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icebite78

Original Poster:

185 posts

100 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Hi does anyone have any stories or feed back on said dealer?
Thinking about putting my car sale or return with them.
Any suggestions or knowledge of them would be really appreciated.

Carlton Banks

3,276 posts

122 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Seems a nice enough guy but we couldn't get the right numbers for a deal earlier in the year.

VonSenger

1,289 posts

75 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
My mate purchased a gallardo from him last year. Good purchase and stood by his warranty for a couple of small issues.

reedman

563 posts

80 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
I haven't had any dealings with him but why would you give your car to a guy you don't know?

What's the diffrance from cash price to sor price. Is that worth the risk?

JR

Jules 1

93 posts

88 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
I've used them several times and found them to be good straight forward people to deal with, they did what they said they would. Personally I prefer to SOR my cars as don't want to deal time wasters, no shows and also dealing with potential scammers with counterfit bank drafts etc. I'd certainly use them again.
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Henry-F

4,617 posts

131 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Jules 1 said:
Personally I prefer to SOR my cars as don't want to deal time wasters, no shows and also dealing with potential scammers with counterfit bank drafts etc.
Not with regard to the company in the title specifically but in general I'm not sure you would be much better off if a dealer selling your car on sale or return got caught out in a fraud. The fact the garage are selling cars S.O.R means they probably haven't got the money to buy outright, or pay you outright if they get diddled themselves.

It's one of the scenarios when the garage are genuinely nice guys but sadly things run away form them.

Things to consider with sale or return type deals

Once again nothing contained in this post or the linked content is specifically aimed at the company being discussed. SOR works best when the car in question is either very expensive (6 figures plus), or when it's a really hard one to value for what ever reason and you'd fear the worst when buying but hope for the best when selling. You still need to make sufficient margin to stay in business. All you are saving is the cost of stocking the car which is not massive if you need to borrow the money. Just under £70 a month per £10,000 at 8% flat rate 16% APR (give or take a bit for comparison).

Hope that helps & all the best.

Henry smile


Carlton Banks

3,276 posts

122 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Henry-F said:
Jules 1 said:
Personally I prefer to SOR my cars as don't want to deal time wasters, no shows and also dealing with potential scammers with counterfit bank drafts etc.
Not with regard to the company in the title specifically but in general I'm not sure you would be much better off if a dealer selling your car on sale or return got caught out in a fraud. The fact the garage are selling cars S.O.R means they probably haven't got the money to buy outright, or pay you outright if they get diddled themselves.

It's one of the scenarios when the garage are genuinely nice guys but sadly things run away form them.

Things to consider with sale or return type deals

Once again nothing contained in this post or the linked content is specifically aimed at the company being discussed. SOR works best when the car in question is either very expensive (6 figures plus), or when it's a really hard one to value for what ever reason and you'd fear the worst when buying but hope for the best when selling. You still need to make sufficient margin to stay in business. All you are saving is the cost of stocking the car which is not massive if you need to borrow the money. Just under £70 a month per £10,000 at 8% flat rate 16% APR (give or take a bit for comparison).

Hope that helps & all the best.

Henry smile
Are you willing to offer the OP a good value on his car then?

I actually sold my car SOR and made circa 10% more than I would have done otherise.

In addition, I didn't have to deal with paying for adverts, waiting around for morons to waste my time, didnt have to pay for insurance.

Agreed, if the company goes under, you may be stuffed however there are some preventative measures.

IMO, you are at just as much risk leaving your car at any garage whether it be for work or SOR purposes.

Henry-F

4,617 posts

131 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
No, leaving a car for work or SOR is totally different. If you leave a car for work and they sell your car then it's theft. They stole it and as such you have a good chance of getting it back. When you leave it on sale or return you are giving the garage permission to sell it. What happens to the money afterwards is a civil matter. You can't ask for your car back off the new owner.

10% more on SOR is starting to get a bit marginal. Very rough figures: a car that we bid £40k for, there is no way you will get £44k on SOR because that's what we would be advertising it for retail, give or take. So somehow the dealer is trying to return you what we would sell it for. Where is their margin?

If you have a car which the trade want and they are in a buying mood then there is probably £1k difference between SOR and an outright buy like for like. Again, very rough figures. The problem when comparing figures is that whilst an outright purchase figure is guaranteed (you say yes we transfer the money), a sale or return figure is merely a suggestion. The final figure will be determined some time in the future. sometimes weeks or months in the future.

One final point worth mentioning is remedial work. Virtually every car we sell will have required some degree of remedial work prior to us offering it for sale. What happens when it's a customer's car? We aren't going to want to spend our money on your car. The other alternative is that you spend the money up front but you're starting to back yourself into a corner. On top of the trade bid you have to return any up front fees and any remedial work before you can think about profit over the dealer bid.

All cars are different and every deal is different. We do sell cars on sale or return where appropriate and sometimes it's not only appropriate but the only way to go. but it isn't the magic solution some people paint it out to be.

As ever, keep smiling.

Henry smile

Carlton Banks

3,276 posts

122 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Henry-F said:
No, leaving a car for work or SOR is totally different. If you leave a car for work and they sell your car then it's theft. They stole it and as such you have a good chance of getting it back. When you leave it on sale or return you are giving the garage permission to sell it. What happens to the money afterwards is a civil matter. You can't ask for your car back off the new owner.

10% more on SOR is starting to get a bit marginal. Very rough figures: a car that we bid £40k for, there is no way you will get £44k on SOR because that's what we would be advertising it for retail, give or take. So somehow the dealer is trying to return you what we would sell it for. Where is their margin?

If you have a car which the trade want and they are in a buying mood then there is probably £1k difference between SOR and an outright buy like for like. Again, very rough figures. The problem when comparing figures is that whilst an outright purchase figure is guaranteed (you say yes we transfer the money), a sale or return figure is merely a suggestion. The final figure will be determined some time in the future. sometimes weeks or months in the future.

One final point worth mentioning is remedial work. Virtually every car we sell will have required some degree of remedial work prior to us offering it for sale. What happens when it's a customer's car? We aren't going to want to spend our money on your car. The other alternative is that you spend the money up front but you're starting to back yourself into a corner. On top of the trade bid you have to return any up front fees and any remedial work before you can think about profit over the dealer bid.

All cars are different and every deal is different. We do sell cars on sale or return where appropriate and sometimes it's not only appropriate but the only way to go. but it isn't the magic solution some people paint it out to be.

As ever, keep smiling.

Henry smile
Fair point however I made £1000+ than I would have done on a private sale.

reedman

563 posts

80 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
That's the point!
Is it worth giving someone you don't know your 40K car in a hope that you will get another 1K extra. Also its called SOR (sale or if we don't sell it we can just give it back to you)
I just cannot see it's worth the risk to the extra money. If you don't know the guy.

I have left a car on SOR and it work out fine but it was at the garage I bought it from and have bought and sold 3 cars.

Also wasn't there a company that where selling cars in the Midlands that screwed a few guys for their money. Hollingsworth or somthing like that.

Just my thoughts.

JR


cragswinter

8,365 posts

82 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
you'll always get good & bad stories regarding anyone, i figure it's not really fair to go into details on a public forum but if you want my experiences feel free to pm.

MrCooke

795 posts

81 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Henry-F said:
We do sell cars on sale or return where appropriate and sometimes it's not only appropriate but the only way to go.
Henry-F said:
The fact the garage are selling cars S.O.R means they probably haven't got the money to buy outright, or pay you outright if they get diddled themselves.
Sorry to hear you are struggling H wink

In all seriousness though, why not ask the OP what car he has to sell before telling him SOR is unsuitable? As you say further down the thread, it may be entirely suitable in his circumstances.

You can price a boggo 997 or Boxster to within the pound, but specialist or classic stuff is much harder to be accurate with, whether it's £100k or £20k. Sometimes the 'give or take' you mention above is £2000 or more and at the bottom end of that range that's a lot of money to a seller and the difference between a cheque worth taking or not.

Of course an outright purchase is more simple, but more often than not it doesn't return as much as consigning a car to a dealer and I'd proffer that in the great majority of cases SOR does not end in the dealer going bankrupt or dogging.

I'd much rather buy every car I'm offered, there's loads more money in it that way, but when what I want to pay doesn't meet what the seller wants to accept I'd rather them consider SOR than feel forced into accepting a lower price.

Also, do we ever get to stop all this smiling? My cheeks hurt and passers-by think I'm odd. wink

Sam

Legacywr

5,315 posts

74 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
I've just had a really really good idea!

I will sell your cars for you on an SOR basis!smile

I just wish I had thought of it 25 years ago!frown

Martian O

2,620 posts

48 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
I have only sold one car on a SOR basis and wouldn't do it again, too much worrying and anxiety. The dealer turned out not to be very honest, I did get my money in the end, but after several phone calls and about a month before they went bust.

Quite a few of the well known dealers have also gone tits-up holding SOR stock, Hollingsworth, Saffron Cars etc. And I personally know one guy who SOR'd his Gallardo through a well known specialist who sold the car three months ago and hasn't paid the owner for it! He's still fighting for his money.

Edited by Martian O on Tuesday 12th July 21:56

daveyb662

1,604 posts

51 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
Martian O said:
I have only sold one car on a SOR basis and wouldn't do it again, too much worrying and anxiety. The dealer turned out not to be very honest, I did get my money in the end, but after several phone calls and about a month before they went bust.

Quite a few of the well known dealers have also gone tits-up holding SOR stock, Hollingsworth, Saffron Cars etc. And I personally know of one guy who SOR'd his Gallardo through a well known specialist who sold the car three months ago and hasn't paid the owner for it! He's still fighting for his money.

Edited by Martian O on Tuesday 12th July 21:53


JZM seem to really push SOR...last time I offered my Porsche for sale, they offered an £8k price difference between SOR and outright buy, i.e. they only want SOR. They sounded very professional and convinced me they would sell it...as it happens I didn't use them, but in future would consider them.

Police State

3,392 posts

106 months

[news] 
Tuesday 12th July 2011 quote quote all
daveyb662 said:
JZM seem to really push SOR...last time I offered my Porsche for sale, they offered an £8k price difference between SOR and outright buy, i.e. they only want SOR. They sounded very professional and convinced me they would sell it...as it happens I didn't use them, but in future would consider them.
an inexpensive way to stock a showroom in need of stock, eh?...

rimkah

889 posts

52 months

[news] 
Wednesday 13th July 2011 quote quote all
Gave me a terrible offer for my 996 turbo

Martian O

2,620 posts

48 months

[news] 
Wednesday 13th July 2011 quote quote all
rimkah said:
Gave me a terrible offer for my 996 turbo
TBH, ALL dealers IMO (inc. 911V) kick you in the nads come resale time! Cue lots of sucking through teeth!

rimkah

889 posts

52 months

[news] 
Wednesday 13th July 2011 quote quote all
Martian O said:
rimkah said:
Gave me a terrible offer for my 996 turbo
TBH, ALL dealers IMO (inc. 911V) kick you in the nads come resale time! Cue lots of sucking through teeth!
True 911V are famous for it;)

Martian O

2,620 posts

48 months

[news] 
Wednesday 13th July 2011 quote quote all
rimkah said:
Martian O said:
rimkah said:
Gave me a terrible offer for my 996 turbo
TBH, ALL dealers IMO (inc. 911V) kick you in the nads come resale time! Cue lots of sucking through teeth!
True 911V are famous for it;)
I fully agree that they have to make a profit, but we aren't all having a fire sale!
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