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LoonR1

19,322 posts

62 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
I'd rather it be fooled occasionally though than be jammed solid all the time. Agree it's frustrating but then so are many other roads and given getting an FPN is more or less guaranteed I'd comply for ease on those stretches.

Devil2575

8,020 posts

73 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
LoonR1 said:
I'd rather it be fooled occasionally though than be jammed solid all the time. Agree it's frustrating but then so are many other roads and given getting an FPN is more or less guaranteed I'd comply for ease on those stretches.
Indeed.

I don't spend a lot of time on motorways anyway and when I do I tend to keep my speed down anyway to save fuel. There are plenty of good roads near me that never see a speed camera, or a queue to that matter, for times when I want to have a bit of fun.

speedking31

603 posts

21 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
1. The authorities are not obliged to prosecute every transgression. You may have just been lucky up to now.
2. The signs set a limit, there is nothing to prevent you driving at 40 mph through the whole section every day, thus ensuring compliance wink

Johnnytheboy

10,302 posts

71 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Mill Wheel said:
Street view here - limit is just THIRTY MILES PER HOUR:
http://goo.gl/maps/q7fvg
This one is great - it really does feel like you're going to stop completely trying to do 30 on a grade separated DC.

Scam vans frequently seen just before it as people tend to approach at a perfectly reasonable and slow at the last moment.

Mill Wheel

5,440 posts

81 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Devil2575 said:
I noticed the camera for each lane on the back of the gantry as well as the typical markings on the road so made sure I kept my speed down.
Would you not have been better off watching what was going on in front of you and around you?
And do you actually need to be told what speed is safe for the conditions immediately affecting you?

I find after 37 years of riding and driving without crashing that I am actually quite good at judging a safe speed to travel at!
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pitmansboots

1,372 posts

72 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Mill Wheel said:
Devil2575 said:
I noticed the camera for each lane on the back of the gantry as well as the typical markings on the road so made sure I kept my speed down.
Would you not have been better off watching what was going on in front of you and around you?
And do you actually need to be told what speed is safe for the conditions immediately affecting you?

I find after 37 years of riding and driving without crashing that I am actually quite good at judging a safe speed to travel at!
Skilful and safe drivers can do that and make sure they are within the maximum speed allowed; not always observed even by experienced drivers.

Simply keep your eyes open for hazards and don't exceed the maximum; how much easier can it be?

joebongo

1,377 posts

60 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
OP - any chance of this being a valid weasel argument?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21719322

covboy

1,713 posts

59 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
joebongo said:
OP - any chance of this being a valid weasel argument?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21719322
Out of date. I think they have changed the legislation to suit the signs !

Odie

4,187 posts

67 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Arent Gantry signs advised maximum speed, how are the tickets even enforced?

Source - http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_...

pitmansboots

1,372 posts

72 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Odie said:
Arent Gantry signs advised maximum speed, how are the tickets even enforced?

Source - http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_...
No the signs in the red circles are mandatory speed limits NOT advisory.

Odie

4,187 posts

67 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
pitmansboots said:
No the signs in the red circles are mandatory speed limits NOT advisory.
Yeah, just found that, its well placed in the highway code to be on a page unrelated to motorway signals, and alas has no pretty picture.

Devil2575

8,020 posts

73 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Mill Wheel said:
Devil2575 said:
I noticed the camera for each lane on the back of the gantry as well as the typical markings on the road so made sure I kept my speed down.
Would you not have been better off watching what was going on in front of you and around you?
And do you actually need to be told what speed is safe for the conditions immediately affecting you?
I was watching what was going on around me.

I am able to glance at my speedometer and speed limit signs during the course of my driving without needing to stare constantly at either in order to avoid breaking the limit.

There were times when the speed I would have felt safe at was higher than the variable limt. The limit kept changing for 40 to 60 and back to 40 again, whereas the reality of the road conditions meant that I would have tried to pick a speed and stick pretty much to it, making smaller adjustments rather than varying by 20 mph.

No I don't need the limits to tell me what is safe. I need to observe the limits to avoid prosecution.

Edited by Devil2575 on Monday 16th September 13:33

Chrisgr31

8,840 posts

140 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Mill Wheel said:
Would you not have been better off watching what was going on in front of you and around you?
And do you actually need to be told what speed is safe for the conditions immediately affecting you?

I find after 37 years of riding and driving without crashing that I am actually quite good at judging a safe speed to travel at!
The flaw in your argument is that in many cases speed limits are now being reduced all over the place for pretty arbitary reasons, on occasions it is becase a driver has crashed and killed themselves or others. But in many of those cases the driver was over the speed limit so how is a lower speed limit going to stop the accidents happening? In other cases the driver will have been drunk etc.

The reality of course is that what is a safe speed at one time of day may not be a safe speed at other times of the day, and cameras do not take into account traffic conditions, time of day, location etc

SAG6Y

Original Poster:

213 posts

74 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Thanks for all the replied guys. Im very tempted to contest this, or at least ask to be put a SAC. I need to understand how it's safe for me to do 40, while all others around me are traveling at 60-70. I also need to understand how it's safe to be traveling at 70, then be forced to reduce my speed quite abruptly to 30 on the entry to quiet slip road causing the car behind me to swerve, beep, flash and swear at me. Surely this is nuts but its exactly what I'm having to do now on a daily basis.

Driving home today, quiet motorway stretch and the camera was set at 20. No traffic or road works. How is this justified? Does anyone think I have a case or do I just give up? To say this episode has p@@@ed me off as understatement!

Landshark

1,781 posts

66 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
The Managed Motorway scheme around the south eastern stretch of the M25 is controlled by computer and called MIDAS. The system works by using loops in the road in each lane measuring the speed and distance between vehicles.

The idea behind the programme is that it detects vehicles slowing down and bunching up, so lowers the limit further back to slow the vehicles before they reach the bunching vehicles. It then has a higher limit at the bunching and after to try and spread the bunching out, hopefully meaning you won't come across a jam. Many people say to me, these limits are on but I never see anything, which means it working. Of course the road will reach its saturation point and no matter what you do there will be Q's.

When the computer is running it the limits can be NSL, 60, 50 and 40. 30 & 20's are only manually set, and are not set that often (they can be dangerous as mentioned)

The Midas loops can be confused, at silly o'clock in the morning when low loader wide loads are going through and seeing 40's and Queue Ahead is a bit surreal.
The red X's are manual put in, and the system then puts the rest of the signage in place.

I imagine the system in place on the M6 is the same, and I would be surprised if every gantry had a camera for every lane, the boxes maybe there but most maybe empty!!!

Whilst the system isn't perfect it does work (most of the time)

TOV!E

1,689 posts

119 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
numtumfutunch said:
sorry if this comes across as smug but I suspect you'll follow them now so they've served their purpose
wker

TOV!E

1,689 posts

119 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Mill Wheel said:
Would you not have been better off watching what was going on in front of you and around you?
And do you actually need to be told what speed is safe for the conditions immediately affecting you?

I find after 37 years of riding and driving without crashing that I am actually quite good at judging a safe speed to travel at!
Another wker...

TOV!E

1,689 posts

119 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
Just ask them for a photo of the driver, rear view camera so when they send the photo it will not have a face shot so ask them who was driving, then ask them when the calibration was last done, works every time I have questioned them.

LoonR1

19,322 posts

62 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
TOV!E said:
Just ask them for a photo of the driver, rear view camera so when they send the photo it will not have a face shot so ask them who was driving, then ask them when the calibration was last done, works every time I have questioned them.
Bullst

ferrariF50lover

589 posts

111 months

[news] 
Monday 16th September 2013 quote quote all
TOV!E said:
Just ask them for a photo of the driver, rear view camera so when they send the photo it will not have a face shot so ask them who was driving, then ask them when the calibration was last done, works every time I have questioned them.
This is hysterically wrong. Is it school holidays AGAIN?

Simon.
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