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mrdemon
Original Poster
3,017 posts
134 months
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The new Cayman and Boxster are held back being slower than the out going Spyder and Cayman R models with less BHp A reason I would NOT upgrade to a new one which is a shame (lauch boxster S should have been 350BHP imo). But now Jag have their baby in 3 models min spec is already 335BHp with a 375BHP and >400BHp models available. I have no interest in the biger heavy weight 5.0-litre V8 but the 375BHp must hit a nice sweet spot and being a 3.0-litre supercharged V6 will offer great torque and a nice turn of speed. I guess full details with be at the Paris show next week, but it looks stonking :-) Added to this the coupe will have the same engines, which will make the new 2013 Cayman seem lacking in Bhp if the rumor of only 330BHP is true 
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Gibbo205
1,414 posts
76 months
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Jag looks nice but how heavy? Plus I doubt it will feel nowhere as good to drive as mid-engine Porsche offerings and that both the Boxster and cayman with there 330BHP will still be quicker on a back road or track. 
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mrdemon
Original Poster
3,017 posts
134 months
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Torque wins races :-) and back B road blasts :-)
I am sure Jag have a winner on their hands
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Terminator X
2,116 posts
73 months
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Wow that Jag looks gawjus  TX.
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nickfrog
2,141 posts
86 months
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Yes 320ps in a lightish mid-engine low COG car is shockingly low. I am not sure the wheels will actually turn at all.
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mrdemon
Original Poster
3,017 posts
134 months
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It,s not low, but it is less than the outgoing models, which current owners own, so not much to upgrade too.
A 375bhp V6 S/C 2 seater Jag is though.
The new Boxster and 2013 Bhp levels just seem low, when before Porsche have been king adding 20 to 30bhp here and there.
And we all know its because of the 345bhp 911.
Porsche will loose sales because of the Jag, that no doubt, the question is, will they loose enough to worry about, and I guess that might be no.....
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cmoose
18,578 posts
98 months
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Totally baffling that someone would judge such cars on arbitrary numbers or comparisons with previous models - particularly low volume specials!
Try the car, if you like it, great, if not fine. What possible difference does it make to the driving experience whether another car has 10hp more or 10hp less?
The latest Boxster S has a far better power to weight ratio than, say, an E30 M3. Better than things like a 964 RS, I would guess. Get over it!
Personally, I'd happily swap 50 of the 981's ponies for hydraulic steering and a cable throttle. There's so much more to a great drive than just the power numbers.
Anyway, I'm off to set fire to my 2.7RS. Pitiful 210hp. What were they thinking?
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nickfrog
2,141 posts
86 months
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Thing is, it's a road car. If you use all the traction and lateral grip, it's not power you'll be craving for, it's bigger brakes. And a solicitor.
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cmoose
18,578 posts
98 months
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Also worth bearing in mind that it's the first time the Box has gotten lighter regards like for like models (eg the new S is lighter than the old S).
I would guess the F-type will be at least 150kg heavier than a Box S. And it will only come with a torque converter box. If it's even nearly as good as the Box, Jag will have done a spectacular job.
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rdjohn
869 posts
64 months
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cmoose said: Totally baffling that someone would judge such cars on arbitrary numbers.
The latest Boxster S has a far better power to weight ratio than, say, an E30 M3.
Personally, I'd happily swap 50 of the 981's ponies for hydraulic steering and a cable throttle. There's so much more to a great drive than just the power numbers.
I agree, weight is the single thing that kills all modern cars and makes inferior-engined Elices superior in many respects. The thing is, bragging-rights are much more easily expressed in bhp/tonne & 0-60 times etc. You only needs to see base Porsche and BMWs on trackdays to see how they are hobbled by their weight.
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cmoose
18,578 posts
98 months
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To be fair, I think Porsche has done a fantastic job keeping the weight of its main sports cars under control.
The DIN weights of the 964 C2 and 991 C2 are 1,350kg and 1,380kg. Pretty bloody incredible if you ask me. An Aston Martin V8 Vantage probably weighs over 200kg more than a 991.
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mrmr96
11,940 posts
73 months
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mrdemon said: Torque wins races :-) Does it f  k!
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cmoose
18,578 posts
98 months
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Indeed. Try inverting an F1 car's torque and power figures and see how you get on with 800lb/ft and 300hp or whatever the numbers would be. Not very well, anyway!
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Actus Reus
1,446 posts
24 months
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Borrowing Cambridge OPC's 981S this weekend and it is epic. Photos and thoughts to follow (it's lime gold and I love it).
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craigjm
2,234 posts
69 months
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I fear Jaguar will shoot themselves in the foot with this car and all it will do initially is steal sales from their own XK which must be going upmarket for its next iteration. Personally I dont think many 911 owners would consider it as its only a two seater and against the Cayman/Boxster it is going to be less practical storage wise due to its layout. Im sure it will sell but I sure hope the quality has improved since the XF that I had which was absolutely shocking. I will be looking to upgrade my Cayman S next year, not sure I would consider the Jag for the fact that I like the character of the flat mid engine over a traditional layout.
Power figures are purely for schoolkids with top trumps cards or grown ups that are frankly worried about the size of their genitals
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mrdemon
Original Poster
3,017 posts
134 months
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Lol regarding your power figure thoughts.
I could just not swap the Spyder for a slower car, est one which is not as good to drive.
If anything I am looking at a Cayman R as a daily, not any of Porsche new offerings. I think the F-type will make a great daily with a V6 super charged lump.
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Gibbo205
1,414 posts
76 months
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mrdemon said: Lol regarding your power figure thoughts.
I could just not swap the Spyder for a slower car, est one which is not as good to drive.
If anything I am looking at a Cayman R as a daily, not any of Porsche new offerings. I think the F-type will make a great daily with a V6 super charged lump. Why buy a Cayman R when you have a Spyder? Bar from the roof they both drive very similar, though in my view the Spyder is a marginally better drive.  If you want power buy a 997 S or Turbo for your daily drive, both quicker than your Spyder in straight lines, one considerably more so than the other.  For me next step is a 997.2 GT3, because I love trackdays as such the next step from the Carrera S will be a 997 GT3 and gen2 will be a more noticable upgrade. 
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