Disapointed in the new Range Rover :(
Discussion
As the title says, I went to the dealer this weekend with family in tow to try out the new Range Rover. Prior to this I'd driven the 2014 BMW x5 (ugly outside but pretty special inside) and Mercedes ML and GL (good suspension on the ML, was the active version).
RR was a 2014 Vogue with 22inch wheels but sadly I found it pretty average to drive.
Key area's of disapointment were:
The ride wallowed from front to back (not side to side). Some form of active suspension to firm it up was needed.
Brakes were 'grabby' but Dealer suggested this needed to be looked at as car had under 1,000 miles.
The centre screen seemed like Fisher Price in comparison to the X5 and Merc, surely LR need to update this pronto as it looks about 5-8 years behind now.
The pop up gear selector is not to my liking but hey that's probably just me.
The Chrome/SS around the centre (behind gear selector) reflected a lot of light back up. Admittedly a bigger issue in Australia than perhaps the UK.
Engine was 3.0 diesel but it seemed sluggish. Even more so when compared to a RR Sport we tried next with the same drivetrain (perhaps they 'detune' the throttle response).
I think in summary I'd believed all the hype and rave reviews from journo's and expected more from a vehicle priced here at Au$220K (110K sterling).
However in white it did look great...
Not all is lost for Land Rover though because they had a tricked up 110, wifey wife took this for a drive and loved it. So we're buying that instead.
Now contemplating whether to get the RRS or not..this drove far better.
RR was a 2014 Vogue with 22inch wheels but sadly I found it pretty average to drive.
Key area's of disapointment were:
The ride wallowed from front to back (not side to side). Some form of active suspension to firm it up was needed.
Brakes were 'grabby' but Dealer suggested this needed to be looked at as car had under 1,000 miles.
The centre screen seemed like Fisher Price in comparison to the X5 and Merc, surely LR need to update this pronto as it looks about 5-8 years behind now.
The pop up gear selector is not to my liking but hey that's probably just me.
The Chrome/SS around the centre (behind gear selector) reflected a lot of light back up. Admittedly a bigger issue in Australia than perhaps the UK.
Engine was 3.0 diesel but it seemed sluggish. Even more so when compared to a RR Sport we tried next with the same drivetrain (perhaps they 'detune' the throttle response).
I think in summary I'd believed all the hype and rave reviews from journo's and expected more from a vehicle priced here at Au$220K (110K sterling).
However in white it did look great...
Not all is lost for Land Rover though because they had a tricked up 110, wifey wife took this for a drive and loved it. So we're buying that instead.
Now contemplating whether to get the RRS or not..this drove far better.
camel_landy said:
Need to make sure you're comparing 'Apples with Apples'.
What you were driving there was essentially the base spec, get into an Autobiography with either the SDV8 or Supercharged and you'll get a completely different experience.
That said, I wouldn't describe the V6 as sluggish... As observed, the RRS is essentially the same and that performed better. Maybe there was something wrong with the car??
M
Yes I had thought the RR V RRS would have been similiar but back to back the RR was definitely sluggish off the line. I queried if there was a weight difference to account for this. He told me the RR was 400kg heavier which I then assumed was the issue. However a quick internet trawl shows the weights very similiar (he b$llsWhat you were driving there was essentially the base spec, get into an Autobiography with either the SDV8 or Supercharged and you'll get a completely different experience.
That said, I wouldn't describe the V6 as sluggish... As observed, the RRS is essentially the same and that performed better. Maybe there was something wrong with the car??
M
tted me I believe).Funny enough he also told me servicing was $800 per year then the sales manager told me it was free for three years on all RR's....
I really wouldn't bother with the product Ted. The car costs close to £150,000 here in Oz. I paid cash for mine.
I've had the following warning messages pop up AFTER the dealer 'reset the codes' on them.
And it wouldn't be a new Land Rover without a bit of trim hanging off;
Hopefully it can be sorted and luckily I paid substantially more for a five year warranty but at this point in time I really regret not buying the new X5
I've had the following warning messages pop up AFTER the dealer 'reset the codes' on them.
And it wouldn't be a new Land Rover without a bit of trim hanging off;
Hopefully it can be sorted and luckily I paid substantially more for a five year warranty but at this point in time I really regret not buying the new X5
camel_landy said:
The trim is easy as that's just the removable cover for the tow bar.
M
Yep, it has two plastic screws holding it in. They are still there but the trim won't sit in place. It's very strange as all the top clips are all there too. They don't look bent either. M
I push it back up but one trip later it's fallen down again. In my eyes it just sums up the rubbish attention to detail.
I'm going to pop into a hardware store and get some Velcro tape to fix it (like you do with a £150,000-$240,000 car you've just brought).
ted 191 said:
Picking up a new 4.4 autobiography tomorrow......if there are any issues with quality it goes straight back !
Well you'd like to think it'll 'go straight back' but the only available slot they have for mine is next Wednesday (one weeks time). They also said id have to pay for a loan car because the nearest dealer isn't the one I brought the car from (that's 300 miles away). In the meantime the car is now stuck in full off road mode and can't be driven faster than 50kph. So I've given up and left it in the garage.Yep, enjoying the LR experience alright...
SpeedMattersNot said:
robm3 said:
camel_landy said:
The trim is easy as that's just the removable cover for the tow bar.
M
Yep, it has two plastic screws holding it in. They are still there but the trim won't sit in place. It's very strange as all the top clips are all there too. They don't look bent either. M
I push it back up but one trip later it's fallen down again. In my eyes it just sums up the rubbish attention to detail.
I'm going to pop into a hardware store and get some Velcro tape to fix it (like you do with a £150,000-$240,000 car you've just brought).
It has two vertical 'clips' that need to slot in to keep it in place. Remove it and photo the inside for me. LR's are crap, but they didn't fault up here.
P.s. ...brought where?
Now the 50 cent plastic trim is almost resolved that just leaves the catastrophic and complete system failure on the suspension. That'll be another system reset and "we can't find (fund?) the issue sir, are you sure you're using it correctly?" B$lls
t you get fobbed off with these days.Good news is it starts ok and the transmission is still working.
Siscar said:
A.J.M said:
Regardless of cost or how many people have ran them without needs so much as a bulb.
This one is new and clearly has some major fault that leaves it pretty much undriveable.
I would be very annoyed if I put that amount of cash into a car and be left with what is effectively a garden ornament.
Well the OP is talking about having a test drive and not liking it, which is fair enough - personal taste. The one with the pictures isn't an undriveable issue, it's yellow, it's a warning, here I understand that you could call it into Land Rover Assist and someone would come and look at it. but I've no experience of that. Not great and not anything I've had on a Range Rover, but nothing compared to the issues I've had on some other cars, such as a Merc that comes to mind. This one is new and clearly has some major fault that leaves it pretty much undriveable.
I would be very annoyed if I put that amount of cash into a car and be left with what is effectively a garden ornament.
I didn't like the HSE I took for a drive, it was worse dynamically than the high standard set by a RRS, X5 and ML however I thought it looked stunning. I took a punt on the V8 diesel being punchier than the 6 and I'm happy with that. The suspension is still 'wallowy' and the brakes are over-servo'd causing them to 'grab' at low speeds. It's a fine art to pull it up smoothly but one I'll get used too. The car is probably a smidgen too big but that's the size class I chose so I must live with it. There are other little things that you need to get used to. The interior door handles are a little awkward, there are corner bits of wood or plastic (depending on trim) on the dash at either side under the windscreen that reflect street lights at night back up onto the windshield, the chrome bits around the centre consol reflect light badly etc etc but damn it looks good and when it works, it feels great driving it.
Today I escalated the issue on advice from my lawyers and it seems the wheels are now in motion to assist me. No longer do I need to drop the car off at a dealer next week but someone from land rover will arrange a collection from my house via land rover assist.
To others with no issues I say you're extremely lucky. I've had two Disco 3's and both with problems. But hey, I still like the brand despite.
I shall stay 'radio silent' now and update once there's been a rectification one way or another.
A.J.M said:
Sorry, I read that the OP has bought one now... I may have got that wrong though.. 
Nope, you're correct. I wasn't impressed but like a hopeless gambler who doubles down on red I thought the SDV8 would fix my woes.So I brought one and it's stuffed up.
Oh, the blacked out C pillar on the passenger side doesn't fit quite right.
And when I braked firmly on Monday a little piece of plastic rolled out from under the seat and hit my foot.
Aside from that and the suspension failure and trim to rear it's all good
Well my car is back. I considered posting pictures of it being hauled up the low-loader but thought better of it.
Happy to report all is working very well. LR Australia put a new compressor pump system in and replaced all the trim parts that had fallen off.
Now I've been able to spend a bit more time in the car it's really growing on me.
It's not perfect though, for instance all the materials in the cabin are top class, the wheel in particular being a work of modern art BUT the paddle shifts are these horrible cheap plastic things. A real opportunity missed there I suspect. Now every time I admire the small aluminium nacelles that house the stereo and cruise control on the wheel my eyes lift a little further and see the cheap paddles (if there's any aftermarket ones I'd actually swap them over).
But nice touches are the LED lights everywhere, they cast a really nice clear light inside. The sunroof is brilliant too, so wide and long.
Dynamically the car is very good. It's much better to get the SDV8 with the dynamic roll control vs the base V6 without. Makes a noticeable difference.
The brakes are still overservoed though and suspension could be a touch firmer for me.
Next up for the car is some towing. I have two trailers, one around 700kg (twin jetskis) and one at 3,300kg (big boat). Hopefully the car will work with LED trailer lights (it's kinda disgraceful that no modern Land Rover does!!) but we'll see.
For the 3,300kg trailer I'll need to get an electronic brake controller fitted. The thought of drilling into the RR is really putting me off though. To the point where I'm considering hanging onto our Disco 3 just for this job. Talk about first world problems!
So in summary I'm like these guys:
Hate it
It aint so bad
I kinda like it
I love it...
Happy to report all is working very well. LR Australia put a new compressor pump system in and replaced all the trim parts that had fallen off.
Now I've been able to spend a bit more time in the car it's really growing on me.
It's not perfect though, for instance all the materials in the cabin are top class, the wheel in particular being a work of modern art BUT the paddle shifts are these horrible cheap plastic things. A real opportunity missed there I suspect. Now every time I admire the small aluminium nacelles that house the stereo and cruise control on the wheel my eyes lift a little further and see the cheap paddles (if there's any aftermarket ones I'd actually swap them over).
But nice touches are the LED lights everywhere, they cast a really nice clear light inside. The sunroof is brilliant too, so wide and long.
Dynamically the car is very good. It's much better to get the SDV8 with the dynamic roll control vs the base V6 without. Makes a noticeable difference.
The brakes are still overservoed though and suspension could be a touch firmer for me.
Next up for the car is some towing. I have two trailers, one around 700kg (twin jetskis) and one at 3,300kg (big boat). Hopefully the car will work with LED trailer lights (it's kinda disgraceful that no modern Land Rover does!!) but we'll see.
For the 3,300kg trailer I'll need to get an electronic brake controller fitted. The thought of drilling into the RR is really putting me off though. To the point where I'm considering hanging onto our Disco 3 just for this job. Talk about first world problems!
So in summary I'm like these guys:
Hate it
It aint so bad
I kinda like it
I love it...
unrepentant said:
camel_landy said:
Helicopter123 said:
For the avoidance of doubt I'm in the UK and have been offered a (modest) discount for a factory ordered car.
Brilliant... What better way to de-value a fantastic product than to let box-shifters 'sell' them. That's not selling, that's simply order taking.M
In the country he gets around 10 'walk ins' a week, of that about 50% get converted to sales. So he works hard to satisfy everyone who walks in. He also sells about 20% of his product to folks from Sydney (600kms away) because of this.
In the city dealerships its up to 100 walk ins of which the conversion rate is much lower, so they have to be more selective with their time.
So when I rocked up to by a $250K car in my scruffy shorts and Vans sneakers in the city dealership I was treated differently to when I called the Country Dealer.
What ultimately drove the decision making for me though was the spec I wanted (thereabouts) was available at the country dealer immediately, whereas the multiple city dealerships didn't have what I wanted in stock.
Would I have an issue travelling long distances to buy a car?
Not at this price point I wouldn't.
Would I give the Country Dealer first shot at my next LR?
Absolutely.
Siscar, as a serial owner of modern Land Rovers I've had no end of issues. I really can't be bothered to list them here but rest assured I've had them. Doesn't stop me loving the brand though.
Further to that my wife used to work very closely with Senior Land Rover staff and thus I'd hear about the issues first hand.
It seems to me the product is well designed, starting with the Ford influence over Discovery 3 launch however quality control on components is very weak and the product used to suffer from manufacturing defects (yes, both my Discos had the right rear bolt come loose on the tailift strut).
I'm hoping that Tata fixes the problem but I've had my issues in the past:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Further to that my wife used to work very closely with Senior Land Rover staff and thus I'd hear about the issues first hand.
It seems to me the product is well designed, starting with the Ford influence over Discovery 3 launch however quality control on components is very weak and the product used to suffer from manufacturing defects (yes, both my Discos had the right rear bolt come loose on the tailift strut).
I'm hoping that Tata fixes the problem but I've had my issues in the past:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
S1M VP said:
...this thread is seeming so one sided and full of negative points.
Not really, once the (major) suspension fault and other annoying bits were fixed, I'm loving mine (try reading page 2 as well).S1M VP said:
I test drove a 3.0 and the 4.4 diesels ... Both of which I personally felt did not have the power I wanted, coming from my old SC RRS .. So you know what I did ?? ... Rather than buying one of those and then moaning about it ... I ordered myself a 5.0 SC version and now it's arrived I think it's absolutely fantastic.
I think you'll find most people, myself included, feel the 4.4 is sufficient in power and actually a great compromise between economy and 'grunt'. If you read the thread you'll realise this.S1M VP said:
If a bit of trim is hanging off ... Do I come on here and moan about it ... Then admit to pulling the thing off myself ... No ... I don't pull the thing off in the first place ... And if I was so daft to do so, I certainly wouldn't take a picture of it and post it one here moaning about the car.
But it was more than that, it was a complete suspension failure. My view is that people sharing experiences are what makes PH such an excellent forum. You should relax a little and go with the flow..S1M VP said:
We seem to be forgetting that the new RR is a FAR more capable machine and therefore twice as technically complicated than an X5, ML etc.
I think your conclusion is flawed, the X5 is easily as 'complicated' as the RR. You should drive the new ugly x5, it's very impressive and it's technology is outstanding. Still a complete pig to look at though.S1M VP said:
I admit (for the purposes of a balanced view) that the parking sensors failed and caused a scratched rear bumper ... Where I reversed into a wall as I'd become too reliant on the sensors and the camera was dirty and it was at night ... So was my fault really).
Land Rover repaired the sensors and repaired the bumper as a goodwill gesture without any issue.
Ah, so you've joined many of us as a victim of the LR electronics bug, now if you'd posted this issue and the resolution on PH I doubt many people would have called you daft.Land Rover repaired the sensors and repaired the bumper as a goodwill gesture without any issue.
S1M VP said:
Other than that, I've had the car for 4-5 months now and I think it's a blo*dy fantastic machine! the ride is perfect! the power of the 5.0 engine is very quick for the weight of the car and all in all ... I'll be ordering another as IMHO it makes the other offerings fade into the background.
So there !!
So there!! double, x 100, to infinity!!
Okay, bit of an update on the FFRR.
I've now done over 35,000km. Car has been on some very long trips, used daily and recently flashed up for it's second service.
Overall the bodywork is holding up well, the paint quality is light years ahead of the Disco 3 we have. Still looks like new after a wash despite mileage.
Inside it's not fairing so well. There's two or three rattles, one being the slide out cover for the drinks holder. Cue a little piece of paper to hold it in place.
I don't think the rattles would be noticeable in most cars but the RR is so quiet inside (double glazing) that you do.
The transmission is a pain though and I swear it's become worse. When moving slowly through traffic it clunks in and out of gears and feels like a driveshaft is worn. I had a Freelander replacement car and the transmission in this feels much nicer.
Some other annoying things, if you're heading down a long steep hill and want to use some engine braking, pull back on the downshift paddle which engages manual overide and 4 times out of 5 drops you into the next lowest gear, great. However ever 20% or so it'll drop down 2 to 3 gears and redline the motor... worrying really because it's inconsistent.
Then there's the suspension, when cold it's got a weird characteristic. If you brake firmly the front left dips sharply, like it has a broken shock or spring. After about 10 minutes driving it doesn't do this anymore. Strange (and naturally) the dealer hasn't been able to replicate this. I do wonder if they think customers make this stuff up because we like killing time in a dealer service centre...
Oh, it was also leaking oil from a faulty intercooler hose, being repaired under warranty but I'd not really noticed this.
Oh Oh, I just remembered, the door seal is showing rust signs around it. Will try to get this replaced next service. But there again probably not as I think I'm going to offload it soon before depreciation sets in.
One last thing, fuel economy is great, I get 29 mpg which includes a lot of proper stop start city driving. Combined with the fact diesel here is cheaper than petrol means the car is actually really cheap to run.
I've now done over 35,000km. Car has been on some very long trips, used daily and recently flashed up for it's second service.
Overall the bodywork is holding up well, the paint quality is light years ahead of the Disco 3 we have. Still looks like new after a wash despite mileage.
Inside it's not fairing so well. There's two or three rattles, one being the slide out cover for the drinks holder. Cue a little piece of paper to hold it in place.
I don't think the rattles would be noticeable in most cars but the RR is so quiet inside (double glazing) that you do.
The transmission is a pain though and I swear it's become worse. When moving slowly through traffic it clunks in and out of gears and feels like a driveshaft is worn. I had a Freelander replacement car and the transmission in this feels much nicer.
Some other annoying things, if you're heading down a long steep hill and want to use some engine braking, pull back on the downshift paddle which engages manual overide and 4 times out of 5 drops you into the next lowest gear, great. However ever 20% or so it'll drop down 2 to 3 gears and redline the motor... worrying really because it's inconsistent.
Then there's the suspension, when cold it's got a weird characteristic. If you brake firmly the front left dips sharply, like it has a broken shock or spring. After about 10 minutes driving it doesn't do this anymore. Strange (and naturally) the dealer hasn't been able to replicate this. I do wonder if they think customers make this stuff up because we like killing time in a dealer service centre...
Oh, it was also leaking oil from a faulty intercooler hose, being repaired under warranty but I'd not really noticed this.
Oh Oh, I just remembered, the door seal is showing rust signs around it. Will try to get this replaced next service. But there again probably not as I think I'm going to offload it soon before depreciation sets in.
One last thing, fuel economy is great, I get 29 mpg which includes a lot of proper stop start city driving. Combined with the fact diesel here is cheaper than petrol means the car is actually really cheap to run.
Eleven said:
Clivey said:
Hmmm...something doesn't ring true with some of the posts on this thread and I don't mean robm3's. 
I've had 53 new Range Rovers since 1971 and the only problem I had was in 1986, when a small fly became trapped in the interior light. My local dealership sent a technician immediately, freed the fly and brought my wife a lovely bouquet to apologise for all the inconvenience. Other than that not a moment's trouble.http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2013/02/land-rove...
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