Monday 6th July 2015

New BMW M5 and Mercedes E63 AMG spied

The supersaloon duel continues into the next generation - here's the first look

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With M3 vs. C63 continuing to boil away (we'll get them both together soon, promise), the M Division against AMG battle is moving onto a fresh battlefield with new warriors.

Very clearly an AMG from here

The cars are new but of course the war has been waging for 25 years now. The M5 may have effectively established the supersaloon 30 years ago but the Mercedes 500E arrived in 1990 and they've been going at it ever since. As long as there's an M5, you suspect there will always be an E55 or E63, some kind of AMG E-Class, to tempt buyers away from it.

Here we can see both cars testing for the first time, ahead of full reveals sometime next year. The standard versions are still yet to be seen so the performance flagships are a little way off. But PH loves a supersaloon so apologies for the perhaps premature excitement.

Our spy photographers are confident the M5 was V8 powered and it would seem safe to assume the E63 will keep eight cylinders; the old twin-turbo may have been phased out but the 'hot-V' V8 seems to have filled that void perfectly. Will they be much beyond the c.550hp of the current cars? Or will there be a focus on reduced weight for increased performance?

V8 will stay in the M5 - good news?

As for the styling details, there are a few points of note even at this early stage. The E63 clearly has rear lights inspired by the C- and S-Class, the wheels back there look very similar to the GT's and the four exhausts are already prominent. Natch. The front bumper is already fairly aggressive too, for ultimate uberholt prestige.

The M5 has a front intake very similar to the current car, some big cross-drilled brake discs and, again, the quad exhausts. Expect more on both of these soon - we'll keep you posted!

[Spyshots: S. Baldauf/SB-Medien]

 

[Digger]

We're not teenagers! Natch.

[AOK]

M2 in the backdrop?

[gumsie]

The styling that looks so wrong on the C and S might actually work on the E?

[Terminator X]

Paint job does it no favours.

TX.

[Oakman]

They both will probably look better in the vinyl camo' .....


I can't see either of them being "subtle"

Thinking back to the earliest M5s - the Nearly version M 535i had the shouty body kit , badges etc and the true M was total stealth .....MMMMM ?

[Ares]

Oakman said:

They both will probably look better in the vinyl camo' .....


I can't see either of them being "subtle"

Thinking back to the earliest M5s - the Nearly version M 535i had the shouty body kit , badges etc and the true M was total stealth .....MMMMM ?

M's are fairly subtle, less so than their AMG and RS counterparts. Not sure if thats a good thing across the piece, but it would be a pull to me if I was heading to that type of car.

[Axionknight]

The shape of that Merc..... Criminally bad to my eyes, along the same lines as the current C Class, Merc have really dropped the ball IMO.

Awful.

[anonymous-user]

I can really see M5s/E AMGs becoming irrelevant in a generation or two.

Years ago they had supercar matching/beating performance and yet would allow you to travel in complete comfort all whilst having distinctive styling that made it clear to those in the know that you are driving something special.

The new cars are likely to have performance figures far closer to this generation's of hot hatches (A45 AMG/Golf R) than the modern supercars, are likely to come on 20+ wheels and 'Nurburgring suspension' and what's more, people will most likely be unable to tell it apart from a 520d M Sport or E220 'AMG line' minicab.

[Ares]

279 said:

I can really see M5s/E AMGs becoming irrelevant in a generation or two.

Years ago they had supercar matching/beating performance and yet would allow you to travel in complete comfort all whilst having distinctive styling that made it clear to those in the know that you are driving something special.

The new cars are likely to have performance figures far closer to this generation's of hot hatches (A45 AMG/Golf R) than the modern supercars, are likely to come on 20+ wheels and 'Nurburgring suspension' and what's more, people will most likely be unable to tell it apart from a 520d M Sport or E220 'AMG line' minicab.

.....you've not driven the last incarnations then! M5/6, RS6/7 and E63 are comic levels of performance. All starting to push towards 600bhp, they are as close to supercar performance than ever. If BMW follow suit and lose weight (as they have just done with the new 7-series), they will get even closer.

They are changing though. M3/4 to M5/6 is a bit like Ferrari 458/488 to F12/FF. The M5/6 isn't as nimble, but it is a lot faster. M5/6, RS6/7 and the E63 are otherworldly quick. We may bemoan forced induction, but it makes these cars leviathans on the road (in a good way).

[cerb4.5lee]

Terminator X said:

Paint job does it no favours.

TX.

[theboss]

Ares said:

279 said:

I can really see M5s/E AMGs becoming irrelevant in a generation or two.

Years ago they had supercar matching/beating performance and yet would allow you to travel in complete comfort all whilst having distinctive styling that made it clear to those in the know that you are driving something special.

The new cars are likely to have performance figures far closer to this generation's of hot hatches (A45 AMG/Golf R) than the modern supercars, are likely to come on 20+ wheels and 'Nurburgring suspension' and what's more, people will most likely be unable to tell it apart from a 520d M Sport or E220 'AMG line' minicab.

.....you've not driven the last incarnations then! M5/6, RS6/7 and E63 are comic levels of performance. All starting to push towards 600bhp, they are as close to supercar performance than ever. If BMW follow suit and lose weight (as they have just done with the new 7-series), they will get even closer.

They are changing though. M3/4 to M5/6 is a bit like Ferrari 458/488 to F12/FF. The M5/6 isn't as nimble, but it is a lot faster. M5/6, RS6/7 and the E63 are otherworldly quick. We may bemoan forced induction, but it makes these cars leviathans on the road (in a good way).

As above. To suggest M5/AMG will be rendered irrelevant by hot hatches is severely missing the point of the super saloons which is that they offer high levels of comfort as well as performance. The latest incarnation of hot hatch are very good indeed but between an M5 and Golf R, have a guess which I prefer spending 3 hours in.

[Mermaid]

Traction on these 2wd power/torque monsters is an issue.

[kambites]

Mermaid said:

Traction on these 2wd power/torque monsters is an issue.

Isn't that most of the fun of them?

[Mermaid]

kambites said:

Mermaid said:

Traction on these 2wd power/torque monsters is an issue.

Isn't that most of the fun of them?

Even in blighty weather?

Porsche went awd on their turbo charged GT car in the mid 90's, and those cars had circa 400ps?

[MarshPhantom]

Ares said:

Oakman said:

They both will probably look better in the vinyl camo' .....


I can't see either of them being "subtle"

Thinking back to the earliest M5s - the Nearly version M 535i had the shouty body kit , badges etc and the true M was total stealth .....MMMMM ?

M's are fairly subtle, less so than their AMG and RS counterparts. Not sure if thats a good thing across the piece, but it would be a pull to me if I was heading to that type of car.

The M4 isn't subtle.

[port13]

it's "Überholprestige", no t and together ;-)

and it's a real thing on the Autobahn... drive a Golf at 190 (kph) no one will give a toss, cruise that speed in a Mercedes everyone will move out of your way (apart from some idiot murdering an old Mondeo probably)

for me personally it's those Range Rovers at over 200kph appearing in the mirror that frighten me a bit... don't really trust those monsters too have the kind of braking power needed in order to stop them if necessary.

[kambites]

Mermaid said:

Porsche went awd on their turbo charged GT car in the mid 90's, and those cars had circa 400ps?

And weighed about half a tonne less than these things. These things are "only" ~300bhp/tonne.

[Schermerhorn]

Is this the F10 M5 replacement or just a facelifted F10 disguised by camo?

[kambites]

Schermerhorn said:

Is this the F10 M5 replacement or just a facelifted F10 disguised by camo?

I'd have thought it must be a LCI F10. The current car only came out, what, three years ago?

[theboss]

kambites said:

Schermerhorn said:

Is this the F10 M5 replacement or just a facelifted F10 disguised by camo?

I'd have thought it must be a LCI F10. The current car only came out, what, three years ago?

Don't forget the F10 non-M models were released all the way back in 2010... M5 followed a year or so later. LCI for all F10 models was out in MY2014 (so late 2013).

This is its replacement.