New LT1 engine
Discussion
Wonder if the new LT1 engine will be a new option in an Ultima? The performance figures look and seem interesting:
http://wot.motortrend.com/next-gen-lt1-62-liter-v8...
Will the intake be reversible to allow placement of the engine in a central location and the electronics not too complicated so it can be usable by other than rocket scientists?
Some more info: http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&drK...
http://wot.motortrend.com/next-gen-lt1-62-liter-v8...
Will the intake be reversible to allow placement of the engine in a central location and the electronics not too complicated so it can be usable by other than rocket scientists?
Some more info: http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&drK...
Edited by UltimaCH on Friday 26th October 17:49
Dom the engine you are thinking of is the LT 5 that was in the late 80"s ZR1 corvette. I for one would think that this will be the Ultima engine of choice with one caveat, either Chevy will need to produce a after market package to include an ECU to manage all that techy good stuff or someone will need to do the work with a Motec or similar aftermarket ECU to control the motor or you will need to forego the cam timing and cylinder deactivation. I would assume that the current or similar adapters offered by the factory for the LS motors should be a simple issue. Watch that comment come back to bite me in the tail.Lee
Chevy are very lets say Conservative with there power figures, normaly put there std engine on any dyno and they tend to make a good 5-8% more power. Yes Headers do make a difference (Most Dyno guys use some form of header on the dyno) but LS7's do tend to make a Good 540bhp Stock. So I'm guessing a quoted 450bhp LT1 (New LT1 that is) with a normal stile Ult exhaust would be closer to say 470-480bhp....
Giving a normal 2 year wait after the Vette is launched before they release the Crate motors, we'll see how much this one costs in late 2015...
Giving a normal 2 year wait after the Vette is launched before they release the Crate motors, we'll see how much this one costs in late 2015...
I saw the new Corvette announcement and was glad it was retaining the V8, as it means they've been able to keep it clean enough to meet ever tightening emissions regs, therefore, giving us all hope for a few more yrs of V8 power!
The tech is interesting with VVT giving plenty of tuning options (once folks get on top of the electronics) and the direct injection should help with emissions, I guess.
Cyl de-activation systems I've seen so far only seem to work under light load situations (e.g top gear m-way cruising speeds), I wonder if this one could be made to work at idle / in neutral, therefore, further helping IVA-type tests? I guess folks like Daniel in CH will be very interested in such tech
Definitely good news for us and I look forwards to hearing about the first Ultima install.
The tech is interesting with VVT giving plenty of tuning options (once folks get on top of the electronics) and the direct injection should help with emissions, I guess.
Cyl de-activation systems I've seen so far only seem to work under light load situations (e.g top gear m-way cruising speeds), I wonder if this one could be made to work at idle / in neutral, therefore, further helping IVA-type tests? I guess folks like Daniel in CH will be very interested in such tech
Definitely good news for us and I look forwards to hearing about the first Ultima install.
356Speedster said:
I saw the new Corvette announcement and was glad it was retaining the V8, as it means they've been able to keep it clean enough to meet ever tightening emissions regs, therefore, giving us all hope for a few more yrs of V8 power!
The tech is interesting with VVT giving plenty of tuning options (once folks get on top of the electronics) and the direct injection should help with emissions, I guess.
Cyl de-activation systems I've seen so far only seem to work under light load situations (e.g top gear m-way cruising speeds), I wonder if this one could be made to work at idle / in neutral, therefore, further helping IVA-type tests? I guess folks like Daniel in CH will be very interested in such tech
Definitely good news for us and I look forwards to hearing about the first Ultima install.
Mark,The tech is interesting with VVT giving plenty of tuning options (once folks get on top of the electronics) and the direct injection should help with emissions, I guess.
Cyl de-activation systems I've seen so far only seem to work under light load situations (e.g top gear m-way cruising speeds), I wonder if this one could be made to work at idle / in neutral, therefore, further helping IVA-type tests? I guess folks like Daniel in CH will be very interested in such tech
Definitely good news for us and I look forwards to hearing about the first Ultima install.
You hit it right on the nail. Yes I am VERY interested to see what this engine will be like emission wise and very importantly CO2 levels so as to avoid (better to say reduce...) the hefty penalty tax I have to pay with a LS type engine
dom9 said:
Interesting that they have called it LT1.
Wasn't the last LT1 the 4v per cylinder V8 SBC that Lotus designed for 'em?
The last time LT1 designation was used was in the last iteration of the smallblock chevy just before the LS1 came out (1996-97ish). That LT1 took it's name from the famous 370hp LT1 350 smallblock that was optional in the corvette of 1970 Wasn't the last LT1 the 4v per cylinder V8 SBC that Lotus designed for 'em?
Using the new engine will no doubt be made easier by GM themselves offering ECUs to run the engine as they do now and no doubt in time the aftermarket will also step in. The most interesting option might be if GM offers another "E-rod" package like they do for the current LS3 engine that allows it to be dropped into anything and meet all the very stringent emission laws in the US. Swapping a used new LT1 with ecu from a wrecked vehicle would be very difficult or impossible due to can-bus issues etc. A GM package will likely be the easiest way to go when this motor does finally hit the streets.
It's disappointing to see that Chevrolet is persevering with an otherwise state-of-the-art car that has an engine that, though using many modern components, is fundamentally a carryover from a 1950's design. Two valves per cylinder with pushrods running them makes for a knuckle-dragging throwback that serves to bring a smile to grey-haired baby boomers who loved the Gen1 and Gen2 (and beyond) cars and claim that pushrods make a Corvette America's sports car.
The change in personality that the car and it's driver would feel with less moving mass, quicker revving behavior, a shift in maximum RPM's and all of the good stuff that comes with a more modern architecture would truly put Porsche's, Ferrari's and others directly in it's sights. But no, the same people who wouldn't give up moving headlights (but did and did so quietly) are still holding back one of the core values of the car. If Chevy's world-class designers were allowed to build the best of the best, it would be awesome.
But too bad.
I try out every new Corvette when they debut hoping that it will be the car I take home, and reject the Porsche or (future) Mclaren or Ferrari that I own today.
But not this time either.
V
The change in personality that the car and it's driver would feel with less moving mass, quicker revving behavior, a shift in maximum RPM's and all of the good stuff that comes with a more modern architecture would truly put Porsche's, Ferrari's and others directly in it's sights. But no, the same people who wouldn't give up moving headlights (but did and did so quietly) are still holding back one of the core values of the car. If Chevy's world-class designers were allowed to build the best of the best, it would be awesome.
But too bad.
I try out every new Corvette when they debut hoping that it will be the car I take home, and reject the Porsche or (future) Mclaren or Ferrari that I own today.
But not this time either.
V
Verde said:
It's disappointing to see that Chevrolet is persevering with an otherwise state-of-the-art car that has an engine that, though using many modern components, is fundamentally a carryover from a 1950's design. Two valves per cylinder with pushrods running them makes for a knuckle-dragging throwback that serves to bring a smile to grey-haired baby boomers who loved the Gen1 and Gen2 (and beyond) cars and claim that pushrods make a Corvette America's sports car.
The change in personality that the car and it's driver would feel with less moving mass, quicker revving behavior, a shift in maximum RPM's and all of the good stuff that comes with a more modern architecture would truly put Porsche's, Ferrari's and others directly in it's sights. But no, the same people who wouldn't give up moving headlights (but did and did so quietly) are still holding back one of the core values of the car. If Chevy's world-class designers were allowed to build the best of the best, it would be awesome.
But too bad.
I try out every new Corvette when they debut hoping that it will be the car I take home, and reject the Porsche or (future) Mclaren or Ferrari that I own today.
But not this time either.
V
Ford's new Coyote (32V) V8 has been well received... I hope Chevy start to move that way at some point. I agree with the above, sadly The change in personality that the car and it's driver would feel with less moving mass, quicker revving behavior, a shift in maximum RPM's and all of the good stuff that comes with a more modern architecture would truly put Porsche's, Ferrari's and others directly in it's sights. But no, the same people who wouldn't give up moving headlights (but did and did so quietly) are still holding back one of the core values of the car. If Chevy's world-class designers were allowed to build the best of the best, it would be awesome.
But too bad.
I try out every new Corvette when they debut hoping that it will be the car I take home, and reject the Porsche or (future) Mclaren or Ferrari that I own today.
But not this time either.
V
34 valves would be an innovation!
Seriously though I too was hoping to see more of the technology from the LFX V6 carried over to the new V8. It's a double edged sword though, on the one hand I would like to see more new tech in the next gen V8, on the other hand it's great to see how far they are able to take the two valve/pushrod engine. Cost is of course an issue of course in these times. It has to be said though that the LS series is a remarkable success story, old tech or not. The power/size/weight/drivability/economy of the package impressive and brings a level of performance to the masses that might otherwise not be affordable.
Seriously though I too was hoping to see more of the technology from the LFX V6 carried over to the new V8. It's a double edged sword though, on the one hand I would like to see more new tech in the next gen V8, on the other hand it's great to see how far they are able to take the two valve/pushrod engine. Cost is of course an issue of course in these times. It has to be said though that the LS series is a remarkable success story, old tech or not. The power/size/weight/drivability/economy of the package impressive and brings a level of performance to the masses that might otherwise not be affordable.
I think the main reason we mainly opt for the GM product is Hp/£.
I am sure GM could produce an engine of similar complexity as the best of European/Japanese engine builders. It would, however, cost far more than the current "old tech" engine. More parts/complexity = more expensive to build (obvious I know). Also, to make these "modern" engines work and meet all the emissions etc they use complex electronics.
If you want a "modern" engine try a Lamborghini, Ferrari, Porsche, Nissan, Jaguar, etc - great engines in their own cars, but I bet you would spend more than the engine costs (new) sorting the electronics.
To build a good spec Ultima costs north of £75K even with a "cheap" LS7. A complex engine/electronics would quickly take that north of £100K, a lot for a "hobby" car IMO.
Paul
I am sure GM could produce an engine of similar complexity as the best of European/Japanese engine builders. It would, however, cost far more than the current "old tech" engine. More parts/complexity = more expensive to build (obvious I know). Also, to make these "modern" engines work and meet all the emissions etc they use complex electronics.
If you want a "modern" engine try a Lamborghini, Ferrari, Porsche, Nissan, Jaguar, etc - great engines in their own cars, but I bet you would spend more than the engine costs (new) sorting the electronics.
To build a good spec Ultima costs north of £75K even with a "cheap" LS7. A complex engine/electronics would quickly take that north of £100K, a lot for a "hobby" car IMO.
Paul
Understood, but in these days, the differential cost between DOHC and OHV is negligible. Same for weight. Inexpensive little economy cars use this design almost uniformly and cost is the driving factor. And though it is remarkable to see what Chevrolet has done with the technology, think what those same efforts would yield in a large-displacement DOHC, continuously variable valve timing V8 with Ti connecting rods, et al. And build another with less displacement and a supercharger (albeit at a higher price) to yield improved weight and balance in the car.
It is so disappointing to think of this lost opportunity for some historic design carryover purpose. I have one of these (LS7) in my Ultima and though I'm very impressed with the low-end torque, would I prefer more top-end power, the sound and feel of a more up-to-date valve-train, and a higher max RPM? Oh, in a second. 550 HP at 8500 RPM in a Corvette with a dual-clutch computer manual or a 7-speed manual? All wrapped in the modern beautiful Corvette bodywork and excellent handling of Chevy's latest designs? And with comfortable and supportive seats no less?
I would thumb my nose at Stuttgart, sell my 997S, erase a GT3RS from my wishlist and leave a deposit at my Chevrolet dealer.
Chevy, are you listening?
V
It is so disappointing to think of this lost opportunity for some historic design carryover purpose. I have one of these (LS7) in my Ultima and though I'm very impressed with the low-end torque, would I prefer more top-end power, the sound and feel of a more up-to-date valve-train, and a higher max RPM? Oh, in a second. 550 HP at 8500 RPM in a Corvette with a dual-clutch computer manual or a 7-speed manual? All wrapped in the modern beautiful Corvette bodywork and excellent handling of Chevy's latest designs? And with comfortable and supportive seats no less?
I would thumb my nose at Stuttgart, sell my 997S, erase a GT3RS from my wishlist and leave a deposit at my Chevrolet dealer.
Chevy, are you listening?
V
Dont forget the LT engine will not just be used in the corvette, but across much of the GM range. The LS series has been truley briliant at this, and better than any other engine i can think of. Its used in everything from bogo trucks to the fastest Corvette avalaible and in massive numbers. Its an increadably flexable platform.
I'm with Paul on this one.... There is something endearing about the GM LS motors and the new LT1. I like the mix of old & new skool engineering, it's refreshing to see GM doing something out of the norm. Reminds me of how long Mazda stuck with the rotary despite it's short comings.
I think I have this view because the engines have character and their power deliver completely suits my needs and the the Ultima in general. I don't want a high RPM screamer (I had that in the Atom). The fact that GM have managed to retain this character, but meet the necessary legislations gets my thumbs up.
For other more mainstream installations, perhaps something with DOHC would be preferable, but I suspect most people who have these engines in their cars / trucks don't know or care about the difference anyhow.
I think I have this view because the engines have character and their power deliver completely suits my needs and the the Ultima in general. I don't want a high RPM screamer (I had that in the Atom). The fact that GM have managed to retain this character, but meet the necessary legislations gets my thumbs up.
For other more mainstream installations, perhaps something with DOHC would be preferable, but I suspect most people who have these engines in their cars / trucks don't know or care about the difference anyhow.
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