RE: PH Blog: why base-spec 911s rule

RE: PH Blog: why base-spec 911s rule

Tuesday 27th March 2012

PH Blog: why base-spec 911s rule

Garlick took the 911 C4 GTS out and, hand on heart, would rather a Carrera 2 - here's why



Less is more. No really, it is.

I can vividly remember my first 911 experience. It was a 1989 Grand Prix White 964 Carrera 2 with a blue leather interior and my drive of it took place in the summer of 1994. I was trying to sell it at the time, and was on my way to show a potential buyer. He didn't buy it, but was a fool for not doing so as it was that drive that cemented my love of the 911 and at the time I wondered why you would need anything more from a car.

The fewer letters and numbers the better
The fewer letters and numbers the better
Since then I have been lucky enough to drive all manner of 911s, Boxsters and Caymans. I've even owned my own Boxster S, and I still can't shake the opinion that the lesser the spec, the better the Porsche. My most memorable drive in a Cayman was in a flat red 2.7 with a five-speed manual and 17-inch wheels. It was purity defined and offered a drive that bettered many cars costing twice as much, including the Cayman R (in my opinion).

The same is true of the 911. Never have I enjoyed a drive as much as I did when behind the wheel of a 2WD Carrera S. It has power, poise, great balance and everyday usability that is unmatched. This weekend I used the Carrera 4 GTS Dan took to Germany last week which is an utterly superb car, but is it £10K better than a standard S? I'm not so sure that it is.

I'm not knocking anyone who buys a GTS, Turbo, GT3, GT3 RS or GT2. In fact I applaud your commitment to the 911 cause, but with each wheel size increase, power upgrade or suspension change the purity of the base car is less easy to exploit.

If you can drive a car hard then a GT2/3/Turbo is hard to beat, but for 90 per cent of us mere mortals a base car does all you need more often than not and that's why Harris has a 4.0 and I'd be happy with a 2 S. It's not often you can say that about any car regardless of price. Long live the base model!

Garlick

Author
Discussion

IMI A

Original Poster:

9,410 posts

200 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
Completely agree with you Garlick. Having owned a 911 turbo for the last 5 years (whilst I love it) if I had to do it all again I would definitely just buy a base spec Carrera with zero options. In fact without the kiddies it would probably be a Boxster truth be told as I found them much more fun to drive on a twisty B road with roof off on a baking hot day.

Speed and grip gets boring after a while.

k-ink

9,070 posts

178 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
IMI A said:
Speed and grip gets boring after a while.
Coming from a way lower rung on the automotive ladder I have to agree. I found my Prodrive subaru boring after a while. Loads of grip and speed does not equate to fun in the long term. Yes it is fast, but it is also very predictable.

Which is why my dream car would be a Zonda rather than a Veyron.

Dave Hedgehog

14,541 posts

203 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
k-ink said:
IMI A said:
Speed and grip gets boring after a while.
Coming from a way lower rung on the automotive ladder I have to agree. I found my Prodrive subaru boring after a while. Loads of grip and speed does not equate to fun in the long term. Yes it is fast, but it is also very predictable.

Which is why my dream car would be a Zonda rather than a Veyron.
yep because zonda's are renowned for a lack of grip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APbrjvadVA0

wink

time seams to be repeating itself, new 911 comes out, jurno's rate the base model over all but the GT and RS models

Output Flange

16,793 posts

210 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
article said:
If you can drive a car hard then a GT2/3/Turbo is hard to beat, but for 90 per cent of us mere mortals a base car does all you need more often than not
I don't think it's even that - finding the opportunity to take advantage of the ridiculously high limits of the GTx/4WD models is pretty bloody hard these days, unless you're on a racetrack. Which 99.995% of the time, I'm not.

Think of the Harris Merc video on spacesavers - lower the limit, increase the fun.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
Not wishing to be a pedant but the BASE model is the Carrera, not the "S"


lyricalgangster

237 posts

144 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
[quote=k-ink]


[Loads of grip and speed does not equate to fun in the long term. Yes it is fast, but it is also very predictable.]


i have to agree with this - which is why i'm selling my mountuned Focus RS, and buying a 350z - the focus is rapid, no denying that, but i find myself going too fast in a straight line in order to get any fun from it.

I'm hoping that in a rear wheel drive car, i can have more 'fun' at slower, less licence risking, speeds...

Garlick

40,601 posts

239 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
garyhun said:
Not wishing to be a pedant but the BASE model is the Carrera, not the "S"
That's true enough. Oddly, I'd have Boxster base, Cayman base but I'd like my 911 to have an additional S. Fair point though.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
Garlick said:
garyhun said:
Not wishing to be a pedant but the BASE model is the Carrera, not the "S"
That's true enough. Oddly, I'd have Boxster base, Cayman base but I'd like my 911 to have an additional S. Fair point though.
I probably would too! The 991 S is a superb piece of kit...have not tried the Carrera though.

toppstuff

13,698 posts

246 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
k-ink said:
Coming from a way lower rung on the automotive ladder I have to agree. I found my Prodrive subaru boring after a while. Loads of grip and speed does not equate to fun in the long term. Yes it is fast, but it is also very predictable.

Which is why my dream car would be a Zonda rather than a Veyron.
+ another. Completely agree. Speed ( at least, excessive amounts of easy speed that is ) and grip does get boring.

A regular dose of classic cars solves this. Plenty of speed+ less grip + more noise = more fun.


MrTickle

1,825 posts

238 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
Garlick said:
garyhun said:
Not wishing to be a pedant but the BASE model is the Carrera, not the "S"
That's true enough. Oddly, I'd have Boxster base, Cayman base but I'd like my 911 to have an additional S. Fair point though.
Interesting, as I have owned a few base carrera's and agree the simplicity of the 2WD N/A engine and manual box is hard to beat. But having owned the C2GTS now, that just ticks every box I can think of smile

cliffie

172 posts

217 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
I have never driven a 911 of any spec, nor a Boxster, nor a Cayman. I need to get out more.

Anyone out there fancy lending me their keys?

dapearson

4,252 posts

223 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
For a moment there i thought he was going to mention "evoness".

Shudder.

98C4S

2,934 posts

189 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
What about the 2WD GTS?

that cant be bad - its a standard 2S with about 30 more BHP - still 2WD though

Captain Muppet

8,540 posts

264 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
IMI A said:
...I would definitely just buy a base spec Carrera with zero options.
Can you buy one with zero options? Last time I looked seats and a windscreen were both cost options, but that was a few years ago.

k-ink

9,070 posts

178 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
Dave Hedgehog said:
yep because zonda's are renowned for a lack of grip
Of course it is fast in the right hands. Especially the race version. However it still has less grip than a car with twice the number of driven wheels. In mortal hands a zonda will prove more of a handful and so be more entertaining. Hammond certainly found this to be so on occasion.

Captain Muppet

8,540 posts

264 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
cliffie said:
I have never driven a 911 of any spec, nor a Boxster, nor a Cayman. I need to get out more.

Anyone out there fancy lending me their keys?
Take your VX220 down to a dealer and act like a customer.

Or find a nice friendly chap with a Porsche who wants to swap cars for a weekend, like I did in my £12k cultural exchange thread - I swapped my sport 160 Elise for a 911, and really enjoyed the Porsche.

Garlick

40,601 posts

239 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
98C4S said:
What about the 2WD GTS?

that cant be bad - its a standard 2S with about 30 more BHP - still 2WD though
See, for me the 2S is enough. It won't be for everyone, but for me it's perfect.

You could say, what about a 2S with another 30/40/50hp or with a closer box or tricker suspension too, but for me S = perfection.

I'm sure the 2 GTS is great (really great), every 911 I have driven is, but I'd save the cash and would be very happy with my 2S.

Turbo Harry

5,187 posts

236 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
I'd long subscribed to this 'less is more' thing with 911s until the Cayman arrived. A subjective opinion maybe, but for me the base 911 Carrera then became virtually redundant. The next logical step from Cayman S seemed to be 911 GT-something.

Irish

3,991 posts

238 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
I much preferred my 2.7 Boxster to my C4 911 - it was dynamically a better car and more fun in the twisties.

snorkel sucker

2,662 posts

202 months

Tuesday 27th March 2012
quotequote all
Out of interest then, what exactly about the Carrera 2 that makes it more pure than the '4?

Presumably - and I have never driven a 911 to find out - both cars would have similarly meaty tyres, or does the Carrera 2 forfeit a couple of inches laterally and vertically?

Unless you get into an older 911, all newer versions are going to be "over-tyred", right?

I am assuming here that it is predominantly the tyres / wheels that are making the difference, or does the 4WD system also corrupt the cars purity?