's going to be a sad day to see someone else drive away in this, but if anyone wants to make me an offer, it's soon to be up for sale I think - wink wink
Edited by graeme4130 on Friday 14th December 13:31
Dr G said:
Asbolutely superb write up Graeme, I really enjoyed reading that. I'm a little fed up of the 'it doesn't go sideways' generic, lazy Audi reviews and yours seems to get the purpose of the product a lot better making it a whole load more relevant than just about anything else I've read on the cars (Remember the Metcalfe observation that journalists are detached from car buyers?).
I popped a link to this thread on SRS too, hope that's alright; there's a lot of discussion on the B8 over there currently.
EDIT: May I have a larger copy of the 7th photo down for my desktop, please?
Hi I popped a link to this thread on SRS too, hope that's alright; there's a lot of discussion on the B8 over there currently.
EDIT: May I have a larger copy of the 7th photo down for my desktop, please?
Edited by Dr G on Friday 14th December 09:27
No probs about linking to srs. I don't use that site or i would have posted up there too (posted already in rs246)
Ill email you the pic when I'm home later
24hrs on, and after a good blast in my b7 estate today, I'm really in two kinds as to whether to pull the trigger or not......
Ill definitely be buying one, but I might run my b7 for another 12 months and then order one
Edited by graeme4130 on Friday 14th December 15:22
contango said:
You don't seem totally convinced.
Have you tried the S4 variant?
That way you will either realise how good the RS4 is for your needs...or save money buying the S4?
Edit to add; great write up by the way!
I did try an S4 and I'm conscious that with just a quick chip reprogram they can be 470bhpHave you tried the S4 variant?
That way you will either realise how good the RS4 is for your needs...or save money buying the S4?
Edit to add; great write up by the way!
However, they look a bit too normal to me and I've always been a V8 man too.
The sound of the RS4 (with audi's sports exhaust) at 8,000 rpm is something a bit special
Pulse said:
graeme4130 said:
My beloved B7. If I let this go for a B8, it's going to be a sad day to see someone else drive away in this, but if anyone wants to make me an offer, it's soon to be up for sale I think - wink wink
If you do, maybe give me a call - it looks brilliant! Did this car come from Swindon Audi?DrNorthy said:
What's happened to the wheels? A 1000 mile car should not have them flaking like that.
I think what must've happened was that some moisture was sealed into the porosity in the aluminium in the casting/machining process and then sealed in by the paintIt then had its very first exposure to very cold weather (was -8 here Wednesday) and the expansion of the minuscule water particle caused the paint to lift
It's a bit s
tty to happen on a new car, but I've seen it on wheels beforeOn the positive, Audi would change it without quibble, but it'd annoy me if it was my £60k car
Fwiw, after a good long blast in my B7 Avant over the weekend, I've decided to hang onto it for another 12months and then buy a new (or nearly new if there's a good spec one about) B8 RS4 then
I just enjoy my own too much to let it go although its getting long in the tooth now
Edited by graeme4130 on Monday 17th December 12:49
ecain63 said:
Maybe a little bit of a contrast:
I took a daytona out today for a few hours and to be honest wasnt impressed. Its a step back from the B7 in my opinion, although it is handy having the extra space in the back and a few extra functions and adjustments available. One thing that annoyed me though was the delay between pulling the paddles and the car changing gear. For example I was pulling the upshift paddle at 6krpm but it wasnt changing up until about 1.5sec / 100rpm later. Really annoying when you want to press on. Being used to the SMG in my M5 i was hoping for superfast changes but felt like i was being held up by unnecessary electronic influences. Auto mode is super smooth however, which is nice when youre just pootling about, but i like to feel its actually changing gear when making progress (maybe im just not used to the DCT type box yet). Im sure its a quicker way to get to 100 leptons but its too smooth and uninvolving.
Another point against the B8! Is the steering is more numb than that of the B7? Felt that way, which is incredible. Dynamic mode is so heavy too (although the improved exhaust note is a plus)! Yes its designed to make the car feel more weighted and drivable but for me it just felt like i was having to wrestle it around corners rather than drive it. In the end i reverted back to the lighter steering setting.
On the whole its a fantastic 'car' and the interior is brilliant, but its no sports car. Lacking in low down torque (above 4krpm its decent but not savage like the RS6), a dead weight in your hands and generally and a bit boring. The 20 inch alloys make it quite a bumpy ride too.
I didnt want to be disappointed, but i was. As soon as i got back in my M5 all the things that make the M-brand a superior drivers car were so obvious. I dont know why Audi haven't made a RS4 or RS6 to compete in the handling market, Merc AMG are getting there. As a motorway cruiser the RS brand is excellent, but no more enjoyable than //M or AMG. At least the //M and AMG barges like to be shown a corner or two. As a consequence ive been asked to drive it again next week when its done a few more miles. Maybe it'll loosen up a bit! Not holding much hope though.
Eddie
Hi EddieI took a daytona out today for a few hours and to be honest wasnt impressed. Its a step back from the B7 in my opinion, although it is handy having the extra space in the back and a few extra functions and adjustments available. One thing that annoyed me though was the delay between pulling the paddles and the car changing gear. For example I was pulling the upshift paddle at 6krpm but it wasnt changing up until about 1.5sec / 100rpm later. Really annoying when you want to press on. Being used to the SMG in my M5 i was hoping for superfast changes but felt like i was being held up by unnecessary electronic influences. Auto mode is super smooth however, which is nice when youre just pootling about, but i like to feel its actually changing gear when making progress (maybe im just not used to the DCT type box yet). Im sure its a quicker way to get to 100 leptons but its too smooth and uninvolving.
Another point against the B8! Is the steering is more numb than that of the B7? Felt that way, which is incredible. Dynamic mode is so heavy too (although the improved exhaust note is a plus)! Yes its designed to make the car feel more weighted and drivable but for me it just felt like i was having to wrestle it around corners rather than drive it. In the end i reverted back to the lighter steering setting.
On the whole its a fantastic 'car' and the interior is brilliant, but its no sports car. Lacking in low down torque (above 4krpm its decent but not savage like the RS6), a dead weight in your hands and generally and a bit boring. The 20 inch alloys make it quite a bumpy ride too.
I didnt want to be disappointed, but i was. As soon as i got back in my M5 all the things that make the M-brand a superior drivers car were so obvious. I dont know why Audi haven't made a RS4 or RS6 to compete in the handling market, Merc AMG are getting there. As a motorway cruiser the RS brand is excellent, but no more enjoyable than //M or AMG. At least the //M and AMG barges like to be shown a corner or two. As a consequence ive been asked to drive it again next week when its done a few more miles. Maybe it'll loosen up a bit! Not holding much hope though.
Eddie
I'm surprised you found an issue with the change speed on the DSG. My experience of the reaction time of the shift was really positive. I've driven a 458 as well as bmw's latest F10 m5 box and I found the speeds from paddle to change comparable
Maybe the car you tested had an issue as i expect you'll find it night and day in comparison to your e60 SMG
Perhaps there'll pick something up in the dealer and it'll be a more pleasurable experience next time.
I liked the box other than its cruising tendency to change down too many cogs when applying a prod of the throttle, but this may be a functioned designed in to match the high revving characteristics (read as 'no low torque') of the engine
I agree with your steering statement entirely. I found it just too heavy on weight but light on feedback in dynamic mode and driving it back to back with my B7, it just highlighted how disjointed the whole steering feels.
The car finds massive amounts of front end grip with the front slung engine weight and wide tyres, but you dive into a corner knowing it should grip rather than actually be able to feel it and judge the adhesion limits based on feedback through the wheels. It's all very 'steer and hope'
The B7 steering, I think much like your m5, is a different game altogether
I did hear from a reasonably reliable source that the non dynamic steering is actually a lot better, but I'm yet to try it myself
However, I did drive a car on the std 19"s and although it arguably rode a bit better, there was still no steering difference or percievable grip difference.
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Edited by graeme4130 on Sunday 16th December 21:27
coyft said:
I've placed my order without the dynamic steering, arrives in late April. I tried the S4 but found it a bit "weedy" in comparison to the RS4, I suspect it's almost as quick though.
I found the same with the S4. Sure, it's got more torque lower down the rev range so you don't need to swap gears as often, but it just seemed really boring in comparison and the noise wasn't a touch on th V8Hi All
I thought I'd bring this thread a bit more up to date.
I did renew the warranty on my B7 RS4 for another year (Despite it being extortionately expensive, but still, I guess, cheaper than a new engine)
However, as the months passed, the call of a newer more modern car was just too strong, so I placed my B8 order
Anyway, to cut a long story short, this is my new car ;
I thought I'd bring this thread a bit more up to date.
I did renew the warranty on my B7 RS4 for another year (Despite it being extortionately expensive, but still, I guess, cheaper than a new engine)
However, as the months passed, the call of a newer more modern car was just too strong, so I placed my B8 order
Anyway, to cut a long story short, this is my new car ;
coyft said:
How are you getting on with yours? I've had mine for about a month now, it's alright but I don't love it like I did the B7.
I managed to spec mine without the dynamic steering, it's a bit better but still not as nice as the B7.
The drive select thingy is a waste of time.
The foot rest for the left foot is too far into the well, rendering it useless.
The buttons for radio, media, nav etc., are in a stupid place.
On a plus point, the door stays work better.
It's difficult to say at only a few hundred miles in, but a few points early on are ;I managed to spec mine without the dynamic steering, it's a bit better but still not as nice as the B7.
The drive select thingy is a waste of time.
The foot rest for the left foot is too far into the well, rendering it useless.
The buttons for radio, media, nav etc., are in a stupid place.
On a plus point, the door stays work better.
It's faster than my (dyno'd 409bhp) B7 RS4 avant - it's not exactly scientific, but according to my iPhone performance testing GPS app, it's quite a bit quicker both 0-60 & 30-100
It does 'mundane' driving better as its both more comfortable and with the auto box, it tends to make normal driving a lot easier and less temptation to hold the revs and boot it everywhere.
I personally think it looks a lot better than my B7 as that started to look and feel very dated compared to equivalent cars in the marketplace (m3 /c63 estate etc)
The engine note with the sports exhaust sounds a bit crisper than my b7 did
Steering Feel at initial turn in isn't as good as the B7, but once you have the car settled into the corner, the feel is still there and I'd guess that overall sheer cornering grip is actually better (mine has dynamic steering, which after some deliberation, I actually started to quite like after a demo car and the Audi rs4 driving day) - fwiw I'd still take B7 steering
I'll make a proper write up at the end of June once I've driven it 2000 miles across Europe and back and I've had a better chance to digest it properly
Overall though, I'm very happy with it so far.
Blue62 said:
just had 24 hrs in a B8 having previously owned a B7. For perspective my daily is a Disco 4 and my weekend is a 991S, I am thinking about an RS4 as a replacement for both (sort of), so I was accepting the compromise. Thoughts against the B7 were that it doesn't have the special feel that car had when I first got behind the wheel, it's good but not (in relative terms) as good as the B7. Quality and fit and finish is right up there, but the car I drove with dynamic steering lacked feel and though I only had a day I couldn't find a good set up, ride way too firm for our roads, poor feedback, great grip but limited involvement. Lovely car and would still look twice, but I don't think they've built on the B7's achievements, which sums up the 991 against the 997 for me, an Audi/Porsche/VW trait perhaps.
I think the 997/991 comparison very validI had the same initial feeling on the steering, but with time, I got more accustomed to it and found it ok (although not as good in terms of outright feel as my old B7)
Suspension on dynamic setting is true 'head in hands' firm. Honestly, what were they thinking bringing that to the uk. Comfort setting is decent though
coyft said:
I've had mine a couple of years and have done about 30,000 miles.
It's not as fun to drive as the B7, but is more relaxing to drive in traffic due to the automatic gearbox. I really dislike the different modes for suspension, steering and engine. Mine is left in comfort mode all the time as dynamic is far too harsh for UK roads, dynamic engine mode isn't much better either. In this mode the engine note sounds good but it holds the gears too long and does an unnecessary throttle blip.
I specced mine without the dynamic steering option as I couldn't get on with it during a test drive. My summary would be it's a good car, but the old one was a great car.
Since writing the original post I'm on my second B8 RS4 with 7 months in a RS5 in-betweenIt's not as fun to drive as the B7, but is more relaxing to drive in traffic due to the automatic gearbox. I really dislike the different modes for suspension, steering and engine. Mine is left in comfort mode all the time as dynamic is far too harsh for UK roads, dynamic engine mode isn't much better either. In this mode the engine note sounds good but it holds the gears too long and does an unnecessary throttle blip.
I specced mine without the dynamic steering option as I couldn't get on with it during a test drive. My summary would be it's a good car, but the old one was a great car.
Re the engine noise and holding gears, if you just reselect D rather than S on the stick, you'll still get the better exhaust sound, but normal shifting on no more blips on downshifts
I obviously like the B8, It's a decent step over the B7 in every way other than steering feel, which I agree takes some getting used to. Not sure that's a good thing, but once you're used to the variability of the rack speed, then it's not too bad at all.
My second one's on 20k miles now, and as they've not yet launched the B9, I guess I hang onto it until they do
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