RE: Tell Me I'm Wrong: BMW Z8

RE: Tell Me I'm Wrong: BMW Z8

Friday 14th December 2012

Tell Me I'm Wrong: BMW Z8

Harris wonders whether time was the ingredient needed to make sense of BMW's retro roadster



I first drove a BMW Z8 on a race track. Short of testing a Formula One car at a motocross course, this was about the most pointless means of introducing a car to the person who was going to write about it. Because the Z8 was more of a cruiser than a sports car, wasn’t it?

I suppose it was – it’s just that, back in 2000, we didn’t quite know what the Z8 was trying to be, and this indecision appeared to be reflected by BMW itself. It wasn’t badged as an M-car, but it used the E39 M5’s powertrain in a lighter body.

Bond's was actually a Mustang underneath
Bond's was actually a Mustang underneath
And this is the trouble with the Z8. I still don’t quite know what it is – an opinion that becomes harder to maintain as values climb higher and higher. And higher. Is the Z8 a complete cop-out in the fortunate position of having been used by J Bond Esq (although his was actually a Ford Mustang in drag) or is it actually a gorgeous GT car built in such small numbers that collectors are right to get all frothy over them?

To drive, the E52 Z8 was pretty disappointing. Despite the knowledge that it had a far better power to weight ratio than the equivalent M5, and even though it tripped the timing gear a few tenths faster than the saloon, it somehow felt no more special to use. Remember, these were the days before fancy valves and intake resonators, so your 5.0-litre V8 was strangled by ample exhaust boxes.

The steering was rather lifeless, but the real killer was the understeer. If BMW was coy about its real intentions for the Z8, then the fact that it engineered as much oversteer out of the car as possible perhaps confirmed what many people suspected: this was a California cruiser. More than half of the 5,703 cars built ended up in the US, so this was probably a wise decision.

Teutonic blonde did not come as standard
Teutonic blonde did not come as standard
And yet so many of us had visions of a real drivers’ car. In 2000, BMW M was in perhaps the best form of its life: the E46 M3 and E39 M5 were instant hits, the Z3 M Coupe was a cult all of its own, and what we – well, I – wanted was the Z8 to be the big M Roadster, but in a package that actually drove like a sports car, when in fact it was nothing of the sort.

The car sold slowly in the UK – being £80K and LHD only, that was always going to be the case. Initial depreciation was harsh, and then quickly became catastrophic as people decided the Z8 was less appealing than the latest Ferraris and Porsches.

Around this time Alpina got hold of the Z8. Actually, that’s not strictly true because Andy Bovensiepen, son of Alpina’s founder, worked at BMW on the Z8 project and once he’d seen the potential demand for a car with an automatic gearbox (and had been granted the necessary permissions by the parent company) he created the Alpina V8 roadster – basically a Z8 with the company’s 4.8-litre V8 and ZF auto ‘box. Over 500 were built, over half of which went to the states. But it still wasn’t a sports car.

Stunning looks promised much
Stunning looks promised much
Just look at the ingredients: BMW M, Alpina, a special spaceframe, rear-wheel-drive. It’s like being given the very best aged rib-eye and perfect King Edward potatoes and then producing a cottage pie – not offensive, but rather less than was expected.

So in the middle of the last decade, the Z8 was kind of where it deserved to be: a little unloved by people, mostly unloved by the market and nowhere near the serious car collector’s radar.

Then suddenly, overnight, the Z8 was big news. I have no idea what triggered the change – general enrichment of the population, a sudden art-deco retrospective splurge, the realisation that on paper the Z8 had about it the perfect ingredients for future success: scarcity, beauty and a decent badge?

It certainly is a beautiful car. Lighting by LEDs is now a common sight, but back in 2000 only the Maserati 3200GT could claim a set of rear lights as slinky as the Z8’s. The cabin was unexpectedly cool from a conservative brand like BMW too: central instruments and completely bespoke switchgear, which must have cost a fortune.

Has time made the Z8 less confusing?
Has time made the Z8 less confusing?
You know what, writing this is actually proving to be quite cathartic, because I think I’m beginning to understand the Z8. Finally, after 12 years, it is beginning to make sense. What BMW built was a new classic car. The problem was that no one, neither journalist nor first owner - is ever going to judge a car in those terms, so the Z8 was poorly received. But once it had ceased being a new car, around five years after it was launched, the way it drove no longer mattered: it had earned its place as a very occasional cruiser and a static object, and in both of those roles it is a very desirable machine.

But for me the Z8 still serves as a reminder that the brand which has given us some of the very best drivers’ cars of the past 40 years has still failed to deliver a memorable machine built on a special platform and ideally placed to show Porsche where it can go stick the 911.

It makes Audi’s achievement with the R8 all the more admirable, and leaves the Z8 as a monument to what might, and should have been.

But what do I know? Please feel free to tell me why I’m wrong.

Author
Discussion

don logan

Original Poster:

3,520 posts

222 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Looks fantastic (especially in black IMO)

The only place I`d like to drive one (again) is from Nice to St Tropez along the coast on a warm evening and not in any kind of a hurry / "spirited fashion"

Prices are ridiculously solid!


J-P

4,350 posts

206 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Never understood the Z8 - still don't. I've no idea why its so expensive either!

Yes it looks nice but so what?

Krikkit

26,520 posts

181 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Beautiful car, surely the handling could be sorted with a bit of fettling, and you'd end up with something really desirable.

The Don of Croy

5,993 posts

159 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
I'd still like one.

Better tell wifey as there are still 10 days before crimble...

Fittster

20,120 posts

213 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Not particularly rate and not as competent as a similar period Merc SL but well done Hexagon for keeping up the prices.


Isn't there some form of expensive chassis problem they often suffer from?

Edited by Fittster on Friday 14th December 15:32

IDrinkPetrol

132 posts

158 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
The Z8 is now exactly what it always was: a more modern take on the 507.
What more does it need to be?

HorneyMX5

5,309 posts

150 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
One of the best looking cars in recent years, I would love one regardless of how it drove.

soad

32,890 posts

176 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Wish I could afford one! weeping

dingocooke

670 posts

220 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
If they were M5 money plus a 10% premium for the two seat drophead factor, I would think they were ok, as has been said, the handling can be sorted; but even 12 years on £120k ish for the average 'good' one on PH classifieds is amazing for such a dull car based round an M5. Just think what you could buy with that kind of money; I'm thinking very nice 911 for daily sports driver, a Caterham for hooning, a nice classic for those lazy moments in the sun, a couple of sports bikes....and some change!!



tomoleeds

770 posts

186 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
does nothing for me looks like a z4

will261058

1,115 posts

192 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
That is just gorgeous, one of my all time favourite lookers!

don logan

Original Poster:

3,520 posts

222 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
IDrinkPetrol said:
The Z8 is now exactly what it always was: a more modern take on the 507.
What more does it need to be?
I think I first approached it with the wrong expectations, I jumped in and expected it to be an "M" type of car, if I`d known what it was really about I would have been a LOT more forgiving!


SuperchargedVR6

3,138 posts

220 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Krikkit said:
Beautiful car, surely the handling could be sorted with a bit of fettling, and you'd end up with something really desirable.
My thoughts too. Most dynamic short comings can be corrected with either in-house or aftermarket parts. IIRC, it was an American market only car, where 9/10ths precision isn't a top priority. I'm sure if it was Europised, it would be a nice car.




JPW231

350 posts

211 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
So BMW made a new "classic car", a bit like TVR were doing at the time for less than half the price and in RHD. True they weren't BMWs, but they were retro styled classic cars on a backbone chassis and with bespoke instruments (more from necessity than choice)! Sounds similar to me, along with a big V8 soundtrack and great performance.
I must admit though I loved the BMW at the time and still like it now smile

Veeayt

3,139 posts

205 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
In a word - styling exercise yes, driving machine no. The demand on Z8 means people prefer styling than driving in their cars.

Prof Prolapse

16,160 posts

190 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Always loved these. Absolutely no idea why. Good article.

Great investment surely?

don logan

Original Poster:

3,520 posts

222 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
SuperchargedVR6 said:
Krikkit said:
Beautiful car, surely the handling could be sorted with a bit of fettling, and you'd end up with something really desirable.
My thoughts too. Most dynamic short comings can be corrected with either in-house or aftermarket parts. IIRC, it was an American market only car, where 9/10ths precision isn't a top priority. I'm sure if it was Europised, it would be a nice car
But what in house bits were there?(apart from the fact that Alpina had a go but also added an auto box and insanely ugly wheels)

And who does aftermarket bits for a Z8?and why would they bother? (how much of it would they sell?)




rossub

4,442 posts

190 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
J-P said:
Never understood the Z8 - still don't. I've no idea why its so expensive either!

Yes it looks nice but so what?
This.

Got to be a bubble/emperors new clothes type of scenario going on with these.

Looks too similar to the Z3 aswell.

Big Fat Fatty

3,303 posts

156 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
I always thought the Bond car was a Corvette underneath?

AllNines

346 posts

182 months

Friday 14th December 2012
quotequote all
Mr Harris said:
Is the Z8 a complete cop-out in the fortunate position of having been used by J Bond Esq (although his was actually a Ford Mustang in drag)...
I thought it was a Cobra kit car chassis with Chevrolet power.
http://www.hagerty.ca/classic-car-articles-resourc...

What's the cheapest these things have reached, anyway. I always thought they remained ridiculously expensive.