RE: Driven: Infiniti M35h

RE: Driven: Infiniti M35h

Tuesday 16th August 2011

Driven: Infiniti M35h

We check out the 'fastest hybrid in the world' (really)



'Hybrid' is a bit of a dirty word on PH. And for a website that's dedicated to matters pertaining to performance cars, that is perhaps only right and proper. After all, apart from the 911 hybrid racer, and with the arguable exception of the Honda CR-Z, nobody has even tried particularly hard to make a sporty hybrid.

Which is why the car you see here, which weighs fully 1830kg and manages 0-60mph in a healthy-but-hardly-earth-shattering 5.5secs, basks in the glow of being the 'world's fastest-accelerating hybrid'.

But however cynical we may be about its achievements, at least the 359bhp Infiniti M35h doesn't play too heavily on the holier-than-thou eco argument peddled by so many petrol-electric cars, whether they're hair-shirt Priuses or Porsche Cayennes pretending to be a wee bit greener.


No, although Infiniti is keen to point out its eco-cred, with talk of 40mpg motoring, the fact that it can run at up to 50mph in electric-only mode (both true and impressive), and that it emits a mere 162g/km of CO2, this is an electric motor that bends quite a lot of its thoughts towards performance rather than fuel consumption.

And it really does go. The low-down shove of the electric motor (199lb ft at 1770rpm) starts proceedings off, while at higher (petrol) engine speeds the 258lb ft of torque keeps the big M35h surging forward - as an overtaking tool it's rather an effective machine.

The interior is also a step up in terms of quality. The swoopy design is perhaps a bit early-90s-concept-car for some tastes but, provided you like its extrovert nature, it is a fine place to be, with genuinely impressive-quality materials put together in a genuinely impressive way.


The transmission makes a commendable fist of normal behaviour, too, especially considering its trick nature. There are two clutches at work, the first (dry) clutch installed between the V6 and the electric motor/transmission. Electronically controlled, it allows the full decoupling of the V6 when the car is in electric drive and power regeneration modes.

The second (wet) clutch is sited on the other side of the electric motor. It is packaged within the transmission where its function replaces that of a conventional torque converter, in effect turning the 7-speed gearbox into an automated manual - with a cut in fuel consumption of up to 10 per cent over an equivalent torque converter automatic. It's all very clever, and actually quite effective - the changes are smooth and intuitive, and most of the time you wouldn't actually know you're not driving a car with an utterly conventional automatic gearbox.


There is also other clever energy-saving trickery at work apart from just the gearbox. The electro-hydraulic power steering system, for example, only cuts in when steering effort is required, while the brake pistons are actually part-controlled by the electric drive motor.

It's all damn smart, and it makes - potentially - the Infiniti M35h into an effective rival for the likes of the BMW 535d. Especially if you can't bear to fill your car up with the 'd' word. But while the M35h gets close to the diesel BMW in both performance and official economy figures (its 5.5sec 0-62mph sprint is 0.2secs better than the BMW can muster, although at 40.4mpg combined it falls 5.9mpg shy of the Bee-Em), it manages it with a certain amount of compromise.


You see, while BMW has been practising the art ofthe fast diesel executive car for decades now, Infiniti is only just getting going with this hybrid lark. As a result, the whole doesn't quite hang together properly. Occasionally you'll get a jerk from the drivetrain as the engine cuts out or kicks in, or the transmission gets itself momentarily confused. The steering, too, has a momentary lapse occasionally when you catch its power assistance napping. And when you're braking, you'll find that the clever braking trickery actually makes it hard to modulate the pedal.

There's no doubt that the M35h has great potential, but it feels like a product that could yet do with a little refining. If you want the latest in plush eco-tech, or if you want the fastest-accelerating hybrid in the world, then look no further than this car. But if you want a thoroughly polished, fast, efficient executive car, we'd wait a few years yet. Or buy a 535d.

HYBRID VS DIESEL : 

                                    Infiniti             BMW 5              Jaguar              Mercedes

Model                           M35h                535d                XF 3.0 S           350 CDI

Engine                         V6 hybrid         Inline 6 diesel  V6 diesel          V6 diesel

Maximum power          364 PS             303 PS             279 PS             265 PS

0-100 km/h                 5.5sec              5.7sec              6.4sec              6.2sec

NEDC combined fuel    7.0 l/100km    6.1 l/100km    7.15 l/100km  6.2 l/100km

NEDC urban fuel          9.2 l/100km    7.9 l/100km    9.4 l/100km    7.9 l/100km

NEDC extra urban fuel 5.7 l/100km    5.1 l/100km    5.5 l/100km    5.2 l/100km

CO2 emissions              162g/km         162g/km         169g/km         162g/km

 

 

Author
Discussion

Major T

Original Poster:

1,046 posts

196 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
I think this highlights the credibility of the 535d!

So diesel still wins over the current collection of hybrids.
An electric car with a small diesel/petrol engine range extender should offer some benefits.

Edited by Major T on Tuesday 16th August 11:12

steveb8189

474 posts

192 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Major T said:
I think this highlights the credibility of the 535d!

So diesel still wins over the current collection of hybrids.
An electric car with a small diesel/petrol engine range extender should offer some benefits.

Edited by Major T on Tuesday 16th August 11:12
Really? What is highlights for me is that a hybrid can produce 20% more power whilst still producing the same CO2 emissions... OK, I admit is uses more fuel and it's only because Diesel gives more CO2 / litre which prodable isn't a decent measure of actual pollution...

What surprises me is the urban fuel consumption compared to the 535d. I would have thought that is where the hybrid would come into it's own but I guess all the extra weight to carry around hinders it.

Makes a mockery of the free congestion charge if a hybrid will pollute considerable more than a diesel around town...

... waiting for someone to tell me a mapped 535d will produce 20% more power and reduce emissions ...

TinyCappo

2,106 posts

154 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
I like the way infiniti are developing their hybrid range.

Though i wish someone would develop a hybrid with a V12 and a 9v battery purely just to ps off the greenies :P

350Matt

3,739 posts

280 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
thinks thats along the lines of the Jaguar CX75

BuzzLightyear

1,426 posts

183 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Should become a credible alternative choice in its' sector - hopefully, it won't take "a few years" to iron out the couple of bugs in the systems...?

anonymous-user

55 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
steveb8189 said:
What surprises me is the urban fuel consumption compared to the 535d. I would have thought that is where the hybrid would come into it's own but I guess all the extra weight to carry around hinders it.
On non plug-in "hybrid" cars, the urban electric only economy is never actually that good because ultimately all the power has to come from the IC engine, and with a round trip efficiency (generator - power electronics - battery - power electronics - motor) of something around 55% it is actually better in the long run to just couple your engine to the wheels with an efficent mechanical transmission. (basically, all your "gains" (engne operating in more efficient zone, reduction in total frictional losses etc etc) are more than offset by the new "losses". The tets procedure is to run the hybrid over as many NEDC cycles as it takes to get "charge parity" at the end of the test (ie the point where the battery SOC is the SAME at the end of test as at the start) Thos of course means the IC engine has to start and runm hence the poor Urban FE numbers!

To be really good over the Urban cycle, you need a plug in hybrid that does not generate it's power from the on board IC engine.


Also, to be fair to BMW, the 535d is getting on a bit now, and i should immagine the next gen version will be pretty good numbers over the drive cycle........ ;-)

Ozone

3,046 posts

188 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Followed one of these down the M40 this morning and noticed the h in the badge, it is certainly swift but looks ugly from the back, a bit like a melted Jag. I know it's not about the looks but if you are spending 535D money it would help to sell them if they looked a bit classy. I wonder how these sell in their target market of the states.

Accelebrate

5,252 posts

216 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Pity it's not more of a looker, and a shame the passenger side of the dash appears to have deformed.

I quite like the idea of big fast petrol hybrids.

nouze

853 posts

178 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
I'm surprised no one's complained about the l/100km yet. I'm proud of you PH

thinfourth2

32,414 posts

205 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Kryten had a play in one of these in his fully charged electric car show as found on youtube and he loved it.

rundhuhn

21 posts

267 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
What I'am asking myself is: why do the hybrid-petrol-combination when you can get about the same performance and economy with a "simple" turbodiesel? The hybrid-petrol-thing seems to be the technical solution to a cultural problem (diesel-phobia, especially in the USA).

DeadMeat_UK

3,058 posts

283 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Since when did 0-60 in 5.5 secs become a bit run of the mill???

rj1986

1,107 posts

169 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
DeadMeat_UK said:
Since when did 0-60 in 5.5 secs become a bit run of the mill???
I was thinking that- considering its a big 4 door family car.

One thing that is missing in the comparison table is the otr price for each make.

Sandie

2 posts

154 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
rundhuhn said:
What I'am asking myself is: why do the hybrid-petrol-combination when you can get about the same performance and economy with a "simple" turbodiesel? The hybrid-petrol-thing seems to be the technical solution to a cultural problem (diesel-phobia, especially in the USA).
Because they sell far more Infinitis in the US than they ever will do in Europe.

ChiChoAndy

73,668 posts

256 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
DeadMeat_UK said:
Since when did 0-60 in 5.5 secs become a bit run of the mill???
Shame they didn't bring over the V8

Riggers

1,859 posts

179 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
DeadMeat_UK said:
Since when did 0-60 in 5.5 secs become a bit run of the mill???
In the context of a large four-door saloon, it's not - but in the context of the 'world's fastest-accelerating something' it doesn't seem quite so extraordinary...

infradig

978 posts

208 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
nouze said:
I'm surprised no one's complained about the l/100km yet. I'm proud of you PH
Sorry to let the side down,but I haven't got a clue what all that l/100km bks means! Not 100% about whether a PS is a bit more or a bit less than a BHP either.

Apart from a Civic the only proper Hybrid I've driven(Lexus RX) impressed me far more with it's power and acceleration than it did with it's economy,in fact in this country I can't imagine anyone would buy a big hybrid for economy reasons, more as a 'green' statement or in the old days to avoid the con. charge. Therefore the only credible rival must be the Lexus GS hybrid.

Riggers

1,859 posts

179 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
infradig said:
nouze said:
I'm surprised no one's complained about the l/100km yet. I'm proud of you PH
Sorry to let the side down,but I haven't got a clue what all that l/100km bks means! Not 100% about whether a PS is a bit more or a bit less than a BHP either.
Sorry - slightly lazy cut-and-pasting there smile

To help you out, 1ps equals 0.9863bhp, while if you want to convert l/100km into real money, divide 282.481 by the l/100km figure smile

infradig

978 posts

208 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
Riggers said:
infradig said:
nouze said:
I'm surprised no one's complained about the l/100km yet. I'm proud of you PH
Sorry to let the side down,but I haven't got a clue what all that l/100km bks means! Not 100% about whether a PS is a bit more or a bit less than a BHP either.
Sorry - slightly lazy cut-and-pasting there smile

To help you out, 1ps equals 0.9863bhp, while if you want to convert l/100km into real money, divide 282.481 by the l/100km figure smile
Yeah,thanks for that.

PMKeates

74 posts

168 months

Tuesday 16th August 2011
quotequote all
The data for the 535d is pretty much incorrect from Autumn 2011 (a couple of weeks away).

http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/pricesandspecifications...

You can see there the new figures are 313 PS for the power and for the fuel economy/emissions:

NEDC combined fuel 5.4 l/100km
NEDC urban fuel 6.5 l/100km
NEDC extra urban fuel 4.8 l/100km
CO2 emissions 142g/km

This extends the lead of the 535d significantly.

Regarding Metric HP (PS) vs. Imperial HP, I wish the British motoring press would get over themselves already and move to Metric HP! Virtually everything is measured this way.

Edited by PMKeates on Tuesday 16th August 16:44