RE: Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?
Sunday 12th March 2017
A round table (OK, it was actually rectangular) with Andreas Preuninger and Dr Frank Walliser is a nice way to end a long day at the Geneva show, the two of them relaxed and chatty even after a long day in front of the likes of us. There's a rapport between these guys and the UK hacks though and the conversation is always free flowing and relaxed. Although often credited as 'head of Porsche GT cars' Preuninger's job title is actually 'Manager - High Performance Cars' (given who he works for that carries some extra cool points) while Walliser, formerly the project chief on the 918 Spyder, is head of the whole GT and Motorsport department.
Never say never on a mid-engined one...Topics for discussion included 'that' Lamborghini lap - Preuninger says he loves the car, Walliser wants 'his' lap record back - and the 911 R's influence on the new GT3. Walliser regards the R as an "ice breaker" for shifting the focus away from relentless fixation with stats and more to the 'fun' side of driving fast cars and doesn't rule out further influence on mainstream Porsche product down the line. Cheering news for those who missed out perhaps and both are keen to emphasise much of what went into the R is now in the GT3. And the newer car is considerably faster.
So just how many manuals will be bought?And finally that question hanging over the new GT3 - what is the expected sales split between manual and PDK? Both laugh and say they're taking bets in the office. Walliser jokes it may be zero manual, Preuninger reckons 40:60 split in favour of PDK. Truth is they don't know. One thing Preuninger is certain about - the new engine in the GT3 is, in his words, "maybe the most impressive engine Porsche has ever made." Some claim. We look forward to finding out if he's right.
Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?
These questions and more put to the men who'll be making the decision
Never say never on a mid-engined one...
But they're still motorsport guys. So will they follow the lead of the RSR race car and make the next 911 GT3 or RS mid-engined to follow suit? Knowing looks are exchanged, some 'not any time soon' platitudes offered and then the shrugged "never say never" from Preuninger. On a related theme and given the GT3 is the last 911 in the range to use a naturally-aspirated engine will the Cayman GT4 replacement use a similar engine or a tickled four-cylinder turbo? "Do we look like four-cylinder guys?" asks Preuninger. Walliser laughs along but makes the point the 718 engine is something unique in the market and not without its advantages.
So just how many manuals will be bought?
Discussion
With this car Porsche could buck the trend for limited production runs and sky high prices by producing enough to satisfy demand. This would have in my opinion allow more people to enjoy the cars and put the fun of driving back on the agenda, not the fun of watching values of investment rise. It would also set Porsche apart from some of its competitors in so far as they are willing to allow as many people who can afford the car to enjoy it and the model itself would gain more exposure and perhaps become a car remembered as a great drivers car that was enjoyed by a larger group of drivers and not as an investment tool hidden away and never really enjoyed. All this talk of mid engines reminds me I must get back to sorting the suspension on my mid engined MR2. Maybe I could lend it to Porsche, at a fee of course so they can find out how to package a mid engined car that can easily be worked on.
DM525i said:
With this car Porsche could buck the trend for limited production runs and sky high prices by producing enough to satisfy demand. This would have in my opinion allow more people to enjoy the cars and put the fun of driving back on the agenda, not the fun of watching values of investment rise. It would also set Porsche apart from some of its competitors in so far as they are willing to allow as many people who can afford the car to enjoy it and the model itself would gain more exposure and perhaps become a car remembered as a great drivers car that was enjoyed by a larger group of drivers and not as an investment tool hidden away and never really enjoyed...
As I recall there was a similar decree in April 1934 - Mr Ferdinand Porsche was tasked to produce something for "the people"!I genuinely don't really care.
Buying an RS Porsche has become such an absurd exercise in humiliation , anything the engineers may talk about is a waste of everyone's time.
Journalists will have fun driving them at expenses paid jollies.
Car enthusiasts will have to stand in line with local celebs and the OPC dealer principals best mates in order to have the chance to fellate him as he wishes.
Great cars. Corrupt and morally bankrupt distribution.
Many proper enthusiasts are properly cynical about anything Porsche do these days.
Buying an RS Porsche has become such an absurd exercise in humiliation , anything the engineers may talk about is a waste of everyone's time.
Journalists will have fun driving them at expenses paid jollies.
Car enthusiasts will have to stand in line with local celebs and the OPC dealer principals best mates in order to have the chance to fellate him as he wishes.
Great cars. Corrupt and morally bankrupt distribution.
Many proper enthusiasts are properly cynical about anything Porsche do these days.
Cold said:
Never mind about mucking about with these sort of engineers' vanity projects. It's about time Porsche got back to concentrating on their core market and produce a new small engined diesel Macan.
very good. Still, though I am sure that Porsche are marketing genii to use this scarcity tactic on their GT cars, I wonder how many potential GT buyers would accept a flabby turbo auto 911 (in itself a wonderful car, mind) when they want the GT?
I'd love a manual GT3, even a PDK would be great, but I am not excited about any of the carrera range. I might be in the position to buy one in this model's lifespan but it's all theoretical. I will not buy another 911 or a flipped GT. How many people are in the same position? Is this why Aston are trying to get into this niche?
The only real beneficiaries of this policy are dealers (especially in UK where it's a complete piss take when it comes to stuff like this) and flippers.
The few enthusiasts who get the cars are in such small numbers that they are completely immaterial.
ogrodz said:
As I recall there was a similar decree in April 1934 - Mr Ferdinand Porsche was tasked to produce something for "the people"!
mmm well Tatra don't make cars nowadays so they can't steal one of theirs. Maybe they'll use their muscle on VAG and steal the successor to the Huracan?54Kab said:
The supply/demand issue seems to be greater in the U.K. Than anywhere else? If you live in mainland Europe it seems you can always get a car if you want one... so, is it a RHD thing, or do Porsche UK not get the % of builds they need ?
No, I think it is a Porsche strategic decision to rip off the Uk enthusiast market for the simple reason that they can. There are enough moneyed property developer types who are best mates with the dealer principal, who can fill up the order book on cheap finance and then flip the car to the dealer to sell again for 50% more. It is a deeply cynical exercise and, frankly, has practically put me off the brand for life.
toppstuff said:
No, I think it is a Porsche strategic decision to rip off the Uk enthusiast market for the simple reason that they can. There are enough moneyed property developer types who are best mates with the dealer principal, who can fill up the order book on cheap finance and then flip the car to the dealer to sell again for 50% more.
It is a deeply cynical exercise and, frankly, has practically put me off the brand for life.
If it was really Porsche AG's cunning plan to rip off UK customers why is it the £ price of the gt3 is so much lower than the € version?It is a deeply cynical exercise and, frankly, has practically put me off the brand for life.
Production is not strictly limited per the R but it's effectively limited as Porsche have rather more profitable tat like macans and cayennes to make so the gt3 is capacity limited. If Porsche announced they would fulfill every order (say let's assume the impossible by turning part of macan production to gt3...), the cars would depreciate as usual and no one would want them.
At the end of the day, if a dealership gets 10 cars but has 50 people putting in letters of interest of which I'd guess over half are doing so purely because it's a tax free instant gain, how do you suppose allocations should be handed out?
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