Internet upstairs - IMPOSSIBLE!

[walm]

Apologies if asked many times before but I have a deeply frustrating problem and search is down...

I have sky broadband into my main phone-line on the ground floor.
Router is from 2007 - old netgear DG834 on G.
We recently added a loft office (on second floor) and I bought an allegedly powerful wifi USB stick antenna to hook up my desktop (an Edimax Wireless-N150 USB Adapter).

Through that, the desktop gets about 10-15% signal so wifi doesn't work.
If the stars align I might get 20% when the wifi DOES work.
This is rarer than hen's teeth so not a usable solution.

Note that my iPhone and laptop work OK-ish on the second floor. They have maybe two bars in the wifi picture and the download speed is perfectly acceptable.

OK so my wifi is weak - let's just buy a range extender.
Nope. No way.
Plenty of range extenders on google shopping.
None in stock.
Nowhere.
Apparently since every normal human has wireless-N the range problem has disappeared so no more demand for range extending so no more stocking of range extenders.

Fair enough.
I will buy an N-router.
HOLD ON!
Sky won't let you use a non-sky router. No siree bob.
Arse.

I then bought some Belkin Gigabit Powerline HD adaptors.
These may be the worst product in history, just FYI.
You are supposed to plug them into your power socket and then link an ethernet cable to your router and another to your PC.
That's it.
That's it my arse.
Nothing. All the lights say that it is working fine but no internet connection.
IE8 troubleshooting just says my router is broken.
Well it fking isn't broken, it's fine: wifi is still working on all my other contraptions.
Install disk? Install disk my arse. It's a CD-ROM with a pdf telling you what the lights mean.
Belkin helpdesk staffed by the usual "turn it off and turn it on again" morons.

So, will I have to throw away my super-fast twin-screened desktop and just use my laptop upstairs?
Please tell me there are other solutions (ones that don't involve Cat5 through the house).

[walm]

Plotloss said:

This sounds to me like a PICNIC problem.

Very, very likely.
I know nothing about computers other than rudimentary forum posting, but now I can't even do that.

[walm]

Plotloss said:

If the link is up between the powerline adaptors then the issue maybe down to configuration inside the machine.

Have you checked that your PC is being assigned an IP address by the router?

You see, I thought to myself - "Surely just plugging the ethernet cable into my desktop won't be enough, don't I have to tell it to look for the powerline things or SOMETHING."

However, since there was NO install advice I couldn't really do much about it and all my googling just found people writing reviews complaining about the lack of install advice. (They were on page 2 onwards of the Amazon reviews, page 1 is clearly full of Belkin shills bigging-up the user friendliness of their over-priced doorstops. I should have read beyond page 1.)

I will try checking the IP address. Thanks.

[walm]

OK - I now have PLENTY of options to keep me frustrated for even LONGER!

I will have a final try with the powerline things. Thanks Plotloss for the advice there.

When that/I fail, I will attempt to switch the Sky router for an N-enabled fella (c£40, I think). From miniman's link getting the username and password looks very straightforward even for me.

When that/I fail, I will purchase one of those Apple airport extremes as suggested by MagicalTrevor. I already have an express so not too much outlay.

Finally I will buy a MASSIVE USB extension cable that I will dangle out the window, down through the kitchen and into the living room, thanks Mattley!

Wish me luck!
Thanks so much for the help.

[walm]

plasticpig said:

Another option is to employ someone competent to set it up for you. It would probably only take them an hour and cost £50 at the most.

But I have PH!!

I have been attempting to solve this myself for some time. Hence the multiple ridiculously mis-informed internet purchases such as Powerlink adaptors.
If I can solve it myself, it will be more satisfying than that time I beat Michael Moore in a farting competition.

[walm]

The Moose said:

Plotloss said:

This sounds to me like a PICNIC problem.

I would have thought more likely PEBCAK, no??

This is now officially the consensus.

The Moose said:

Where in the country are you? It really shouldn't be that hard!!

I didn't realise that wifi strength was postcode dependent.
I am in TW1 = Twickenham, the 'burbs.
If you are potentially offering to pop round and fix it you would be most welcome.

However, I have to warn you of the following.
The router is perched precariously on top of a very large cupboard. (I wanted it as high as possible obviously.)
Behind the cupboard is the phone access point and power socket.
The cupboard is sandwiched between a wall and a fireplace; you can only shift it in one direction.
There is a chunky rug effectively superglued to the wooden floor in front of the cupboard, right in the only spot the cupboard could possibly move into.
The cupboard holds many books, the TV, two crates full of toys, a rucksack for carrying children, the Sky box, and sometimes a small child establishing the exact height required to fall from in order to break young bones.

I don't get home until the two kids (both under 3) have gone to bed.
They are very light sleepers.
The cupboard is located directly below my youngest's (15 months) bedroom.

You will need to move the cupboard because the slightest touch on the router will cause it to fall down the back of the cupboard. In fact, if you merely look at the router in the wrong way, it will leap down the back out of spite.

The cupboard, of course has to be moved in ABSOLUTE SILENCE.
My wife will be the judge of this.
If you cause ANY noise (god forbid actually WAKE the children) then my wife's anger will make the Apocalypse seem like afternoon tea with granny.

Plus access to the marital bed (for me) will be banned for the NEXT decade too.
("You only want the internet for porn anyway..."
"No I don't! But now it doesn't work anyway so even if I did... wait, damn.")

I have tried fixing the damn thing over the weekend but then the children are awake which I assure you is infinitely worse.

The Moose said:

Can you move the router to the middle floor?

I tried this but for some reason the phone line used has to be on the MAIN line.
When I plugged in the phone and microfilter, neither phone nor internet worked.

The Moose said:

What about using a repeater?

That was my first thought. I found some idiot-proof range extenders I wanted to buy but then found they were out of stock on-line.
Subsequently, I have found plenty of other ones available when taking another look, just not the REALLY cheap ones I wanted.
These MAY be an option once I have tried all other avenues mentioned above.
Possibly ahead of the long USB extension cable.

[walm]

Munter said:

Mr Will said:

This is going to sound really stupid (and in fact might be) but I believe that the aerials on routers are mildly directional, designed to project the signal as far as possible horizontally at expense of vertical coverage.

Adjusting the aerial so that it sticks out horizontally rather than upwards like you would normally (or mounting the router vertically if it doesn't have an external aerial) might just get you enough extra range to do the job.

(this is all assuming that it is a signal problem, not a config problem)

And:
http://lifehacker.com/296367/boost-your-wireless-s...

I am sorry but I need all the tin foil for my hat.

However, that hacker site had a hack for increasing the power of your Xmit which looks interesting and completely beyond me but well worth fantasising about.

[walm]

DeputyDawg said:

The Belkin Adaptor problem sounds like a password synch issue.

I take it you been through this? (apologies If I'm going over stuff you have already tried)

And if you get really stuck, I am happy to pop over and offer help, I don't live too far away.

I did try that, although I was low on confidence that I had held down the key long enough the second time.
The two boxes do appear to be talking to each other relatively happily, it was more the router-PC conversation that failed. It may be as simple as the IP assignment that Plotloss mentioned...

Thanks very much for the offer of popping round!
I am going to give a few of the suggestions my best try and might well be PMing you if it all fails!

[walm]

Update: I am just trying to switch my Sky router for a new netgear N enabled router.
As suggested I am trying to find my username and password from my existing router before setting up the new one.
THIS DOESN'T fkING WORK.

The various sites (including miniman's suggested site) suggest logging into the router.
DONE.
Then they say go to http://192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?todo=ping_test&c4...
which I do but it just gives me a blank page.

Then it says go to http://192.168.0.1/netgear.cfg
which just gives me a pink 404 page not found page.

Some sites suggest upgrading the firmware on the netgear router first.
So as suggested I go to www.netgear.com select my product (DG834GT).
I CAN'T EVEN ACHIEVE THE fkING FIRMWARE UPGRADE...
HOW MUCH OF A fkING MORON MUST I BE.
I get the nice message:

Upgrade file is not the correct type or version for this device.

Upgrade failed.

Please obtain the correct file and try again.


Can anybody help me find my username and password from my current sky router??

[walm]

OK a little more googling and I found:
http://www.skyuser.co.uk/forum/extracting-sky-rout...
Which worked some sort of behind the scenes miracle and I now have my details.

A little calmer now.
Will try new router.
Not holding out much hope.
Opening a nice Cabernet before I start.
Wife at the gym so at least she isn't hearing the new swearwords I am inventing.

[walm]

Final update:
I have installed the new router.
It appears to be working fine with my laptop and iPhone.

I go upstairs to try the desktop.
Exactly the same signal strength as with the old box. 15%.
The only difference is that the wireless utility is registering that the signal is N (and B and G) rather than just B and G.

Still won't connect obviously.

Someone talked about the "umbrella" shape to the signal so I turned the antenna 90 degrees to horizontal not vertical.
This improved the signal to 22%.

Still won't connect obviously.

If anyone wants a desktop with two 19in screens please let me know.
It runs XP, probably has loads of virii and is very good at wireless networking.

[walm]

So I am now communicating with the great PH via my desktop.
I have managed to boost my signal to the lofty heights of 24% which is allowing it to communicate with the outside world.
This minor miracle has been achieved by moving the router further away from the cordless phone (I know, I know) and by moving it further away from the telly.

Since the TV and phone and router are all dependent on the one link (the phone socket for the sky box, phone and ADSL all combined) I have had them all rather close to each other.
The TV and phone need to be as far away from the router as possible to avoid what are clearly knife-edge levels of interference.

So I am going to buy a boat load of phone cable so I can have the router as far away from interference as I like.

If I can move it into the kitchen (NOT near the microwave) I will be directly under the office and away from the cordless phone.

Thanks again for all the help.
I think I would have given up about 3 hours ago (and probably got a good nights sleep but had no wifi) without the PH encouragement!