Tuesday 8th April 2014

McLaren vs Porsche

"The GT3 is one of the most impressive new cars I've driven" says thoughtful McLaren CEO

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McLaren holds the Porsche 991 GT3 in such high esteem the company has actually bought one - and that's boding very well for the handling of its new, junior supercar due next year. Though yes, McLaren has had to give it back to get its engine replaced!

Mike Flewitt: very impressed with the GT3

"The GT3 is one of the most impressive new cars I've driven. I was genuinely astonished at how accomplished that car is," McLaren CEO Mike Flewitt told PistonHeads.

We all like to think that that McLaren's battle is with Ferrari, but the boss revealed it's actually Porsche that McLaren Automotive's business is more closely aimed at, and from whom it is stealing the most customers. "Porsche is the brand we have the most conquests from. People who know and understand Porsche can relate to what we do in terms of technology," Flewitt told us. "We're less of a fashion statement than Ferrari and Lamborghini."

He told us the new car, known internally as P13, will cost around £120,000 and will essentially be a slightly less techy version of the 650S, using the a modified version of that car's 75kg carbon fibre tub. It won't be a 2+2, he said, but what it will be is more practical. "It's more usable, it's more affordable, it's still an actual sports car," he said. We can expect a version of the firm's 3.8-litre V8 to power it.

'Baby' McLaren P13 poised to bag Porsche fans

There have been rumblings in the Porsche section of the PH forums from GT3 owners and potential buyers hit by the recall that a secondhand McLaren 12C could be a good alternative, particularly as they're now as low as £120,000.

With the new P13 expected to take a bow at the Geneva motor show next year, the delay in replacing the GT3 engine could play right into McLaren's hands, especially if it's even 70-80 per cent as good as the phenomenal 650S updating of the 12C.

Flewitt is full of sympathy for Porsche over the recall. "It can happen to anyone," he said. "Modern cars are so complex there isn't a car company in the world that hasn't recalled cars for something."

It looks likely the P13 will beat the GT3's DIN weight of 1,430kg, especially with that carbon tub, even if it won't beat it on price at the boss's prediction of £120,000 against £100,540. But what a shootout that'll be, especially with the GT3 coming back stronger and in fighting mood.

 

[jonny finance]

Clever use of words.. Never slag off your competitor - but after reading has me warming to McLaren (more so of late)

[MrTickle]

Ron Dennis might be a bit miffed at the article

Mike is McLaren Automotive CEO, not McLaren as a whole.

[Phil Dicky]

I my numbers came up, my Supercar of choice would come from McLaren.

[OlberJ]

Would you like to say engine recall again?

Go on, we all know you're itching to.

[Mermaid]

Fair assessment. Cars are different today rather than better/worse, and will always have loyalty from most of their tribe. VFM, the GT3 is a hard act to follow.

[k-ink]

A McLaren in a back to basics format could be their best car yet

[HeMightBeBanned]

I hope the P13 actually looks good...

[Frimley111R]

k-ink said:

A McLaren in a back to basics format could be their best car yet

That depends on your definition of 'basics'

[The Pits]

This reads like advertorial for Porsche, written by Porsche's PR department to try and counter the negative publicity surrounding the GT3.

I'm sure the McLaren CEO had a lot more to say about his own company than how great the GT3 is and how sorry he felt about the recalls! If he's not furious reading this I'd be amazed. If he likes the GT3 so much will the new McLaren be rear engined? No it won't.

What the hell is going on at Pistonheads? Don't they sell enough Porsches as it is?

[Fayaz LP640]

At £120 grand and a debut not until next year, is it more likely that the P13 will be more of a GT3 RS competitor?

As for the Mclaren v Porsche thing, it is somewhat refreshing to hear admiration for one's work from the other. Something like this must've been unfathomable just a couple of years ago. What was it that Ron Dennis said about a dancing donkey again?

[[AJ]]

k-ink said:

A McLaren in a back to basics format could be their best car yet

Indeed. NA 3.8, a slippy diff instead of brake steer and less weight. That would be a very attractive proposition.

[OlberJ]

The Pits said:

This reads like advertorial for Porsche, written by Porsche's PR department to try and counter the negative publicity surrounding the GT3.

I'm sure the McLaren CEO had a lot more to say about his own company than how great the GT3 is and how sorry he felt about the recalls! If he's not furious reading this I'd be amazed. If he likes the GT3 so much will the new McLaren be rear engined? No it won't.

What the hell is going on at Pistonheads? Don't they sell enough Porsches as it is?

You're kidding me, the article is quite the opposite!

[dazren]

Last paragraph, mentions the GT3 weighs 1505kg. Really? Thought it was about 1430kg.

[HeMightBeBanned]

The comments about not competing against Ferrari ring hollow, tbh. Didn't McLaren come into the marketplace with the sole intention of being the best? The numbers for the 12C were impressive but it's not all about numbers. The fact that the 12C came off 2nd best in pretty much all magazine tests against the 458 and now this, "We're really competing with Porsche and not those Italian posing pouches" line reads to me like a tacit admission of failure.

[k-ink]

[AJ] said:

k-ink said:

A McLaren in a back to basics format could be their best car yet

Indeed. NA 3.8, a slippy diff instead of brake steer and less weight. That would be a very attractive proposition.

Also if the MP4 has already dropped to £120k, then an entry level McLaren might even be relatively affordable on the future used market. Something to look forward to! Buy them by the bucketload PHers, but please keep the miles down so I can bag a fresh one years later

[findtomdotcom]

I think he is spot on for taking aim at Porsche buyers. If there is a better upgrade path for a Porsche owner than McLaren then I don't know what it is.

P13? Sign me up please...

[Richard-G]

Mermaid said:

Fair assessment. #snip# VFM, the GT3 is a hard act to follow.

£70-£75K

[Mermaid]

Richard-G said:

£70-£75K

Impressive as that is, really not the same division and as broad a target audience.

[toppstuff]

HeMightBeBanned said:

The comments about not competing against Ferrari ring hollow, tbh. Didn't McLaren come into the marketplace with the sole intention of being the best? The numbers for the 12C were impressive but it's not all about numbers. The fact that the 12C came off 2nd best in pretty much all magazine tests against the 458 and now this, "We're really competing with Porsche and not those Italian posing pouches" line reads to me like a tacit admission of failure.

I disagree. Quite the opposite IMO.

The media has been quick to compare the 12C with the 458 but I think they are quite different in character. Having had some time in both, I see where McLaren are coming from.

The 458 is all about instant thrills. Everything about the 458 is about having instant gratification.

The 12C just isn't like that. It is more of a car that you develop a longer term relationship with. It takes a while to get to know the McLaren, while the 458 plays all its cards immediately.

In this respect, Mclaren is a LOT more like Porsche than Ferrari IMO.

[Rumblestripe]

HeMightBeBanned said:

The comments about not competing against Ferrari ring hollow, tbh. Didn't McLaren come into the marketplace with the sole intention of being the best? The numbers for the 12C were impressive but it's not all about numbers. The fact that the 12C came off 2nd best in pretty much all magazine tests against the 458 and now this, "We're really competing with Porsche and not those Italian posing pouches" line reads to me like a tacit admission of failure.

Not really, it reads to me like they are looking at the "best". Perhaps not the best styling but the best engineered cars? I have no doubt that a MClaren customer is more likely to be following an "upward" path from Porsche ownership (or perhaps Audi) into McLaren than those already owning Ferraris or Lamborghinis.