RE: Audi RS4 B8 beats B7: Tell Me I'm Wrong

RE: Audi RS4 B8 beats B7: Tell Me I'm Wrong

Thursday 6th August 2015

Audi RS4 B8 beats B7: Tell Me I'm Wrong

Everyone knows the B7 RS4 is the one to have, right? Wrong, argues Chris Rees!



Epiphanies are few and far between in my motoring life, but getting behind the wheel of Audi's RS4 in 2006 was definitely one. For someone who'd got used to four-hooped performance cars that were quick but numb, the B7 RS4 was the first Audi RS that truly felt like a great. Incisive handling - at last! - and a revelatory V8 powerplant combined to make the RS4 B7 utter magic.

Looks far daintier in presence of new car
Looks far daintier in presence of new car
And that feeling has never waned: the B7 RS4 remains a huge hero with me, and most of the rest of the world. The B8 of 2012 has suffered (unfairly in my view) from following-act toughness. And seeing as how the current B8 RS4 has now left production, it seems an apposite moment to get the behind the wheel of both recent generations of RS4 and ask the question: which one really is the better bet?

It won't take you much time on PistonHeads to appreciate just how much more love the B7 gets than the B8. I'm going to say up front that the B7 is indeed the purer car to drive, with its manual gearbox and relative lack of driver aids. But I'm also going to say that, epic car though the B7 RS4 is, the B8 is actually the one to have.

Figuring it out
First off, some numbers. The first set concerns just how small the B7 is - it looks more like a Golf than an A4 alongside the newer car. It's a mere 4,586mm long, versus the B8's 4,719mm. Most of the extra length is in the B8's wheelbase - 162mm extra, in fact - which boosts its practicality (far more rear legroom, loads more luggage space). Of course, that extra bulk makes it heavier by some 85kg, but the power-to-weight ratio marginally favours the B8 at 250hp/tonne versus 245hp/tonne.

Hardly a dramatic evolution but a welcome one
Hardly a dramatic evolution but a welcome one
Ah yes, power. Here's where the B8 scores its next blood, with 30 extra horses under the bonnet (450hp versus 420hp). The 4.2-litre V8 in both cars is of a type that's rapidly fluttering out of existence. Such a lunking great non-turbo V8 was arguably old-school even in 2006 - but one drive of either car at high revs is enough to convince you that it's one of the all-time great powerplants. Rev the V8 up to its limit (up to and beyond 8,000rpm) and the occasion will be etched permanently.

The B8 reaches its peak power even higher up the rev band at 8,250rpm (versus 7,800rpm) and ultimately, it's the faster car, too: 0-62mph comes up in 4.7 seconds, rather than 4.9.

Here's the killer for many people, though: the gearbox. The B7's six-speed manual is a thing of beauty and wonder. Audi's seven-speed S Tronic dual-clutch can't hold a candle to it - can it? Well, I'd argue it can. It changes cogs far more quickly than the manual, it's easier to drive around town and switching it to 'loud' mode makes the exhaust burble and crackle intoxicatingly on downchanges.

Here was nice Audi cabin c.2006
Here was nice Audi cabin c.2006
Sharp tools
Steering feel is one area where the B7 does get the nod. It is simply more communicative than the B8's electronic system, which suffers from a too light/too stiff feel in Comfort/Dynamic modes. But this is far less of an issue if you avoid Audi's Dynamic Steering option: the standard B8 set-up actually feels less on-off, and much closer to the B7's connectedness.

Slightly wider profile 265/35 R19 tyres also give the B8 more turn-in bite, and the siting of the engine further back endows it with an inherently more balanced feel. Both cars ultimately understeer, but the B8's Comfort, Dynamic and Individual settings allow you to play around with things. All you can do in the B7 is press the 'S' button on the steering wheel to open up the exhaust flaps and sharpen the throttle response.

One other clear area of superiority in the B8 is its cabin. It just feels much nicer, is ergonomically superior and has loads more kit in it, including Audi's rather wonderful MMI system.

Great car, but Chris prefers the B8
Great car, but Chris prefers the B8
Show me the money
B7s have acquired a semi-mythical status, keeping prices painfully high. You won't find one for much below £15K, while the delightful example from Ashtead Motor Trading in our photo shoot is nudging £20,000. But get this: top whack for a low-mileage B7 is fully £34,500.

That's hugely expensive for a nine-year old car. For a mere £5K more (under £40K) you can have a B8 RS4 with virtually the same mileage - and a car that's only three years old.

And let's not ignore fuel economy, which is a significant issue if you use the performance. On paper, the combined figures are 20.8mpg for the B7 and 26.4mpg for the B8, and that gulf is borne out it real life. Over a week with the B8, I averaged 22mpg, including a lot of London commuting. In contrast, I had to fill the B7 up twice during our photo shoot, during which time it did no better the mid-teens. Over the course of a life-cycle, that's a lot of cash down the filler flap.

Yes, it's hard to ignore the fact that the B7 has a more connected feel as a driver's car. But with prices for B7s and B8s rapidly converging, would you REALLY rather have a B7 over the faster, plusher, more adjustable, more sophisticated, newer B8? I'm not sure I would. But tell me I'm wrong.













 

[Images: Viadas Gerikas]

 

Author
Discussion

mr sagman

Original Poster:

1,718 posts

236 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
Great write up.. Summed both cars up very well.. The manual gearbox seperates the cars for me in such a way that means I love the B8 for all its newer gadgetry and extra Bhp.. But I adore the B7 for its simplicity and pure aural magic.. Audi really nailed it with the B7 and it really proved be a very hard act to follow.. Hard to seperate them but if pressed, the B7 would get my vote.

RobinBanks

17,540 posts

179 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
I didn't even know the Bx codes. I'd go for the B7 but there are other cars in the class I'd choose before it.

But the B7 RS4 is a really nice car. If I were in the market it would have to be a bright blue saloon version.

Patrick Bateman

12,179 posts

174 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
I'm not a huge fan of the numbers on paper approach to comparisons of which car is better.

CorvetteConvert

7,897 posts

214 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
Both cars are out of date with an engine which just doesn't do it for me. 10 years ago the RS4 V8 was a revelation. Time has taken it's toll. Let's see 500 bhp and a modern motor.

Patrick Bateman

12,179 posts

174 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
What's a modern engine?

Yet another turbocharged lump?

CorvetteConvert

7,897 posts

214 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
Pretty much yes, for many good reasons. The new M4 shows what under 3 litres can do with technology. A 425 bhp peach of an engine with 500 bhp just waiting to be released. I call that good when it has grunt from idle to go with it. The new 4 and 4.4 litre twin-turbo V8 German lumps are also fantastic.

Guffy

2,311 posts

265 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
Guess I'm going to be slightly biased having owned a B7 for 5-years, the reason I kept it longer than any other car I've had was because it was fantastic. I test drove the B8 but it didn't gel with me.

My only criticisms of the B7 RS4 were it's straight line speed and the interior felt a bit dated.

I can forgive the DRC frailties as the suspension is very good, additionally the carbon build-up issues are exaggerated IMO. I de-coked mine at 40k miles, but it wasn't really necessary and only the very worst examples seem to sap power, although the vacuum system is often the cause of power loss.

Wish I had held on to mine as a keeper now.

Patrick Bateman

12,179 posts

174 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
Variation would be nice. That doesn't seem to happen much any more though. Numbers on paper never tell the whole story either.


sidesauce

2,475 posts

218 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
Patrick Bateman said:
I'm not a huge fan of the numbers on paper approach to comparisons of which car is better.
Not even empirically speaking? I sit on the other side of the fence personally, I'm a fan of numbers on paper. Also just from a comfort/safety point of view I much prefer the newer car.

Patrick Bateman

12,179 posts

174 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
sidesauce said:
ot even empirically speaking? I sit on the other side of the fence personally, I'm a fan of numbers on paper. Also just from a comfort/safety point of view I much prefer the newer car.
Where better doesn't necessarily mean faster/more powerful/more grip etc.

anonymous-user

54 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
I've secretly always admired the B7 RS4. Manual gearbox, big NA V8, 4wd drive traction, great handling, practical too. Could never deal with the 'I'm a cock' Audi image though which I appreciate is more my problem than the car's. Still undecided about the DSG in the new one but their market research must tell them that's what their thrusting young customers want.

EdHall697

65 posts

116 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
I keep looking at S5's in the classifieds and thinking should I buy one. You only have to put S5 4.2 V8 into youtube and I guarantee you will be in the classifieds immediately after!

Sod all these hybrid and electric cars.

We have to keep V8's on the road...

HeMightBeBanned

617 posts

178 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
At least with a B8 you don't have to worry about getting up in the morning to find the front seats gone, resulting in the car being written off.

buckline

377 posts

163 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
B8 for me. Spec'ing the auto box on my M135 was my first foray away from a manual and if truth be told i wouldn't go back, particularly with the main car in the house.

I shall be keeping an eye on these and the outgoing C63 for my next car.

rtz62

3,367 posts

155 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
CorvetteConvert said:
Pretty much yes, for many good reasons. The new M4 shows what under 3 litres can do with technology. A 425 bhp peach of an engine with 500 bhp just waiting to be released. I call that good when it has grunt from idle to go with it. The new 4 and 4.4 litre twin-turbo V8 German lumps are also fantastic.
Unknowingly, Audi weren't far off the mark with the 2671cc 261bhp 295 lbft of torque B5 RS4, if new cars are heading back down the turbocharging / smaller capacity route.
Ok, more power and better economy from a new engine, but the principle is there, in my mind at least.
Out of interest, a friend had a B5 and a B7.
He sold the B5 to a collector for silly money (that's silly money around 3 years ago) and sold the B7 as it just didn't geo with him.
He replaced it with a minuscule mileage concours winning Escort RS1600i and a a new Ford Transit. Strange but true.

anonymous-user

54 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
It's ironic to read someone with the username 'Corvette Convert', who owns the Daddy of V8s, doesn't prefer naturally aspirated V8s wink

Most manufactures are 'moving with the times', but that opportunity to own the last generation of German naturally aspirated V8s isn't one that should be passed easily. Objectively, the new BMW M engines are probably better than the last ones, but I'd be (and was) hard pushed to take the turbo V8s / straight 6s over the V10 / V8 of the last generation.

Time flies. It's nearly been 10 years since this Audi came out and was a car I majorly lusted over in my early 20s. I've never actually driven one. I must do so at some point.




GranCab

2,902 posts

146 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
I have a B8 and absolutely love it - even when it only does 14 MPG on an enthusiastically used tank of Super Unleaded ...

A very good friend of mine has just traded his 'owned from new for 8 years' B7 in for a B8. He tried M4s etc. but couldn't find anything that ticked all the boxes like the Audi does and he much prefers the B8 to the B7.

And - yes he did have an attempted theft of his B7 seats ...

GranCab

2,902 posts

146 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
P.S.



hwajones

775 posts

181 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
I want to hate these cars for their Audi boringness.
For the way they both look identical even though separated by years.
For the way people who don't have a clue about cars think they're amazing...

But I'd still take one... if an M3 wasn't available!

Adrian E

3,248 posts

176 months

Thursday 6th August 2015
quotequote all
No mention of brakes in the article, but the B7 has a healthy appetite for them and the Brembo setup is fearsomely expensive to maintain - think £200+ for pads, £700+ for front discs etc. Also prone to pad material build up on the discs giving a feel like warped discs.

I've driven both and enjoyed them in their own ways. B7 was never an ownership option when newer as I couldn't afford it. The B8 RS just doesn't quite do it for me as a family car - largely because I've got a V8 already and need something that's capable of being vaguely sensible on running costs for fuel. The S models (in our case a Sportback) hit that sweet spot a bit better for us, but I can understand the desire for a n/a V8 from those that buy them.

The B9 generation I'm expecting to really like based on what's doing the rounds on engine choices, although a C7 RS6 also appeals.