Insurance & SORN
Discussion
I'm going to be out of the country for a couple of months
and whilst I'm away the insurance on one of my cars will run out....
I plan on leaving the car behind locked gates, and removing the battery....I will then re insure the car on my return....
The car is taxed until Dec...
Do I need to declare SORN on the uninsured car??
If so what happens with the tax disc?? If I don't send it off for a refund, will it still be valid when I remove the car from SORN, and re insure it on my return...
I suppose basically I'm asking, once a car is declared SORN, does a new tax disc have to be issued, even though there is a valid one on the car..??
and whilst I'm away the insurance on one of my cars will run out....I plan on leaving the car behind locked gates, and removing the battery....I will then re insure the car on my return....
The car is taxed until Dec...
Do I need to declare SORN on the uninsured car??
If so what happens with the tax disc?? If I don't send it off for a refund, will it still be valid when I remove the car from SORN, and re insure it on my return...
I suppose basically I'm asking, once a car is declared SORN, does a new tax disc have to be issued, even though there is a valid one on the car..??
Lunablack said:
I'm going to be out of the country for a couple of months and whilst I'm away the insurance on one of my cars will run out....
I plan on leaving the car behind locked gates, and removing the battery....I will then re insure the car on my return....
The car is taxed until Dec...
Do I need to declare SORN on the uninsured car??
Yes - there is now an offence of having a taxed but uninsured vehicle. and whilst I'm away the insurance on one of my cars will run out....I plan on leaving the car behind locked gates, and removing the battery....I will then re insure the car on my return....
The car is taxed until Dec...
Do I need to declare SORN on the uninsured car??
Lunablack said:
If so what happens with the tax disc?? If I don't send it off for a refund, will it still be valid when I remove the car from SORN, and re insure it on my return...
I suppose basically I'm asking, once a car is declared SORN, does a new tax disc have to be issued, even though there is a valid one on the car..??
Can open. Worms everywhere.I suppose basically I'm asking, once a car is declared SORN, does a new tax disc have to be issued, even though there is a valid one on the car..??
The DVLA's interpretation and implementation is such that they expect you to return the disc for a refund and apply for a new one when you want to put the car back on the road. Holding on to the disc confuses them as their system can't cope with something being both taxed & subject to SORN simultaneously.
Someone will be along in a few minutes to explain why their interpretation is wrong, and someone else will argue with them.
Edited by marshalla on Sunday 24th June 18:06
specialboy said:
Why have you got a problem with returning the tax? you will get a refund if one is due and when you return and obtain insurance you can retax it. Honestly cant see what the problem is.
Because its a pain in the arse.... I'm leaving on Tuesday, and need to use the car up until the point I leave....I'm due back on the 15th Aug, and will have to re tax and lose half a month anyway... It would be far simpler to just leve it taxed, let the insurance run out on the 16th July, and then just re insure on the day I get back
Lunablack said:
Because its a pain in the arse.... I'm leaving on Tuesday, and need to use the car up until the point I leave....
I'm due back on the 15th Aug, and will have to re tax and lose half a month anyway... It would be far simpler to just leve it taxed, let the insurance run out on the 16th July, and then just re insure on the day I get back
Why not just insure it - just in case of accidents ?I'm due back on the 15th Aug, and will have to re tax and lose half a month anyway... It would be far simpler to just leve it taxed, let the insurance run out on the 16th July, and then just re insure on the day I get back
Lunablack said:
It would be far simpler to just leve it taxed, let the insurance run out on the 16th July, and then just re insure on the day I get back
yes it would. But unfortunately to do that you will need to keep the insurance in force for the whole time the tax disc is in force. marshalla said:
Why not just insure it - just in case of accidents ?
Car is worth bugger all, and will be quite safe behind locked gates with no battery on.....I'd much rather just let the insurance lapse.... Then search for a new policy on my return....
I don't want to pay for a policy now, as I could do with the cash for use on my trip
I just want to leave my taxed, but uninsured car, on my own property for 3 or 4 weeks...... But it appears I'm not allowed to, without paperwork
Edited by Lunablack on Sunday 24th June 23:22
Lunablack said:
I just want to leave my taxed, but uninsured car, on my own property for 3 or 4 weeks...... But it appears I'm not allowed to, without paperwork
Edited by Lunablack on Sunday 24th June 23:22
... Think of it as poor, ill-thought-out legislation aimed at catching uninsured drivers by blunt electronic means, and then the law of unintended consequences coming in to play as the majority of motorists who actually play by the rules can trip up on it (because the situation you describe - one which might just possibly affect many of yer actual honest registered keepers who play by the rules) - was never apparently predicted) 
.It is a money-raiser though, at £100 a time (but no points) if you let the insurance lapse and don't declare SORN
. Whether the uninsured drivers actually have their name on the V5C (and therefore can fall into the trap you're in) is one problem with this enforcement-by-database approach - but that's a chat for another time...
aw51 121565 said:
Whether the uninsured drivers actually have their name on the V5C (and therefore can fall into the trap you're in) is one problem with this enforcement-by-database approach - but that's a chat for another time...
Actually... That's a very good point....... Although I'm the registered keeper, my wife is the policy holder, and I'm the named driver...Car is used pretty much 60/40 with her being the main user....
We did it this way because we sold her car, and she would have lost her NCB, and I already had full NCB on 2 other vehicles..
So I suppose the question is, if SHE lets HER insurance lapse for a few weeks..... Am I as the registered owner liable for a fine??
I suspect I already know the answer
...Much as I'm loath to, I suppose I'll just renew the policy tomorrow before I leave....which means I have to spend money id rather not, and i don't get much of a chance to shop around for a decent quote
Deva Link said:
Yep. It would appear that SORNing the car cancels the tax, but you don't get a refund unless you return the disc.
The problem seems to be that the only way to unSORN a car is to tax it.
Well cancelling or invalidating the tax seesm to be a DVLA concept that gets by the badly drafted law. But you still have the tax disk, in date, when you insure the car again that proves you have paid the tax. With insurance and tax disk you are driving the car legally.The problem seems to be that the only way to unSORN a car is to tax it.
Richard C said:
Well cancelling or invalidating the tax seesm to be a DVLA concept that gets by the badly drafted law. But you still have the tax disk, in date, when you insure the car again that proves you have paid the tax. With insurance and tax disk you are driving the car legally.
Yes.....But I suspect I won't be able to de SORN it without having to buy a new disc...
Lunablack said:
But I suspect I won't be able to de SORN it without having to buy a new disc...
May be worth noting that the only prescribed circumstances under which a SORN is required to be made are 1) when a licence is not renewed, 2) when a licence is surrendered, and 3) when a person keeps an unlicensed vehicle.So, if an unsurrendered (and unexpired) vehicle licence was considered (by DVLA) to remain active after a SORN declaration had been made, then perhaps there would be a question over the validity of the original SORN declaration itself ?
SS2. said:
May be worth noting that the only prescribed circumstances under which a SORN is required to be made are 1) when a licence is not renewed, 2) when a licence is surrendered, and 3) when a person keeps an unlicensed vehicle.
So, if an unsurrendered (and unexpired) vehicle licence was considered (by DVLA) to remain active after a SORN declaration had been made, then perhaps there would be a question over the validity of the original SORN declaration itself ?
Load of rubbish, SORN also needs to be made when the vehicle is uninsured and when doing so the tax has to be returned to the DVLA. Keeping the disc will not mean its still valid it will just mean you miss out on a refund. To unsorn a vehicle you need to re-tax it.So, if an unsurrendered (and unexpired) vehicle licence was considered (by DVLA) to remain active after a SORN declaration had been made, then perhaps there would be a question over the validity of the original SORN declaration itself ?
If you are planning to park the vehicle up with battery removed ( or just remove rotor arm ? ) , why not post off SORN declaration along with tax disc for refund before you leave .
Car will be on private property with SORN declared , insurance will run out at end of month . You can reinsure and re tax on return - job done .
MOT isn't also due around the same time ( many are ) ?
Car will be on private property with SORN declared , insurance will run out at end of month . You can reinsure and re tax on return - job done .
MOT isn't also due around the same time ( many are ) ?
Edited by Pontoneer on Tuesday 26th June 07:43
specialboy said:
Keeping the disc will not mean its still valid it will just mean you miss out on a refund..
My post was not in disagreement, it was merely pointing out the [hypothetical] alternative to the notion that a non-surrendered excise disc actually remained valid.What is clear is that the legislation is poorly thought out or poorly written (or both). Either way, tagging on continuous insurance requirements hasn't served to make it any less confusing for vehicle owners.
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