parking across a dropped kerb driveway
Discussion
Just wondering. If someone were to park their car across a driveway (dropped kerb) when a car were on that driveway. And that person prevented the car being driven in an emergency (i.e blocked someone from reaching a hospital or delayed that person reaching a hospital) has (or could) a prosecution be made against the driver of the car for manslaughter or something similar ? or would they just be prosecuted for the road offence.
Context of this is that parents neighbour does this all the time despite being asked (told) repeatedly not to, even when a car is present on the driveway. Just wondered what the worst case scenario is.
Context of this is that parents neighbour does this all the time despite being asked (told) repeatedly not to, even when a car is present on the driveway. Just wondered what the worst case scenario is.
I have 2 dropped kerbs on my drive(in and out)and am constantley having to get people to shift their vehicles so I can get on or off my drive mostly next door who have the same arrangement but their visitors seem unable or are too lazy to use their drive,the thing is my local council(Bexleyheath)sent letters to everyone stating that it is illegal to park across drop kerbs and tickets would be issued alas they seem to have forgotten my ROAD!
You could stick a leaflet to his window(s) highlighting the relevant part of the Highway Code, and the related section of the Road Traffic Act.
The 'dropped kerb' rule only really applies to those that are there for the benefit of wheelchair & mobility scooters - the HC doesn't mention dropped kerbs in relation to property access.
The Traffic Management Act 2004, Part 6, 86 gives all local authorities in England with civil parking enforcement powers the ability to take action when a vehicle is parked alongside a dropped kerb in a Special Enforcement Area (that is, an area where parking is, in all other instances, permitted).
The 'dropped kerb' rule only really applies to those that are there for the benefit of wheelchair & mobility scooters - the HC doesn't mention dropped kerbs in relation to property access.
Highway Code Rule 243 said:
DO NOT stop or park
Except when forced to do so by stationary traffic.
...and...- near a school entrance
- anywhere you would prevent access for Emergency Services
- at or near a bus or tram stop or taxi rank
- on the approach to a level crossing or tramway crossing
- opposite or within 10 metres (32 feet) of a junction, except in an authorised parking space
- near the brow of a hill or hump bridge
- opposite a traffic island or (if this would cause an obstruction) another parked vehicle
- where you would force other traffic to enter a tram lane
- where the kerb has been lowered to help wheelchair users and powered mobility vehicles
- in front of an entrance to a property
- on a bend
Except when forced to do so by stationary traffic.
The Traffic Management Act 2004, Part 6, 86 gives all local authorities in England with civil parking enforcement powers the ability to take action when a vehicle is parked alongside a dropped kerb in a Special Enforcement Area (that is, an area where parking is, in all other instances, permitted).
sugerbear said:
Just wondering. If someone were to park their car across a driveway (dropped kerb) when a car were on that driveway. And that person prevented the car being driven in an emergency (i.e blocked someone from reaching a hospital or delayed that person reaching a hospital) has (or could) a prosecution be made against the driver of the car for manslaughter or something similar ? or would they just be prosecuted for the road offence.
Context of this is that parents neighbour does this all the time despite being asked (told) repeatedly not to, even when a car is present on the driveway. Just wondered what the worst case scenario is.
That is prety shiity of the neighbour. We suffer similar, but opposite our dropped kerb. The road is already narrow, but tContext of this is that parents neighbour does this all the time despite being asked (told) repeatedly not to, even when a car is present on the driveway. Just wondered what the worst case scenario is.
ts still park opposite, making thre road a whole lot narrower, and impeding our access. Several nice notes on windscreens seems to make no difference. In fact a few months back a tanker driver had to go round knocking on doors as he couldn't get past. Makes we wonder what a fire engine would need to do. Our property is 100+ feet down a driveway, so any emergency vehicle would have to try and get down it. I've tried writting to the council, but no luck. I'll may be try again from the emergency vehicle standpoint. mmm-five said:
...and...
The Traffic Management Act 2004, Part 6, 86 gives all local authorities in England with civil parking enforcement powers the ability to take action when a vehicle is parked alongside a dropped kerb in a Special Enforcement Area (that is, an area where parking is, in all other instances, permitted).
The Traffic Management Act 2004, Part 6, 86 gives all local authorities in England with civil parking enforcement powers the ability to take action when a vehicle is parked alongside a dropped kerb in a Special Enforcement Area (that is, an area where parking is, in all other instances, permitted).
Traffic Management Act 2004 said:
86Prohibition of parking at dropped footways etc.
(1)In a special enforcement area a vehicle must not be parked on the carriageway adjacent to a footway, cycle track or verge where
(a)the footway, cycle track or verge has been lowered to meet the level of the carriageway for the purpose of
(i)assisting pedestrians crossing the carriageway,
(ii)assisting cyclists entering or leaving the carriageway, or
(iii)assisting vehicles entering or leaving the carriageway across the footway, cycle track or verge; or
(b)the carriageway has, for a purpose within paragraph (a)(i) to (iii), been raised to meet the level of the footway, cycle track or verge.This is subject to the following exceptions.
(2)The first exception is where the vehicle is parked wholly within a designated parking place or any other part of the carriageway where parking is specifically authorised.A designated parking place means a parking place designated by order under section 6, 9, 32(1)(b) or 45 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (c. 27).
(3)The second exception is where the vehicle is parked outside residential premises by or with the consent (but not consent given for reward) of the occupier of the premises.This exception does not apply in the case of a shared driveway.
(4)The third exception is where the vehicle is being used for fire brigade, ambulance or police purposes.
(5)The fourth exception is where
(a)the vehicle is being used for the purposes of delivering goods to, or collecting goods from, any premises, or is being loaded from or unloaded to any premises,
(b)the delivery, collection, loading or unloading cannot reasonably be carried out in relation to those premises without the vehicle being parked as mentioned in subsection (1), and
(c)the vehicle is so parked for no longer than is necessary and for no more than 20 minutes.
(6)The fifth exception is where
(a)the vehicle is being used in connection with any of the following
(i)undertaking any building operation, demolition or excavation,
(ii)the collection of waste by a local authority,
(iii)removing an obstruction to traffic,
(iv)undertaking works in relation to a road, a traffic sign or road lighting, or
(v)undertaking works in relation to a sewer or water main or in relation to the supply of gas, electricity, water or communications services,
(b)it cannot be so used without being parked as mentioned in subsection (1), and
(c)it is so parked for no longer than is necessary.
(7)In this section carriageway, cycle track and footway have the meanings given by section 329(1) of the Highways Act 1980 (c. 66).
(8)References in this section to parking include waiting, but do not include stopping where
(a)the driver is prevented from proceeding by circumstances beyond his control or it is necessary for him to stop to avoid an accident, or
(b)the vehicle is stopped, for no longer than is necessary, for the purpose of allowing people to board or alight from it.
(9)The prohibition in this section is enforceable as if imposed
(a)in Greater London, by an order under section 6 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (c. 27),
(b)elsewhere in England and Wales, by an order under section 1 of that Act.
Streaky(1)In a special enforcement area a vehicle must not be parked on the carriageway adjacent to a footway, cycle track or verge where
(a)the footway, cycle track or verge has been lowered to meet the level of the carriageway for the purpose of
(i)assisting pedestrians crossing the carriageway,
(ii)assisting cyclists entering or leaving the carriageway, or
(iii)assisting vehicles entering or leaving the carriageway across the footway, cycle track or verge; or
(b)the carriageway has, for a purpose within paragraph (a)(i) to (iii), been raised to meet the level of the footway, cycle track or verge.This is subject to the following exceptions.
(2)The first exception is where the vehicle is parked wholly within a designated parking place or any other part of the carriageway where parking is specifically authorised.A designated parking place means a parking place designated by order under section 6, 9, 32(1)(b) or 45 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (c. 27).
(3)The second exception is where the vehicle is parked outside residential premises by or with the consent (but not consent given for reward) of the occupier of the premises.This exception does not apply in the case of a shared driveway.
(4)The third exception is where the vehicle is being used for fire brigade, ambulance or police purposes.
(5)The fourth exception is where
(a)the vehicle is being used for the purposes of delivering goods to, or collecting goods from, any premises, or is being loaded from or unloaded to any premises,
(b)the delivery, collection, loading or unloading cannot reasonably be carried out in relation to those premises without the vehicle being parked as mentioned in subsection (1), and
(c)the vehicle is so parked for no longer than is necessary and for no more than 20 minutes.
(6)The fifth exception is where
(a)the vehicle is being used in connection with any of the following
(i)undertaking any building operation, demolition or excavation,
(ii)the collection of waste by a local authority,
(iii)removing an obstruction to traffic,
(iv)undertaking works in relation to a road, a traffic sign or road lighting, or
(v)undertaking works in relation to a sewer or water main or in relation to the supply of gas, electricity, water or communications services,
(b)it cannot be so used without being parked as mentioned in subsection (1), and
(c)it is so parked for no longer than is necessary.
(7)In this section carriageway, cycle track and footway have the meanings given by section 329(1) of the Highways Act 1980 (c. 66).
(8)References in this section to parking include waiting, but do not include stopping where
(a)the driver is prevented from proceeding by circumstances beyond his control or it is necessary for him to stop to avoid an accident, or
(b)the vehicle is stopped, for no longer than is necessary, for the purpose of allowing people to board or alight from it.
(9)The prohibition in this section is enforceable as if imposed
(a)in Greater London, by an order under section 6 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (c. 27),
(b)elsewhere in England and Wales, by an order under section 1 of that Act.
Hooli said:
I thought from similar threads on here that's it illegal to block the exit from a drive, but not entry?
That is how I understand it too.I had the same trouble with a house I used to rent a couple of years ago, where a dropped kerb was installed to facilitate entry/exit from an offroad parking space converted from a front gardan. The neighbours ignored my frequent requests, so one morning as I was leaving for work at 5am (I was a trade plate driver), I rang the local station & they sent a car round & the PC's got the guy out of bed to move the car. He didn't do it again
The officers told me that if I was blocked in again they would repeat their responce, but that if I returned later & access was blocked I just had to park elsewhere & wait until I could get in again.
BIANCO said:
What gets me a little is that when people have a lowered kerb outside there house it in some why gives them ownership of the that bit of road. Which in away I dont agree with I dont have a drive or a lowered kerb so I cant go out and demand that no one park outside my house which is fine by me. But when someone does have a lowered kerb they can, do they pay more road tax for this privilege of in away owning the bit of road? No.
I dont have a problem with this on estates that have been specifically designed for driveways and are not set up for parking on the road. But on streets that have had driveways added that were never designed to have them. I sometimes think what gives you the right to think you own that bit of road out side your house.
And the people who think the bit of road across from there drive should also be kept clear are even more cheeky. If you cant get in and out of your drive when only the bit of lower kerb is clear and all the other cars are parked legally then your drive is not feasible and its tuff.
I will add I dont go around parking in front of them because of this view.
As stated above - they DO NOT own the road, and you CAN park there if all you are doing is preventing ACCESS.I dont have a problem with this on estates that have been specifically designed for driveways and are not set up for parking on the road. But on streets that have had driveways added that were never designed to have them. I sometimes think what gives you the right to think you own that bit of road out side your house.
And the people who think the bit of road across from there drive should also be kept clear are even more cheeky. If you cant get in and out of your drive when only the bit of lower kerb is clear and all the other cars are parked legally then your drive is not feasible and its tuff.
I will add I dont go around parking in front of them because of this view.
However, if you are preventing EXIT, they have right to exit unhindered - just as if they had actually parked in the space, with a vehicle that was only as long as their's is wide!
It is therefore more considerate for them to require a vehicle width to exit from, than take up a whole space, no?
BIANCO said:
And the people who think the bit of road across from there drive should also be kept clear are even more cheeky. If you cant get in and out of your drive when only the bit of lower kerb is clear and all the other cars are parked legally then your drive is not feasible and its tuff.
Down the road from us a bloke has put up a sign saying parking opposite his drive is illegal, since it prevents exit (narrow road etc).So is it illegal or not?
daz3210 said:
Down the road from us a bloke has put up a sign saying parking opposite his drive is illegal, since it prevents exit (narrow road etc).
So is it illegal or not?
If by parking opposite his driveway you are preventing him getting access to the highway then yes it is illegal.So is it illegal or not?
I would qualify that by adding that it is highly unlikely that he cannot access the highway...even if it means a little shunting backwards and forwards to do so. If the latter is the case he should be told (politely of course) to 'jog on'. Parking directly in front of his driveway blocking his access to the highway is also illegal.(awaits the usual suspects' hair splitting arguments to follow);)
Bookmarked. We have a someone opposite who does this. We can (just) get out after doing a 100 point turn.
The times I really have thought about just doing a full speed reverse.
What annoys me even more is the fact that there is so much space each side of where they park. Also they park with two wheels up the kerb as well (maybe this is to let me out).
The times I really have thought about just doing a full speed reverse.
What annoys me even more is the fact that there is so much space each side of where they park. Also they park with two wheels up the kerb as well (maybe this is to let me out).
oldsoak said:
If by parking opposite his driveway you are preventing him getting access to the highway then yes it is illegal.
I would qualify that by adding that it is highly unlikely that he cannot access the highway...even if it means a little shunting backwards and forwards to do so. If the latter is the case he should be told (politely of course) to 'jog on'. Parking directly in front of his driveway blocking his access to the highway is also illegal.(awaits the usual suspects' hair splitting arguments to follow);)
What contitutes access to the highway though? By parking opposite access to the highway is possible, but actually turning to drive along the road is at best very difficult. Does access have to be gained with a degree of ease?I would qualify that by adding that it is highly unlikely that he cannot access the highway...even if it means a little shunting backwards and forwards to do so. If the latter is the case he should be told (politely of course) to 'jog on'. Parking directly in front of his driveway blocking his access to the highway is also illegal.(awaits the usual suspects' hair splitting arguments to follow);)
daz3210 said:
What constitutes access to the highway though? By parking opposite access to the highway is possible, but actually turning to drive along the road is at best very difficult. Does access have to be gained with a degree of ease?
Here read all about it and make up your own mindThe statutory offence of obstruction has been qualified by case law as 'unreasonable obstruction'. What is unreasonable is a matter of fact but the courts appear not to set the threshold very low.
I cannot imagine a manslaughter charge being brought against someone who blocked access to the highway unless the driver knew that the person trying to gain access needed to do so for life-saving reasons.
I cannot imagine a manslaughter charge being brought against someone who blocked access to the highway unless the driver knew that the person trying to gain access needed to do so for life-saving reasons.
oldsoak said:
daz3210 said:
Down the road from us a bloke has put up a sign saying parking opposite his drive is illegal, since it prevents exit (narrow road etc).
So is it illegal or not?
If by parking opposite his driveway you are preventing him getting access to the highway then yes it is illegal.So is it illegal or not?
I would qualify that by adding that it is highly unlikely that he cannot access the highway...even if it means a little shunting backwards and forwards to do so. If the latter is the case he should be told (politely of course) to 'jog on'. Parking directly in front of his driveway blocking his access to the highway is also illegal.(awaits the usual suspects' hair splitting arguments to follow);)
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