997.2 C4S to V8VS undecided

997.2 C4S to V8VS undecided

Author
Discussion

Fatboymark

Original Poster:

17 posts

110 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
I currently drive a 997.2 C4S, and am looking into the possibility of moving to a V8 Vantage S, I have been to my local dealer and tested a brand new one with the semi auto box.
I have read lots on this forum, just as I did before buying my Porsche and have found the information, views and opinions very helpful indeed.
I am still not absolutely sure about the change (still love the 997, but can't have both) love the looks of the Vantage, but the test drive I had didn't blow me away in the way I had expected, I will arrange another longer one but in the meantime I have a couple of questions that I hope you can help with.
What/where is the works place that is always referred to, and is it the best place to source a car?
The car will be my daily driver (12-15k per year) anything I need to be aware of when putting this many miles on?
Running costs all seem to be about the same as my Porsche +10% is this accurate?
When researching my Porsche, I became aware of various potential problems (bore scoring etc) I haven't found anything on here about the Vantage, is there anything in particular to look out for? (the car will be a 2013/14 model)
Thats I can think of for now
Thanks in advance for your help
Mark

Bincenzo

2,606 posts

178 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Fatboymark said:
I currently drive a 997.2 C4S, and am looking into the possibility of moving to a V8 Vantage S, I have been to my local dealer and tested a brand new one with the semi auto box.
I have read lots on this forum, just as I did before buying my Porsche and have found the information, views and opinions very helpful indeed.
I am still not absolutely sure about the change (still love the 997, but can't have both) love the looks of the Vantage, but the test drive I had didn't blow me away in the way I had expected, I will arrange another longer one but in the meantime I have a couple of questions that I hope you can help with.
What/where is the works place that is always referred to, and is it the best place to source a car?
The car will be my daily driver (12-15k per year) anything I need to be aware of when putting this many miles on?
Running costs all seem to be about the same as my Porsche +10% is this accurate?
When researching my Porsche, I became aware of various potential problems (bore scoring etc) I haven't found anything on here about the Vantage, is there anything in particular to look out for? (the car will be a 2013/14 model)
Thats I can think of for now
Thanks in advance for your help
Mark
Hi Mark, welcome. To answer your questions:
Aston Martin Works is based at the old Newport Pagnell Factory and is one of many franchised dealers. Don't look at exclusively at their stock, there are a multitude of different dealerships and private sales to be had. Buy on condition and history - when I say history I don't just mean the service book. Dig deep for the information.
No dramas with using one as a DD, although some say it will lose it's special appeal if routinely used.
Don't know about Porsche running costs, but cannot see an AM being far off.
No recurring mechanical problems, the engine is bulletproof. There are, however, a variety of minor niggles that are common. Look very carefully at the paint around the door handles, bottom of the doors and wing mirror stalks. These are often found with paint bubbling, which is directly caused by poor paint prep and is not covered by an anti-corrosion warranty. If buying from a dealership, insist that this is rectified before driving away and press hard for what action will be taken if this reoccurs. LED lighting can be an issue, but there's little you can do before it happens. Look for condensation in the light units - very common so if it's present get them replaced. Clutch is a weak point, but equally can last up to 70k miles if driven sympathetically. Find out if a new clutch has been fitted.

Best bet is to buy Grant's book, which is on a sticky at the top of the page. It's an absolute bible and gives warts and all about all models. Best £20 quid I've ever spent, and I still refer to it now. Good luck with the search, keep asking questions as there is a mountain of knowledge on here if you can filter out the bks!

Big Ry

1,678 posts

118 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Welcome Mark,

I too went from a 997.2 C2S to a V8S Coupe (Manual) and to be honest I didn't see any difference in running costs at all. The Aston might be a tiny bit thirstier but nothing that would worry you.

As for driving, I was nonplussed with the 997 to be honest, but the whole sense of occasion with the Aston is something else.

As has already been said, the mechanics are pretty bulletproof on these cars, providing they've been looked after that is. You get the odd niggle with trim or a sensor but nothing major as a rule.

Works trade a bit on the fact that they're the historical home of Aston, but to be fair it's also much more than that. My experience with other AM dealers is that by in large they are just that, they sell cars and anything that needs doing to them (paint, trim etc) gets farmed out to third parties. Works have more or less everything on site so they do it themselves (i'm sure there are odds and sods they don't do obviously). For instance I wanted the steering wheel re-trimmed in Alcantara before collection, and I know they literally took it off and walked it round to the trimmers on site. No other AM dealer could do that from what I understand. If you visit Works you'll certainly get a sense of what AM is all about, they usually have a few One-77's knocking about plus a good dose of heritage cars. It's worth a visit even if you don't buy from them, just to get a real appreciation of the brand (phone ahead and ask for a workshop tour).

Obviously don't limit your search to Works, as all dealers "should" adhere to the same standards so that's not an issue. Get the book and then decided exactly what options are important to you so hopefully you can either find them or get them built into any deal, as deciding a month down the line you want a specific option might make your eyes water, although from my experience that's no different to Porsche.

Happy hunting !

ilikeAstons

275 posts

103 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Fatboymark said:
I currently drive a 997.2 C4S, and am looking into the possibility of moving to a V8 Vantage S, I have been to my local dealer and tested a brand new one with the semi auto box.
I have read lots on this forum, just as I did before buying my Porsche and have found the information, views and opinions very helpful indeed.
I am still not absolutely sure about the change (still love the 997, but can't have both) love the looks of the Vantage, but the test drive I had didn't blow me away in the way I had expected, I will arrange another longer one but in the meantime I have a couple of questions that I hope you can help with.
What/where is the works place that is always referred to, and is it the best place to source a car?
The car will be my daily driver (12-15k per year) anything I need to be aware of when putting this many miles on?
Running costs all seem to be about the same as my Porsche +10% is this accurate?
When researching my Porsche, I became aware of various potential problems (bore scoring etc) I haven't found anything on here about the Vantage, is there anything in particular to look out for? (the car will be a 2013/14 model)
Thats I can think of for now
Thanks in advance for your help
Mark
I too had a 997S (2wd). Have to say that I loved it. However, the two cars IMHO are like chalk and cheese. The Porsche is a sports car, and is quick, with the great sound of the flat 6.

The Aston however, is a completely different kettle of fish. Front engined, rear drive..... more fun....

I loved the Vantage - a cracking car. Not sure it would beat a 911 on a country lane, but it was definitely more fun.

In short, the Aston has a sense of occasion every time you press that little button. The Porsche never did that for me. People smile, as opposed to scowl when they see the car - especially in the UK where I feel there is a sense of pride on being greeted with Gaydon's finest.


HBradley

1,037 posts

180 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Welcome.
As previously stated they are both very different in terms of character & dynamics. You should consider the gearbox carefully, if you're going manual to manual there's very little to highlight, however if you're looking at a Sportshift it's very important to understand that it's no PDK. It's an automated manual not a auto/semi auto box (the manual & SS are essentially the same but with electronics to connect the paddles to the 'box). For 'Marketing' reasons AML added a D Button but it should NEVER be used, it is completely unsuited to the gearbox. In paddle-mode the changes are excellent & suit it perfectly, particularly when the Sport Button engaged (IMHO obviously!).

TKP

127 posts

90 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Bincenzo said:
Look for condensation in the light units - very common so if it's present get them replaced.
Are you serious? I think it that there is no real solution to that issue (except for some smart home-made modifications that are not that easy to install). If you look for a used one and expect the dealer to change the light units, I think he just won't sell it to you...

Bincenzo

2,606 posts

178 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
TKP said:
Bincenzo said:
Look for condensation in the light units - very common so if it's present get them replaced.
Are you serious? I think it that there is no real solution to that issue (except for some smart home-made modifications that are not that easy to install). If you look for a used one and expect the dealer to change the light units, I think he just won't sell it to you...
Then you've been buying from the wrong dealership. I'm deadly serious. Why would you buy a car with a fault?

Fatboymark

Original Poster:

17 posts

110 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Thank you for the warm welcome and pointers, I have ordered the book as suggested.
I had the condensation in the rear lights on the Porsche and they were replaced under warranty so will look out for this and the paint.
My wife is a paint/bodywork expert so I will get her to look at the areas you have highlighted
My local dealer in Derby is being helpful and sorting an extended test drive for me.
Will keep you updated as I go
Mark

TKP

127 posts

90 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Bincenzo said:
Then you've been buying from the wrong dealership. I'm deadly serious. Why would you buy a car with a fault?
Because the fault is somehow in the construction... like the stupid cupholders that are unusable with a manual gearbox. Or this crap they call handbrake. I would be interested to hear if anyone got that headlights bug fixed by the dealer on a used car. Of course it shouldn't be there but it just is in a majority of cases that I'm aware of and as it doesn't hurt, so be it...

Bincenzo

2,606 posts

178 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
TKP said:
Bincenzo said:
Then you've been buying from the wrong dealership. I'm deadly serious. Why would you buy a car with a fault?
Because the fault is somehow in the construction... like the stupid cupholders that are unusable with a manual gearbox. Or this crap they call handbrake. I would be interested to hear if anyone got that headlights bug fixed by the dealer on a used car. Of course it shouldn't be there but it just is in a majority of cases that I'm aware of and as it doesn't hurt, so be it...
It sounds to me like you're not really that fond of your car. What's the issue with the handbrake?
My point on the lights is that I accept they are susceptible to getting condensation over time, but if it is there at the dealership, they should, and will, fix it before you drive the car away. If you wanted a car with decent cup holders, why didn't you buy one that has them more to your liking? Or did you fail to properly test the car before you bought it?

TKP

127 posts

90 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Bincenzo said:
It sounds to me like you're not really that fond of your car. What's the issue with the handbrake?
My point on the lights is that I accept they are susceptible to getting condensation over time, but if it is there at the dealership, they should, and will, fix it before you drive the car away. If you wanted a car with decent cup holders, why didn't you buy one that has them more to your liking? Or did you fail to properly test the car before you bought it?
I apparently missed to bring my point across - the V8V has weak spots like every other car out there. And some are construction related, like the condensation. If they exchange the headlights which I believe is extremely expensive, it doesn't guarantee you that the issue is solved.

stty sat-nav, stupid handbrake (I just don't use it anymore, it takes usually 5 tries to get it released), pointless cupholders, condensation in the headlights, for me that's all points that just do not really matter. So I am absolutely fond of my car, I did not buy it for best cupholder or best handbrake or best sat-nav. I am really pissed about my BMW sat-nav that cost 3k and is rubbish but on a modern BMW this is a relevant feature and of course it's 100 times better than the Aston sat-nav and I was never ever angry on my Aston sat-nav; I knew it would be bad, so what? I bought the V8VR because I like the car. It's attractive to me - the ride, the sound, the look, the interior. Period.

Bincenzo

2,606 posts

178 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
TKP, well I'm glad we've got that settled. You like your car, that's good. You need to get your handbrake adjusted, as I like many owners don't have a problem with it. The condensation, as I said, happens, but I would insist that new units are fitted if were buying a car from a dealership, which was my point to the OP, not you.

Enjoy your Roadster. You could even fit the wheels that have just come up on another thread to cheer you up wink

BamfordMike

1,192 posts

156 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
TKP said:
Are you serious? I think it that there is no real solution to that issue (except for some smart home-made modifications that are not that easy to install). If you look for a used one and expect the dealer to change the light units, I think he just won't sell it to you...
For the sake of other newbies who read this and wonder, some clarity.

The front lights when switched on generate heat and given the right (or wrong) set of ambient conditions, the inside of the lens will condensate and whilst looking unsightly and slightly obscuring beam, is a feature sir, has no fix and causes no other consequence as condensate will dissipate.

However, the rear lamps can suffer ingress / condensate literally forming a river in the bottom of the light unit, is a design flaw, appears not to have a fix despite numerous iterations. My opinion is that if car exhibits water welling / wetness at point of sale, a vendor might swap for a new unit to make a sale. Once the car is in the new owners hands beyond the short term and because the issue is a well known anomaly, it's probably unlikely the vendor will mop up the complaint- rightly or wrongly so - I can see both sides.

A 2006 car with 30k miles at half its original new sale price will naturally and understandably exhibit wear and tear and must be taken on by new buyer in that state - or else buy a brand new one. Whilst the prospective buyer is looking for perfection despite the ageing facts, the balance is a vendor, obviously, cannot be expected to deliver a car despite the age and prior use, as if it were brand new, but the vendor must hand on heart sell a car with no known faults. A new to the brand buyer must accept normal wear and tear, forgive the car Aston foibles, and if can't overcome that, chose another brand.

TKP

127 posts

90 months

Wednesday 11th January 2017
quotequote all
Bincenzo said:
TKP, well I'm glad we've got that settled. You like your car, that's good. You need to get your handbrake adjusted, as I like many owners don't have a problem with it. The condensation, as I said, happens, but I would insist that new units are fitted if were buying a car from a dealership, which was my point to the OP, not you.
I got your point but personally I believe you raise the bar quite high if you expect this to be fixed and that might give the OP a headache. Well, I'm living in the wrong country, so if I would set the benchmark as you do, I would have looked around for another 3-4 years to then buy totally frustrated a brand new V8V (wait - in 3 years it's not existing anymore; only AMG turbos will be available...)

Bincenzo said:
You could even fit the wheels that have just come up on another thread to cheer you up wink
Err.. hmmm.... no, but thanks a lot for the inspiration laugh

@BR: as usual, thanks a lot for the clarification on the technical part. Always good to have some knowledge around when opinion is dominating wink

northernmedia

1,988 posts

137 months

Thursday 12th January 2017
quotequote all
BamfordMike said:
TKP said:
Are you serious? I think it that there is no real solution to that issue (except for some smart home-made modifications that are not that easy to install). If you look for a used one and expect the dealer to change the light units, I think he just won't sell it to you...
For the sake of other newbies who read this and wonder, some clarity.

The front lights when switched on generate heat and given the right (or wrong) set of ambient conditions, the inside of the lens will condensate and whilst looking unsightly and slightly obscuring beam, is a feature sir, has no fix and causes no other consequence as condensate will dissipate.

However, the rear lamps can suffer ingress / condensate literally forming a river in the bottom of the light unit, is a design flaw, appears not to have a fix despite numerous iterations. My opinion is that if car exhibits water welling / wetness at point of sale, a vendor might swap for a new unit to make a sale. Once the car is in the new owners hands beyond the short term and because the issue is a well known anomaly, it's probably unlikely the vendor will mop up the complaint- rightly or wrongly so - I can see both sides.

A 2006 car with 30k miles at half its original new sale price will naturally and understandably exhibit wear and tear and must be taken on by new buyer in that state - or else buy a brand new one. Whilst the prospective buyer is looking for perfection despite the ageing facts, the balance is a vendor, obviously, cannot be expected to deliver a car despite the age and prior use, as if it were brand new, but the vendor must hand on heart sell a car with no known faults. A new to the brand buyer must accept normal wear and tear, forgive the car Aston foibles, and if can't overcome that, chose another brand.
Yep I live with the condensation in my front lights as they quite literally all do it.
Either modify with the vent etc or put up with it. Even new ones can do it.

Had both rears replaced under warranty as the seals blew and condensation pooled in the reflectors, not good.

Either way it's an on going issue. Doesn't bother me too much tho.



davek_964

8,796 posts

174 months

Thursday 12th January 2017
quotequote all
Obviously we all like different things, but I went 996 turbo to V8 Vantage 18 months ago (and a 56 plate, so much older than the OP is considering) and I think I can honestly say that there has not been a single moment when I've wished I still had the Porsche.

cayman-black

12,625 posts

215 months

Thursday 12th January 2017
quotequote all
TKP said:
Because the fault is somehow in the construction... like the stupid cupholders that are unusable with a manual gearbox. Or this crap they call handbrake. I would be interested to hear if anyone got that headlights bug fixed by the dealer on a used car. Of course it shouldn't be there but it just is in a majority of cases that I'm aware of and as it doesn't hurt, so be it...
There are quite a few on here that have had headlights replaced under warranty for this issue.
Does not mean it will not happen again, but if i was buying from a main dealer and noticed this i would want then changed.

Murph7355

37,651 posts

255 months

Thursday 12th January 2017
quotequote all
Bincenzo said:
Then you've been buying from the wrong dealership. I'm deadly serious. Why would you buy a car with a fault?
I would be staggered if a dealer selling a used V8V would replace headlamp units with condensation (unless the car's over priced).

AM wouldn't change mine when the car was new! They did fit silica gel which helped...but as mentioned above it's a design issue rather than a "fault". Just like there are many other design and production issues typical with the car.

There's nothing wrong with pointing these out to prospective purchasers. They'll find them soon eonugh anyway and then think we're all idiots for not noticing. It doesn't make the cars any less lovely. But the issues exist.

OP - plenty of threads on here about such things...spend plenty of time reading up. 997s are nice cars. But they're more Audi than Aston. That is also not meant as a criticism per se. Astons are special. Buy one and use it for a bit. You can always go back, but life's too short not to try lots of stuff.

btw, be careful when there's salt on the roads. bincenzo won't like me saying this, but the quality of the paintwork is st and the undersides don't like it. Get it waxoyld or similar if you intend to use it all year round.

northernmedia

1,988 posts

137 months

Thursday 12th January 2017
quotequote all
Murph7355 said:
Bincenzo said:
Then you've been buying from the wrong dealership. I'm deadly serious. Why would you buy a car with a fault?
I would be staggered if a dealer selling a used V8V would replace headlamp units with condensation (unless the car's over priced).

AM wouldn't change mine when the car was new! They did fit silica gel which helped...but as mentioned above it's a design issue rather than a "fault". Just like there are many other design and production issues typical with the car.

There's nothing wrong with pointing these out to prospective purchasers. They'll find them soon eonugh anyway and then think we're all idiots for not noticing. It doesn't make the cars any less lovely. But the issues exist.

OP - plenty of threads on here about such things...spend plenty of time reading up. 997s are nice cars. But they're more Audi than Aston. That is also not meant as a criticism per se. Astons are special. Buy one and use it for a bit. You can always go back, but life's too short not to try lots of stuff.

btw, be careful when there's salt on the roads. bincenzo won't like me saying this, but the quality of the paintwork is st and the undersides don't like it. Get it waxoyld or similar if you intend to use it all year round.
Genuinely interested to know more about the underside corrosion issues you mentioned.
I haven't heard of any such problems on a gaydon era car.

RobDown

3,803 posts

127 months

Friday 13th January 2017
quotequote all
Yes that's a new one on me too. I had corrosion on my DB5 but that was 50 years old. Wasn't aware of any issues on Gaydon cars