New 981 Boxster 2.7 PDK - Buy with a loan or PCP?

New 981 Boxster 2.7 PDK - Buy with a loan or PCP?

Author
Discussion

PowerMalc

Original Poster:

222 posts

144 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
I'm nearly on the point of making a decision to buy a new 981 Boxster for around £40k. This will be twice what I have previously spent on a car and it would not be a daily driver.
I've always hankered after a Porsche and now am going to give myself a 60th birthday present!!
Previous car purchases have always been paid for in cash or used a personal or manufacturer 0% loan.
Although I could sell shares/PEPS I want to keep them invested as the stock market seems to be on the up.
I have £10000 as a deposit (Skoda Superb) so how do I finance the rest?
Porsche are currently offering a £1500 deposit contribution on a PCP and with a high 3 year residual of £23055 (5000 miles p.a.)the monthly payments are a manageable £350 to £400. What I can not work out is whether I will want to keep the car after 3 years so just hand the car back, in effect I pay £24000 for 3 years use and 15000 miles. On the plus side my current investments remain invested
Taking out a personal loan for £30k would cost about £930 a month.

What are people's experiences of buying a car on PCP and did you just hand the car back at the end of the term
If the car is worth more than the 3 year residual what did you do?

shoestring7

6,138 posts

246 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
I can see the appeal of being able to walk into an OPC and enjoying the new car buying process, but I have to say that while the new Boxsters are lovely things I'd baulk at paying £8,000 a year to drive one for 6,000 miles.

Have you ruled out putting your budget into something like an A1 993, which will likely keep all of your capital intact over 36months?

SS7

Nano2nd

3,426 posts

256 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
What rate is the PCP? All depends if u can get a better loan rate I guess, are u ordering new? Push for a discount! I looked at Porsche PCP, in the end I financed with a loan the rate was better so overall I pay less, though as u say the monthly outgoings are higher... Might work okay for you, my residual was 23k though my car cost £57k, had I been offered £33k residual (more in line with yours) I'd have probably gone the PCP route smile

Oh and be prepared for the next 10 replies to be along the line of "finance is the work of the devil" and you should buy a 25 year old 911 for £15k

Nano2nd

3,426 posts

256 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
shoestring7 said:
I can see the appeal of being able to walk into an OPC and enjoying the new car buying process, but I have to say that while the new Boxsters are lovely things I'd baulk at paying £8,000 a year to drive one for 6,000 miles.

Have you ruled out putting your budget into something like an A1 993, which will likely keep all of your capital intact over 36months?

SS7
Lol see above SS7 can type faster than me!

Actus Reus

4,234 posts

155 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
Bought on PCP before and got stung when I wanted to get out of the car early. I guess that's the danger on any finance deal though. I used it again on my current car as was buying a house at the same time and wanted to keep the capital for the house, but also wanted a Porsche before kids and marriage potentially precluded me from having a weekend toy.

Squeeze the OPC for a good rate - there's always movement, but if you are sure you'll be hanging on to it for a while, I don't see why not, as long as you appreciate the true cost to you. As to the car - had a 981 2.7 as a loaner yesterday - fabulous car - really very impressed with it - enjoy it, however you pay for it!

PowerMalc

Original Poster:

222 posts

144 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
SS7

Thanks for suggestion but I want a mid engined sports car
I had a Lancia Beta Monte Carlo Spyder in 1979 which I loved for its handling.
I do not want the hassle of secondhand car going wrong and costing a fortune in repairs.
I'll probably get shot for this but an aircooled 911 does not appeal to me

PowerMalc

Original Poster:

222 posts

144 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
Nano2nd said:
What rate is the PCP? All depends if u can get a better loan rate I guess, are u ordering new? Push for a discount! I looked at Porsche PCP, in the end I financed with a loan the rate was better so overall I pay less, though as u say the monthly outgoings are higher... Might work okay for you, my residual was 23k though my car cost £57k, had I been offered £33k residual (more in line with yours) I'd have probably gone the PCP route smile

Oh and be prepared for the next 10 replies to be along the line of "finance is the work of the devil" and you should buy a 25 year old 911 for £15k
Nano
PCP rate on a Boxster is 7.9% and on a Boxster 'S' is 7.8%
I will be ordering new if I go down the PCP route. And yes I will be pushing for a discount
My 'target' is 10% discount, the £1500 deposit on a PCP and 7.7% interest rate.

The residual is only affected by two criteria, the mileage and PDK. Adding £20k of options has no effect in increasing the residual.
My car will only have PDK, all round park sensors, wind deflector, cruise, 19" Cayman wheels

rob.kellock

2,213 posts

192 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
My Boxster Spyder was 3 years old a couple of weeks ago.

I bought it with a PCP.

The residual value you have been offered is high - mine was just over the 50% mark at 6000 miles pa.

I would be surprised if a 3 year old 981 holds its value as well as my Spyder has and I think you would have to expect to lose most if not all of your deposit at the end of the term. You may be disappointed if you expect there to be enough equity in the Boxster at the end of year 3 to sign up for another PCP without putting more cash in or significantly increasing your payments.

A 3 year old 15000 mile Boxster that you have coveted from new will still be like new at the end of the term and you may find there is no point in selling it. Re-financing your balloon will cost more than your proposed payments.

I expected to be changing to a 981S at the end of my term but decided that I would prefer to keep my Spyder so I have just paid off my balloon.

You could save an absolute fortune by buying an approved used low mileage 987 which would come with full 2 year extendable warranty - for the mileage you propose it would probably be just fine and you could enjoy the extra power of an S.

Carl_Docklands

12,196 posts

262 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
PowerMalc said:
I'm nearly on the point of making a decision to buy a new 981 Boxster for around £40k. This will be twice what I have previously spent on a car and it would not be a daily driver.
I've always hankered after a Porsche and now am going to give myself a 60th birthday present!!
Previous car purchases have always been paid for in cash or used a personal or manufacturer 0% loan.
Although I could sell shares/PEPS I want to keep them invested as the stock market seems to be on the up.
I have £10000 as a deposit (Skoda Superb) so how do I finance the rest?
Porsche are currently offering a £1500 deposit contribution on a PCP and with a high 3 year residual of £23055 (5000 miles p.a.)the monthly payments are a manageable £350 to £400. What I can not work out is whether I will want to keep the car after 3 years so just hand the car back, in effect I pay £24000 for 3 years use and 15000 miles. On the plus side my current investments remain invested
Taking out a personal loan for £30k would cost about £930 a month.

What are people's experiences of buying a car on PCP and did you just hand the car back at the end of the term
If the car is worth more than the 3 year residual what did you do?
Here is my experience with the costs:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

My opinion would be, if you are only going to do 5k per annum, it's not worth the cost to buy a brand new one.

I traded mine for a used Turbo (due to family reasons) and the residual is usually bang on the money as Porsche tightly controls the prices for cars for 3 years old and under. We do miss the Boxster, especially when the sun is out.












BIRMA

3,808 posts

194 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
You might might like to consider another option which is the path I took and it will save you a fortune. There is no doubt the 981 is a lovely car and an improvement on the 987 but I bought a 2008 Boxster RS60 privately which has everything on it including carbon ceramic brakes etc etc I paid £26K for it with 25K miles and still an OPC warranty. It is a fantastic little car now the sun is shining and I plan to do trackdays with it and just love 'wringing its neck' which you can do so often. I intend to SORN it over winter as I have other cars to use when the weather is crap and salt is all over the roads.
I'll probably only put 20K miles on it over the next three to four years and will be able to sell it on for a decent sum by then. My theory is the 981 will be half the price it is now and hopefully I'll pick up an all singing dancing 981 with carbon ceramic brakes and everything else for half what it is today.
Call me tight but it works for me and when you do the maths it's a no brainer if you don't mind not having the very latest.

mrdemon

21,146 posts

265 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
PCP is the single most expensive way to buy a car and leaves you with nothing after.

their rates are high and you pay interest on your balloon.

If you decide to keep it the total cost of purchase will be a scary figure. (prob more interest than your investments are getting)

if you give it back you are left with nothing. So where do you go from there ?.

I always buy cars outright now or with a small personal load in the early days.

that way every year you change your car you add a bit and work up.

atm you can get a 5.1% loan over 5 years up to 15k add your 10k and your cost are only £280 a month.

you then sort of run your own PCP as you would not keep the car 5 years, but you are paying off the capital all the time.

new cars are a mugs game but it comes down to are you happy a car costing you £8k a year for a base model Boxster for only 5k miles use.

how can that sound like a good deal !!!

LaurasOtherHalf

21,429 posts

196 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
Not strictly true mrdemon but I get what you mean.

I'd agree that PCP will be an expensive way to buy a car but who really ever does buy the car? PCP's work at getting you a low monthly fee, though what you really want to think of it like is a low monthly rental-as you're unlikely to ever buy the car outright.

Lease used to be a dirty word-but you'll be able to beat the OP's figures on a simple lease deal if you're that way inclined.

mrdemon

21,146 posts

265 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
I don't call £1.6k per 1 thousand miles cheap, and that's with out any running costs.
add in your tax, petrol, insurance, tyres and service over 3 years and you are looking at £2.2k per 1 thousand miles used min ammount.

PCP costs £1000's in interest, people like it because it gets them into a new car for a fixed fee per month.

but these people will never be able to upgrade as after 3 years is up the money has gone and so has your 10k deposit.
then what ? you are 10k worse off than you were before and have spent another 25k on top of that.

dealers love PCP and would sell that every time over any thing else.

crazy way to spunk £34k (inc running costs) over 3 years imo for a base model Boxster.

purds

115 posts

208 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
rob.kellock said:
You could save an absolute fortune by buying an approved used low mileage 987 which would come with full 2 year extendable warranty.
I agree totally with the above - it's what I have done for several Porkers and no regrets.
Your money of course but the I guess the initial year or two depreciation on the 981 will be pretty heavy in comparison.

OggyDJ

533 posts

142 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
There is no correct answer on how best to purchase an expensive depreciating asset such as a car IMO.

It all depends on your own financial circumstances, how you choose to invest / spend your money and to be honest....what's easiest and feels best for you.

In the past I have bought new Boxsters and paid cash.....huge outlay initially means you can't use that money for anything else but at least get the satisfaction of saying "it's mine, not costing me anything per month". But really it is still costing you per month in terms of depreciation and running costs. And at the end, you still have to put another 15, 20k in to change to something equivalent but newer. So in the end, it might be more preferable to just pay a deposit and then a manageable amount per month on finance and keep the majority of your cash for more important things ?? In the long run, yes you pay more....but in terms of cash flow and contingency (not having to sell it if you unexpectedly need a lot of cash)....it can be more convenient.

Without doubt, if I was as wealthy as Mr Demon, I would not use finance as obviously 50k / 60k is just a drop in the ocean to him ;-) But for me, that's still a lot of money and now having other draws on my funds, I would prefer not to have a nice car in garage but nothing in the bank (this would be my situation, not referring to anyone else here). Have a lot of equity in my house but personally, would never consider using that to buy a car (is actually cheapest form of doing it I think...but just feels wrong to me).

Last two 911s I bought on PCP (used cars). Have no intention of selling my Turbo so paid it off last year (a year early). Was I changing it any time soon, I wouldn't have bothered. So once again, PCP gives you flexibility....but you do pay for this of course !

It's really up to you and so long as you go into it with your eyes open, haggle on the interest rate and consider the extra costs, nothing at all wrong with buying a car using PCP in my humble opinion.

Am sure some people must inevitably sign up for a PCP thinking 3 years is a long time off so no need to worry about the balloon....the day soon comes when you have to decide on P'ex, walk away or your final direct debit payment being 25k+ so have this in mind from the very beginning (I guess like interest only mortgages !).

Actus Reus

4,234 posts

155 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
I think people lose sight of the bigger picture on these threads - the OP has more cash, but tied up in stocks, which he thinks may appreciate. If he's right, then perhaps PCP is the answer - he gets the car AND makes money on the market. And yes, I fully understand that he'd probably have to make quite a lot, but perhaps he might? Buying a depreciating asset outright, or on finance, is never really a sound financial judgment, is it?

Similarly the posts about getting 987s are very correct - surely it's cheaper, but it's not really the answer if you have your heart set on a 981. At the end of the day I say 'go for it' (with the proviso that you understand what, exactly, you're going for). You're a long time dead.

ETA: It's worth it:


Edited by Actus Reus on Wednesday 19th June 14:05

rob.kellock

2,213 posts

192 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
Never say never. There was more equity in my Spyder at the end of the term than I put in at the beginning.

PCP gets you in a much more expensive car for the same deposit / monthly outlay for the length of the term.

£10k deposit and £350/month over 3 years costs £22600 so buys, say, a £20k car. A new 981 is double that. In 3 years time, the £20000 car will still depreciate heavily if it's a modern Porsche. Let's say you can sell it for £12k (I got £20k for my 996 3 years ago and that's all it's worth now).

Total finance cost is £10600. Plus possibly extra services, 3rd year warranty renewal, probably a set of tyres and brakes and something else is bound to go wrong with it? If the new 981 retains a bit of equity at the end of the term, say it's worth £25k, its finance costs, become £20k and it only needs one minor service over the 3 years.

The overall difference ends up only being around £6k over 3 years and in all that time you've enjoyed your very own built to spec brand new car.

Obviously cash is cheaper but if you are saving at the rate of £350 per month, it will take 10 years to save up to afford that new 981.

LaurasOtherHalf

21,429 posts

196 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
rob.kellock said:
Never say never. There was more equity in my Spyder at the end of the term than I put in at the beginning.

PCP gets you in a much more expensive car for the same deposit / monthly outlay for the length of the term.

£10k deposit and £350/month over 3 years costs £22600 so buys, say, a £20k car. A new 981 is double that. In 3 years time, the £20000 car will still depreciate heavily if it's a modern Porsche. Let's say you can sell it for £12k (I got £20k for my 996 3 years ago and that's all it's worth now).

Total finance cost is £10600. Plus possibly extra services, 3rd year warranty renewal, probably a set of tyres and brakes and something else is bound to go wrong with it? If the new 981 retains a bit of equity at the end of the term, say it's worth £25k, its finance costs, become £20k and it only needs one minor service over the 3 years.

The overall difference ends up only being around £6k over 3 years and in all that time you've enjoyed your very own built to spec brand new car.

Obviously cash is cheaper but if you are saving at the rate of £350 per month, it will take 10 years to save up to afford that new 981.
Shhh don't try & explain the logic! "Finance is wrong", repeat until fade wink

OggyDJ

533 posts

142 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
Actus Reus said:
You're a long time dead.

ETA: It's worth it:


Edited by Actus Reus on Wednesday 19th June 14:05
Abso-bloody-lutely !!

In the end, for most of use these cars are just pure indulgent fun. A childhood dream realised, one of life's' passions, memories & photos of epic drives, car clubs / sharing the experience with others, exhilaration and most importantly.....something to make you feel alive ! It's not everyone's cup of tea and some might think us stupid for blowing tens of thousands of pounds on cars when you can get something much cheaper that seems to do a similar job. But then, I have a mate who has >10k tied up in a couple of road bikes (bicycles...not ,motor bikes !). Wouldn't be my choice when you can get a decent bike from Halfords for a few hundred quid but hey, if you are passionate about something, only the very best you can afford will do (and if you can't afford the very best...you will always aspire to it...."one day, when I win the lottery" etc).

Had a health scare recently (just got the all clear).....first thing I did on getting my results....go for a blat in the Turbo ! Who cares about what it's cost me overall....I just bloody love this car and it reminds me I'm alive !!!

For people like us, there is nothing quite like buying a brand new car....so once you have assessed the overall costs and considered your options, just go for it and revel in the experience of purchasing, collecting and owning your new Porsche smile
Someone once said to me you only regret the things you didn't do in life.....

OggyDJ

533 posts

142 months

Wednesday 19th June 2013
quotequote all
LaurasOtherHalf said:
rob.kellock said:
Never say never. There was more equity in my Spyder at the end of the term than I put in at the beginning.

PCP gets you in a much more expensive car for the same deposit / monthly outlay for the length of the term.

£10k deposit and £350/month over 3 years costs £22600 so buys, say, a £20k car. A new 981 is double that. In 3 years time, the £20000 car will still depreciate heavily if it's a modern Porsche. Let's say you can sell it for £12k (I got £20k for my 996 3 years ago and that's all it's worth now).

Total finance cost is £10600. Plus possibly extra services, 3rd year warranty renewal, probably a set of tyres and brakes and something else is bound to go wrong with it? If the new 981 retains a bit of equity at the end of the term, say it's worth £25k, its finance costs, become £20k and it only needs one minor service over the 3 years.

The overall difference ends up only being around £6k over 3 years and in all that time you've enjoyed your very own built to spec brand new car.

Obviously cash is cheaper but if you are saving at the rate of £350 per month, it will take 10 years to save up to afford that new 981.
Shhh don't try & explain the logic! "Finance is wrong", repeat until fade wink
Got a mortgage ? (some very wealthy people on here so answer might well be no biggrin).

IMO, finance is absolutely fine providing you can easily afford it and are aware of all the costs / pitfalls. As said, I could have just afforded my car outright when I bought it but as I'm self employed, didn't want to be faced with selling it if I was out of work for a while. In the end, it was ok and I managed to pay it off a year early (as I hate finance also as a rule wink). But were it not for PCP, I wouldn't have spent so much on a car at that point and I would have missed 3 fantastic years of experiences and happy memories, Who knows, my results may not have been good so having waited, could have missed out on the experience altogether !

Seems like OP is in a similar situation, he has the cash....can clearly afford it.....it just weighing up the best way to do it for him.

Finance is only wrong (IMO) if you can't afford to keep up repayments or have no way of getting out of it if you need to (unlike a house which normally would not be in negative equity).