Thursday 12th March 2015

Hypercar training programmes compared!

You can afford the P1 GTR/Aston Vulcan/Ferrari FXX K but are you fast or fit enough to drive it?

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The lack of competition in the market for track-only hypercars with attached driver programmes is surely troubling many PHers. But the happy news is now you can give your £2m to someone other than Ferrari.

At the Geneva motor show, McLaren and Aston Martin both revealed their own car packages to take on Ferrari's current FXX K programme. Where best to put your money though? Ever the consumer champions we thought we'd compare the offers...

Not sold out, but it's for P1 owners only

Ferrari has been doing this for 10 years now, starting with the Enzo-based FXX before moving onto the 599 XX and now the potty-mouthed LaFerrari based FXX K (K for KERS) unveiled at the end of last year.

This might be the time to let you down gently if you're new to the Ferrari game: you're not getting in. You might have £2.2m going spare but if there were any cars left of the 30-odd planned, which there aren't, Ferrari wouldn't sell you one. Unless you were a "loyal client, someone who is thoroughly engaged with the brand," as a spokesman told us.

McLaren is fairly similar in that it won't sell its £1.98m P1 GTR to you unless you already own a P1, an exclusive club of 375 folk. It's also pretty much sold out for its run of 35-40 cars, with only a couple of P1 clients left to decide whether they want to join in.

Aston Martin is more egalitarian on this (as egalitarian as you can be when you're charging £1.8m) with no restrictions on who buys the Vulcan, which is loosely based on the carbon platform of the One-77 hypercar. It's also not sold out yet, Aston told us, which puts it straight into the lead at this point. It's also the cheapest.

The only one still available. For £1.8m...

So what do you get for your cash? The car obviously is the big draw. These are some of the most high tech machines available outside of Formula 1 and the first two or three rows at Le Mans. The Vulcan is a bit more old-school racer in that it comes with a six-speed sequential gearshift and a naturally aspirated 7.0-litre V12, while both the P1 GTR and the FXX K are hybrid powered with seven-speed dual-clutch gearboxes. The V12-powered Ferrari just edges the turbocharged V8 of the McLaren to make 1,050hp against 1,000hp, with the Aston trailing at 800hp, although Aston has said the final figure will be more than that. All are coy on exact performance figures.

All about you
The driver programme is at least as big a draw as the car here, especially for ingrained aficionados of the brands given how close they get you to the heart of the company. Of the three Ferrari is the only one that maintains the illusion you are, in essence, a development driver giving valuable feedback on new tech. We do wonder what useful info the son of a billionaire oil magnate could give Ferrari, but the company rejoinders that these guys are their customers. "We don't sell cars to test drivers," the spokesman said.

There's a livery expert at McLaren for your own

Aston and McLaren are more fixed on giving you a good time, and both their cars are FIA-approved. Meaning you can actually race other owners at the respective track events if you want. Qualifying, lights-out start, podium ceremony - the lot. One McLaren executive said you'd have to pay to fix a big shunt, but they wouldn't penny-pinch over small dings.

Ferrari would say why bother when we've got race series for that sort of thing? Working on the tech for the next road-going Ferrari - that's way more cool.

The £2.2m to Ferrari gets you six track events over two years, after which you'll be able to extend it. With the FXX you paid 150,000 euros, or £110,000, for an additional two years. Or you can sell the car, but only if the technology isn't already in the public domain in a road car.

By the way, it's a misconception that Ferrari won't let you take the car away - all three let you do that, although their pricing includes free storage and transport to the track events.

Yes, you can take the Ferrari way if you wish

The Aston driver programme starts at the beginning of 2016 and lasts three years instead of two, with an as-yet undecided number of track events. You build up to the Vulcan by driving a number of other Astons on track, as well as a stint in a driver simulator run by star Aston racer Darren Turner. The Vulcan then has different power settings before building up to the full 800hp+.

McLaren also gives you a session in its own F1 driver simulator in Woking, programmed for the P1 GTR. You also get a session with its charismatic head of design Frank Stephenson to discuss personalised livery and additions to the car before moving into the six track sessions spread over 18 months, starting at Silverstone followed by the Circuit de Catalunya in Spain. McLaren is the only one to make the driver programme optional - for half a million less you can just take the car away. The thinking being if you're made cash enough to buy one your diary is probably pretty packed already.

A sum approaching £2m is a hell of a lot money but it could turn out to be a canny purchase, Aston Martin's CEO Andy Palmer told PistonHeads at the Geneva show. He predicts limited run cars like the One-77 and Vulcan will be become the DB5 of the future in terms of auction power. "It's a £1.8m car and we've got people queuing up on the [show] stand to see it," he said. "Imagine what the value of that car will be 25 years from now."

 

	Aston Martin Vulcan	McLaren P1 GTR	Ferrari FXX K
Based on...	One-77	P1	LaFerrari
Engine	7.0 V12	3.8 V8 hybrid	6.3 V12 hybrid
Power	'800hp+'	1000hp	1050hp
Price	£1.8m	£2m	£2.2m
Gearbox	6-speed sequential	7-speed dual-clutch	7-speed dual clutch
Production run	24	35-40	'around 30'
Star instructor	Darren Turner	Chris Goodwin	Raffaele de Simone
Can be taken home?	Yes	Yes	Yes
Can be bought by...	Anyone with the money	P1 owners	Only the true believers
Number of track sessions	TBA	6	6
Time frame	Three years	18 months	Two years
Compete with other owners?	Yes	Yes	No
Simulator training?	Yes	Yes	No
FIA approved	Yes	TBC	No
Buy without track programme	No	Yes	No
Sold out?	Not yet...	As near as	Yes

[graeme4130]

I'd feel like they were pulling my pants down if they tried to tell me I was helping develop the car for the factory
Like the article says, would Ferrari really listen to their wealthy customers about toe in angles and carry them over to the 488 speciale or whatever it's going to be called
Sounds like a big ego massage to me
I can just see the guys in red sniggering away in another room as the customer tries to give constructive feedback after pottering around the track 15 seconds off their test drivers pace, but still filling his pants

[theAmerican]

graeme4130 said:

I can just see the guys in red sniggering away in another room as the customer tries to give constructive feedback after pottering around the track 15 seconds off their test drivers pace, but still filling his pants

Easy buddy. Some of the participants in these things are very skilled (check out 2:40. http://youtu.be/DN-pZoHdE7o). Either way, these customer programs are why these companies don't really give a broncos backside about taking these cars racing (notwithstanding the racing series eligibility issues). They gather waaay more info this way, without the cameras and negative impact on their brands should they crash n burn. There is very real development happening under these programs (same driver having some fun in his LaF. http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E).

[Salgar]

Why is the font on the front page so hard to read

[Megaflow]

A question, why this line:

comparison chart said:

Can be taken home? Yes Yes Yes

I read that as there must have been a program like this before where you couldn't?

WTF...

[NickGibbs]

Megaflow said:

A question, why this line:

comparison chart said:

Can be taken home? Yes Yes Yes

Some thought that Ferrari wouldn't let you take XX cars away with you and that you could only drive them at specific events where Ferrari wheeled out the car for you.

I suppose if the tech was THAT advanced they might be worried about owners driving it round to the competition for a quick shufti, but I guess they're pretty sure of the loyalty of their customers.

[Adrian W]

It just shows how far these companies are up there own arses, we'll only talk to you if you have enough money and we like you.

[Muzzer79]

graeme4130 said:

I'd feel like they were pulling my pants down if they tried to tell me I was helping develop the car for the factory
Like the article says, would Ferrari really listen to their wealthy customers about toe in angles and carry them over to the 488 speciale or whatever it's going to be called
Sounds like a big ego massage to me
I can just see the guys in red sniggering away in another room as the customer tries to give constructive feedback after pottering around the track 15 seconds off their test drivers pace, but still filling his pants

You need to understand that the £2m to participate is chump change for the guys buying these cars.

It would be like your local kart track asking if you want to pay a couple of quid to buy a kart and give them feedback on it. A bit of fun - something to do in your down time.

Do they expect to actually provide handling feedback?

Probably not but, as Ferrari rightly point out; they need feedback from drivers of all abilities as drivers of all abilities buy their cars.

The guy who is 15 seconds off the pace may be slow - but his input is still useful as to how he'd like the car to behave to make him quicker and what actually does make him quicker. Talent at driving is irrelevant.

[soad]

Shame there's no Lamborghini on the list.

[5517]

theAmerican said:

Easy buddy. Some of the participants in these things are very skilled (check out 2:40. http://youtu.be/DN-pZoHdE7o). Either way, these customer programs are why these companies don't really give a broncos backside about taking these cars racing (notwithstanding the racing series eligibility issues). They gather waaay more info this way, without the cameras and negative impact on their brands should they crash n burn. There is very real development happening under these programs (same driver having some fun in his LaF. http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E).

Both links dead.

[theAmerican]

5517 said:

Both links dead.

Wow for YouTube ! Maybe they weren't the original sources. See here instead:

http://youtu.be/nfF1Fzx8tmA
http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E

[Salgar]

5517 said:

theAmerican said:

Easy buddy. Some of the participants in these things are very skilled (check out 2:40. http://youtu.be/DN-pZoHdE7o). Either way, these customer programs are why these companies don't really give a broncos backside about taking these cars racing (notwithstanding the racing series eligibility issues). They gather waaay more info this way, without the cameras and negative impact on their brands should they crash n burn. There is very real development happening under these programs (same driver having some fun in his LaF. http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E).

Both links dead.

They're both dead because it's adding ). to both URLs

[graeme4130]

theAmerican said:

5517 said:

Both links dead.

Easy buddy. Some of the participants in these things are very skilled (check out 2:40. http://youtu.be/DN-pZoHdE7o). Either way, these customer programs are why these companies don't really give a broncos backside about taking these cars racing (notwithstanding the racing series eligibility issues). They gather waaay more info this way, without the cameras and negative impact on their brands should they crash n burn. There is very real development happening under these programs (same driver having some fun in his LaF. http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E).Wow for YouTube ! Maybe they weren't the original sources. See here instead:

http://youtu.be/nfF1Fzx8tmA
http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E

I agree in part, and perhaps I applied a much broader brush to the customers than is perhaps entirely accurate in terms of driving ability (although the first video only showcases someone making good progress in a very fast car by being overly heavy footed out of the corners)
However, I would still suggest that Ferrari don't take any genuinely useful info from these sessions and apply it to future road cars as the marketing bumph of 'being part of the development team' would suggest

Although I'm aware this statement carries no weight on such a forum post, I had a good friend who worked at Ferrari during the fxx times and he used to call the fxx program a 'cash cow'
Again, as mentioned above, £2m plus a variety of other costs is, indeed, small change to most of the customers that enroll in the program, but I'd still feel as though I was being laughed at should I want to consider myself a legitimately useful cog in the road car developemt machine
At least Mclaren and AML have the decency to claim its a fun toy for rich guys, which indeed it is and I suspect it's incredible fun in incredible machinery

Edited by graeme4130 on Thursday 12th March 17:50

[Rotrax]

Wunch of Bankers if you ask me

[T0MMY]

theAmerican said:

Wow for YouTube ! Maybe they weren't the original sources. See here instead:

http://youtu.be/nfF1Fzx8tmA
http://youtu.be/SazDE2PnI3E

I've seen that second video before...it's a bit weird, like Ferrari hired a load of other cars to go round slowly and make the LaF look ridiculously fast He isn't lapping nearly as quick as his relative pace to the other cars there suggests; they're all going at a snail's pace.

[GranCab]

Ref. the first video - it's an average driver in a very fast car. His braking ponts, corner entry speeds and lines are poor and he makes a fist of several corner exits by giving it too much throttle - saved by the car's electronics and a little input from him.

[anonymous-user]

Proofreading is obviously a dying art

[articulatedj]

2 million only buys you six track days? And you can't sell the car if they have matched the tech in road cars in two years?

This isn't a car sale; it's a bank heist. Especially when a V8 Radical could get you similar track times, and just as much fun.

[articulatedj]

The Crack Fox said:

"loyal client"

OK, so I might not be able to stretch to £2 million for a Ferrari, but if/when I could, I'd be buying from someone other than a company who uses repulsive language like that.

Yeah, let's be honest. The correct term here is "mark".

They want people who don't complain no matter how hard they are screwed, people who have so little self esteem that they need a paid cheering section to make them feel adequate.

[SteveSteveson]

graeme4130 said:

However, I would still suggest that Ferrari don't take any genuinely useful info from these sessions and apply it to future road cars as the marketing bumph of 'being part of the development team' would suggest

Really? How much does a multimillionaire playboy know about toe in angle and damper settings? Probably about as much as a salaried test driver knows about the driving habits and car tastes of a multimillionaire playboy. Not all test driving is about the purely mechanical.

articulatedj said:

Yeah, let's be honest. The correct term here is "mark".

They want people who don't complain no matter how hard they are screwed, people who have so little self esteem that they need a paid cheering section to make them feel adequate.

Have you see any of the Ferraris on track? Maybe they are over priced, maybe they aren't, but I don't think they are being screwed. These cars are utterly epic. They are like nothing else you can buy, and if people have the money then why should they not spend it on this? That kind of comment is exactly the same as people who think all you need is a 1 liter stbox make about PH worthy cars. "Who needs such a big car. You can't drive it fast on the road. My daewoo Beige-Mobile will do everything that will. It's just about ego...".

Edited by SteveSteveson on Friday 13th March 14:44

[articulatedj]

SteveSteveson said:

That kind of comment is exactly the same as people who think all you need is a 1 liter stbox make about PH worthy cars. "Who needs such a big car. You can't drive it fast on the road. My daewoo Beige-Mobile will do everything that will. It's just about ego...".

Edited by SteveSteveson on Friday 13th March 14:44

It is not exactly the same type of comment at all. Any number of race or track cars will keep up with or beat the FXX on track for less than a quarter of the money. Anything from the aforementioned V8 Radical to a Le Mans Prototype to a modern formula car will do the business. They will provide similar driving thrills, and you can even pay a team to set them up for you and bring them to the track.

Oh, and a race car won't drain its batteries before the end of a session, which the LaF and the P1 will do.

I like fast cars, but these hypercar-turned-track-cars are about profit and ego, pure and simple.

Edited by articulatedj on Friday 13th March 19:27

Edited by articulatedj on Friday 13th March 19:29