Dual carriageway speed limit?
Discussion
The A9 between Perth and Inverness is a mixture of single and dual carriageway. The single carriageway sections have regular "60" repeater signs. The dual carriageway sections do not have any speed limit signs until you go back to single when there are "60" (full size) signs at the end of the dual carriageway. There are no speed limit signs - NSL or otherwise - when you go from single to dual.
For many years I assumed the it would be a 70 limit for cars on the dual sections. However, I have been told of someone being pulled by trafpol on a dual section and being warned for doing 70. He was told the 60 limit applied to the whole road.
Can our BIB advise me of their opinions? 60 or 70?
For many years I assumed the it would be a 70 limit for cars on the dual sections. However, I have been told of someone being pulled by trafpol on a dual section and being warned for doing 70. He was told the 60 limit applied to the whole road.
Can our BIB advise me of their opinions? 60 or 70?
Surely with no national speed limit sign, or any other sign at the two lane section, why would the speed limit change from the indicated 60 limit going from the single lane into it? If the single lane had been a national speed limit road and not a signed 60, then it would probably be 70 on the dual carriageway.
streaky said:
P I Staker said:
I live along the A9, its a 70 limit on the dual carriageway sections.
Authority?Streaky
Not difinative I guess, but its enough for me.
There is no specific speed limit traffic order applicable to the A9. The National Speed limit therefore applies.
The single carriageway sections are therefore 60, the dual carriageway sections are 70 (for cars - other limits apply to other vehicles before any smartarse steps in).
Under the TSRGD, signs are not strictly required on the change from single to dual - people are expected to know that the NSL applies (although it's obvious, by the responses to this and every other similar thread, that even many so-called "enthusiasts" don't know the NSL limits).
There is a history of very serious accidents on the single carriageway sections of the A9. Because it's a tourist route, some of those accidents involved people on the wrong side of the road. Some (non-tourist) people even forget they are on a single carriageway bit and go for what they think is an easy overtake in the right hand lane, and get swiped by somebody coming the other way - it nearly happened to me there once. (the road twists between mountains and there are stretches where the "up" carriageway isn't visible from the "down" carriageway and vice versa, so it's easy to forget after the two carriageways join again).
Many of the accidents involved speeds well in excess of the speed limit, or utterly ludicrous overtaking attempts (I have seen many of those on this route as well). These are largely prompted by large numbers of caravans or slow-moving lorries (for which the limit on the singe carriageway sections is, of course, 40) - the whole length, from Perth to Inverness, is 108 miles, so the difference between 40mph most of the way, and 60, is considerable, so people take chances far in excess of their skill level.
In addition to proposals to dual more sections, and provide better overtaking opportunities on other bits, there is specific ministerial authority to put up non-standard "60" repeater signs on the single carriageway bits (and opposing arrows on the road surface to remind you that it's not dual and there's traffic coming the other way).
The single carriageway sections are therefore 60, the dual carriageway sections are 70 (for cars - other limits apply to other vehicles before any smartarse steps in).
Under the TSRGD, signs are not strictly required on the change from single to dual - people are expected to know that the NSL applies (although it's obvious, by the responses to this and every other similar thread, that even many so-called "enthusiasts" don't know the NSL limits).
There is a history of very serious accidents on the single carriageway sections of the A9. Because it's a tourist route, some of those accidents involved people on the wrong side of the road. Some (non-tourist) people even forget they are on a single carriageway bit and go for what they think is an easy overtake in the right hand lane, and get swiped by somebody coming the other way - it nearly happened to me there once. (the road twists between mountains and there are stretches where the "up" carriageway isn't visible from the "down" carriageway and vice versa, so it's easy to forget after the two carriageways join again).
Many of the accidents involved speeds well in excess of the speed limit, or utterly ludicrous overtaking attempts (I have seen many of those on this route as well). These are largely prompted by large numbers of caravans or slow-moving lorries (for which the limit on the singe carriageway sections is, of course, 40) - the whole length, from Perth to Inverness, is 108 miles, so the difference between 40mph most of the way, and 60, is considerable, so people take chances far in excess of their skill level.
In addition to proposals to dual more sections, and provide better overtaking opportunities on other bits, there is specific ministerial authority to put up non-standard "60" repeater signs on the single carriageway bits (and opposing arrows on the road surface to remind you that it's not dual and there's traffic coming the other way).
P I Staker said:
streaky said:
P I Staker said:
I live along the A9, its a 70 limit on the dual carriageway sections.
Authority?Streaky
However, Scottish signing can be at variance with that South of Hadrian's Wall, and the 60 signs might be just a reminder of the lower (than NSL) limit on the SC sections.
The definitive is dictated by the start and any change of limit signs.
Streaky
Edited by streaky on Saturday 31st December 20:26
Iain XR4i said:
If you are already in a NSL area at 60mph, and the road changes to dual-carriageway it is still NSL, although the actual speed limit has increased for cars/bikes, so why would there be any need to put a sign up?
For the stupid who don't know the NSL limits? I've give an example 
Changedmyname said:
It's 60mph on a duel carriageway and 70mph on the motorway,shirley!
Although to my mind if you don't know the NSL limits then your unable to drive as it's as basic as knowing to drive on the left. Mind you most drivers can't do that either when faced with more than more lane in each direction.i know so many people that still believe a dual carriageway is 60mph and of course no amount of telling them to read the highway code will change there mind.
But then given half the drivers can't use roundabouts, or indicators it makes you wonder how they passed i the first place!
Sad thing is with driving standards declining it's just giving more ammo to the those who want regular testing
But then given half the drivers can't use roundabouts, or indicators it makes you wonder how they passed i the first place!
Sad thing is with driving standards declining it's just giving more ammo to the those who want regular testing
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