RE: SEAT Leon Cupra R coming
Tuesday 14th February 2017
Any manufacturer R&D boss who parks a test mule of a proposed performance variant outside the restaurant on a press launch has to be doing something right. OK, a SEAT Ateca with quad exhausts and a boosted engine might not seem the obvious choice for the next Cupra model. And it's a trick he's apparently played before. But according to Matthias Rabe it is a whole lot of fun to drive, a view apparently vindicated by SEAT's 'ring lap maestro Jordi Gene. And Rabe sees more of a future (that is to say profit) in a car like this than he does Cupra versions of the Ibiza.
Well if this can make money for a Leon R...Fear not though hot hatch fans - "Leon is Cupra" according to Rabe. And over dinner conversation about whether or not SEAT should regain the wild streak fans enjoyed with the first and second generation Cupras - think the original R, the bodykitted K1 and some of the more outgoing colour choices once offered on hot SEATs - he turned the tables and asked if something more extreme could work. Something limited production perhaps. Something like a Golf GTI Clubsport S, perhaps?
Keep an eye out at Frankfurt, says RabeIt's hard to escape the sense a bit more Spanish passion and some additional fire in the belly of the Leon Cupra would give SEAT a real boost. Some bright colour choices, perhaps a bodykit, a tickle more power or track-inspired chassis settings to keep the faithful happy and a limited run to make it feel special. He likes the idea of increasing the scope for personalisation, be that through additional colours, kits or other upgrades. And though he didn't say it in as many words Rabe advised we stay tuned come Frankfurt later in the year - dare we hope for a new Cupra R, or something along those lines?
SEAT Leon Cupra R coming?
SEAT R&D boss asks us 'should we go extreme?' We say yes...
Well if this can make money for a Leon R...
Certainly if the Leon Cupra - the one we're driving here is the newly updated 300 version - has an issue it's that it's perhaps gone a little bit too sensible pants in its third generation. Where once SEATs catered to more extrovert tastes these days it looks a little Audi-fied in an age of wild looking Type Rs and aggressive Ford RS product. Heck, even VW does stripped out 'ring racer hot hatches these days.
Rabe is too canny to say as much but he's clearly got some stuff up his sleeve. Asked about the whole 'sub eight minutes' thing he says it worked for them at the time, made some noise about the new Cupra and did what was needed. Are they going to go back and take on the Golf? He says not but he knows how to do it with the tools at his disposal. Technology like the adjustable DCC dampers means he can - and has - made Leons with more extreme chassis set-ups than the one signed off for the 300. He likes the tuneability of the VAQ 'diff' and the scope it gives for dialling out understeer. He says he never liked front-driven cars for this reason but now reckons the lack of weight and tools at his disposal makes them more fun to drive than their all-wheel drive equivalents, even though this option has been added to the ST estate version.
Keep an eye out at Frankfurt, says Rabe
If subverting the brand's family crossover with a bit of Cupra-ness counts as a fun project in Rabe's eyes you have to hope this will inform where the hot hatch versions go next.
Discussion
ha.They already built this car or rather gave people the option of buying it by offering the ultimate sub 8 pack. But yes, the car could do with a bit more differentiation from the cooking models. When i look at mine it invokes the same feelings as I get when i look at my washing machine (none).
They need to get more crazy. My silver cupra 290 is nice to look at. But it shouldn't be nice. It should get me excited to jump in and it should stand out. White, grey, silver, solid red or girly blue. That's what we got with the cupra colours.
Where's the sun yellow? OTT orange? Electric purple? It's all too sterile now. Yes, I think it's the best looking car on the platform, but why wrap it up in taxi colours? It's yawn inducing. Leave the yawns for Audi. SEAT need to up their game again with the craziness and not make it look like the car equivalent of an anti-static-cleanroom.
Where's the sun yellow? OTT orange? Electric purple? It's all too sterile now. Yes, I think it's the best looking car on the platform, but why wrap it up in taxi colours? It's yawn inducing. Leave the yawns for Audi. SEAT need to up their game again with the craziness and not make it look like the car equivalent of an anti-static-cleanroom.
It's a funny one because having had a Golf R I know the cupra will be more boring with 4wd and in it's 2wd state it definitely does not need any more power (wheel hop is horrible as is). They've done the lightened car thing with the sub 8 and the more extreme no AC ultimate sub 8 (yeah, i know it's still not R26R extreme).
The fancy lighter sub frame and other bits from the Golf clubsport S would be the obvious next step but surely that would p
s off CSS owners? Perhaps more aggressive geometry to make it less neutral, like the RS Megane but how the hell do they market that one without the obvious things that people buy i.e. lower 0-60/more power. I think the first is at it's limit with fwd and more power would completely ruin it.
The fancy lighter sub frame and other bits from the Golf clubsport S would be the obvious next step but surely that would p
s off CSS owners? Perhaps more aggressive geometry to make it less neutral, like the RS Megane but how the hell do they market that one without the obvious things that people buy i.e. lower 0-60/more power. I think the first is at it's limit with fwd and more power would completely ruin it.I am thinking about buying (or leasing if I 'have' to and it makes sense) some sort of new hot hatch (or preferably estate) so this interests me a lot.
Ideally I'd have an M140i or 340i Touring but these are a bit 'normal' and the touring is auto only.
A Cupra R Leon ST would be great (I prefer the looks and space)
Ideally I'd have an M140i or 340i Touring but these are a bit 'normal' and the touring is auto only.
A Cupra R Leon ST would be great (I prefer the looks and space)
Jonno02 said:
They need to get more crazy. My silver cupra 290 is nice to look at. But it shouldn't be nice. It should get me excited to jump in and it should stand out. White, grey, silver, solid red or girly blue. That's what we got with the cupra colours.
Where's the sun yellow? OTT orange? Electric purple? It's all too sterile now. Yes, I think it's the best looking car on the platform, but why wrap it up in taxi colours? It's yawn inducing. Leave the yawns for Audi. SEAT need to up their game again with the craziness and not make it look like the car equivalent of an anti-static-cleanroom.
It might sound daft but i'm sure VW themselves have something to do with this. They got rid of the Viper Green colour on the face-lifted Scirocco not long after it went on sale and changed the no-cost paint options.Where's the sun yellow? OTT orange? Electric purple? It's all too sterile now. Yes, I think it's the best looking car on the platform, but why wrap it up in taxi colours? It's yawn inducing. Leave the yawns for Audi. SEAT need to up their game again with the craziness and not make it look like the car equivalent of an anti-static-cleanroom.
I'm sure i've also seen less colours offered on the newest model Leon coming out aswell. Less vibrant ones at least, which is a real shame considering VW should let the Seat add some Spanish flare and influence to their range.
culpz said:
It might sound daft but i'm sure VW themselves have something to do with this. They got rid of the Viper Green colour on the face-lifted Scirocco not long after it went on sale and changed the no-cost paint options.
I'm sure i've also seen less colours offered on the newest model Leon coming out aswell. Less vibrant ones at least, which is a real shame considering VW should let the Seat add some Spanish flare and influence to their range.
Oh it's obviously a downside of the VAG brand. Boring, white-goods cars in 50 shades of...white, black and grey. Even the fast models. I'm sure i've also seen less colours offered on the newest model Leon coming out aswell. Less vibrant ones at least, which is a real shame considering VW should let the Seat add some Spanish flare and influence to their range.
Honestly, I quite like today's more understated Cupra. On the one hand, I quite fancy a practical 280+bhp daily driver, but on the other hand I'm not so into showboating most of the time, so the current model seems right up my alley.
Of course, I've no qualms with them doing a shoutier one alongside the current model, if that's what they're proposing. If anything, that would just make the plain clothes spec even more appealing.
Of course, I've no qualms with them doing a shoutier one alongside the current model, if that's what they're proposing. If anything, that would just make the plain clothes spec even more appealing.
As the owner of a 400ps Stage2 Cupra 280, yes they needed to do a limited edition Clubsport S style car.
The MK1 LCR was a step up from MK1 Cupra, MK2 LCR wasn't a huge step up from MK2 Cupra (I owned one).
MK3 Cupra R needs to be a big step up, brembo as standard, no rear seats, factory fitted strut bars inside etc, basically a Clubsport S but with more power.
The MK1 LCR was a step up from MK1 Cupra, MK2 LCR wasn't a huge step up from MK2 Cupra (I owned one).
MK3 Cupra R needs to be a big step up, brembo as standard, no rear seats, factory fitted strut bars inside etc, basically a Clubsport S but with more power.
Well I love my manual Cupra ST as I need the space (590l boot), and for that it is relatively very light (~1410kg fuelled) and a good steer. Except the aforementioned wheel hop, they should really fix that from the factory and not use the same engine mounts on a 300hp fwd car as on a 100hp base model.
Like the gentleman above I've made it my own 'R version' (or S version?) under the discrete grey skin (I prefer a nice looking but low profile car). Light 18" wheels, thicker rear arb to bring the rear alive, lower engine mount insert to cure most of the hop, short shift/clutch. And the exhaust was completely silent, so I had to add just a little note to it to be sure I wasn't driving that aforementioned 100hp version, I grew to deeply dislike the fake engine noise in Sport/Cupra mode so switched that off.. Topped off with a conservative stage 1,5 to bring even more driveability with less spool and an unrelenting top end to an already great engine that now has a delivery very unlike the turbo engines of old.
I would love a hot estate with the RS3 engine, FXD up front and GKN Twinster at the rear... But realistically that would be nose heavy +250kg, an autobox and twice as expensive so... Just a bit more panache/extraversion to the brand would go a long way.
Like the gentleman above I've made it my own 'R version' (or S version?) under the discrete grey skin (I prefer a nice looking but low profile car). Light 18" wheels, thicker rear arb to bring the rear alive, lower engine mount insert to cure most of the hop, short shift/clutch. And the exhaust was completely silent, so I had to add just a little note to it to be sure I wasn't driving that aforementioned 100hp version, I grew to deeply dislike the fake engine noise in Sport/Cupra mode so switched that off.. Topped off with a conservative stage 1,5 to bring even more driveability with less spool and an unrelenting top end to an already great engine that now has a delivery very unlike the turbo engines of old.
I would love a hot estate with the RS3 engine, FXD up front and GKN Twinster at the rear... But realistically that would be nose heavy +250kg, an autobox and twice as expensive so... Just a bit more panache/extraversion to the brand would go a long way.
Edited by Onehp on Wednesday 15th February 06:49
AJB88 said:
MK3 Cupra R needs to be a big step up, brembo as standard, no rear seats, factory fitted strut bars inside etc, basically a Clubsport S but with more power.
I don't agree. Well, i do agree it needs to be a step up and I have no issues with them doing a Clubsport S version and re-naming it something else, but the Cupra R has never been a stripped out, hardcore version of the Cupra really.The Cupra R will just be the Cupra with more power, some styling tweaks and maybe a few extra bits here and there. That's always been the case and i don't see them changing the formula now tbh. I could be wrong but SEAT can't be treading on VW's toes too much.
I had a 55 plate Cupra R225 and loved it, except for the splitter which would scrape on pretty much anything about an inch off the ground.
I then had an 07 FR with an APR map and that was nice. I did enjoy the car, but I just found it and the recent models of the Leon just too boring looking, although very nice in all other aspects.. When I was looking for a new car last year, I really wanted to get a Seat again but didn’t like the extra add-ons you buy for the car, like the coloured alloys etc,. The Leon in my view is desperately needing sportier styling on the bodywork, which is why I went for the Golf R estate instead.
I then had an 07 FR with an APR map and that was nice. I did enjoy the car, but I just found it and the recent models of the Leon just too boring looking, although very nice in all other aspects.. When I was looking for a new car last year, I really wanted to get a Seat again but didn’t like the extra add-ons you buy for the car, like the coloured alloys etc,. The Leon in my view is desperately needing sportier styling on the bodywork, which is why I went for the Golf R estate instead.
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