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Kentish

Original Poster:

14,874 posts

120 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
A possible 7 year jail sentence!

Wording from the DOT.

Excessive or inappropriate speed is a factor in many road accidents. Analysis of casualty statistics in Great Britain has shown excessive speed to be a contributory factor in 28% of all collisions that result in a fatality. It is essential for the safety of all road users that the police can undertake speed enforcement to identify people who speed, in particular in covert operations.

It is for this reason that we propose to prohibit devices that prevent or interfere with this police activity. Clause 17 of the Road Safety Bill gives the Secretary of State the power to prohibit the fitting of, or the use of vehicles carrying, speed assessment equipment detection devices. It defines such devices as a device one or more of whose purposes is to interfere with or detect the operation of equipment used to assess the speed of motor vehicles.

The precise details of which devices would be prohibited will be set out in supplementary secondary legislation. This will be done following full consultation with interested people. It is not intended to prohibit Global Positioning Systems which usefully give drivers information on the location of published camera sites.


Lesley Reed
Road Safety Division
Department For Transport
2/11 Great Minster House
GTN 3533 2452
0207 -944-2452





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

News
Arrest over speed trap 'jammer' - December 2004 - Northampton News

A Northamptonshire motorist has become the first person in Britain to be arrested for using an electronic jammer to confuse speed traps.
The driver was found with a laser diffuser device fitted to his BMW vehicle by Police officers after a tip off from the Northamptonshire Safety Camera Partnership after the vehicle had been through a number of speed traps and officers were unable to take a speed reading when the vehicle was clearly driving in excess of the legal speed limit.

"The partnership will not tolerate the use of such diffuser devices" Sergeant Gary Smart, Northamptonshire Police

The gadget, which is also known as the LRC 100 Laser Diffuser, works by alerting the driver to laser speed detectors and temporarily stopping it from taking a speed-reading. The car had been recorded speeding on sixteen different occasions around Northamptonshire and the Buckinghamshire area. However, a reading of how fast it was travelling could not be obtained because the jammer device interfered with the detectors. "The motorist in question has since been arrested for perverting the course of justice and has admitted the offence," said Sergeant Gary Smart from Northamptonshire Police. "The partnerships will not tolerate the use of such diffuser devices.

Speed cameras are used throughout the force area "Clearly people using devices of this sort have the inclination to drive without due regard for speed limits, and are obstructing officers in the course of their duty," he added.
In the Northamptonshire Police force area there are 39 static speed camera sites and 41 traffic signal sites.
An additional 103 mobile sites with 11 mobile units are also used to catch speeding motorists.
Sophisticated devices to stop the cameras from taking speed-readings can be bought from specialist websites.
They work by flashing a strong laser signal to the speed detector, which causes a temporary error in the equipment and prevents a speed-reading being taken. The use of such devices is extremely dangerous.


John Rowling, Safety Camera Partnership "While the legislation has been passed making it illegal to use radar diffusers, there is currently no legislation in place regarding the laser devices," said John Rowling from the Northamptonshire Safety Camera Partnership. "Although the government are looking at this important issue. "The use of such devices is extremely dangerous as it gives the motorist licence to drive at inappropriate speeds, putting the safety of other road users at risk.
"I hope this arrest acts as a clear warning to those using such devices to enable them to drive in excess of the legal speed limit," he added.



pdV6

16,439 posts

147 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
DOT said:
Analysis of casualty statistics in Great Britain has shown excessive speed to be a contributory factor in 28% of all collisions that result in a fatality.

I don't ferkin' believe it! The old 1/3 lie gets trotted out once again

Bedford Rascal

29,133 posts

130 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Kentish said:
It defines such devices as a device one or more of whose purposes is to interfere with or detect the operation of equipment used to assess the speed of motor vehicles.
I guess that rodgers the "garage door" line too then?

Kentish

Original Poster:

14,874 posts

120 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
I know and my point being that "Perverting Justice" is an indictable offence (Crown Court only and very expensive).

Not to mention the possible 7 year jail sentence.

Just thought I'd share this with the PH collective since it's a huge risk to take and easily detectable.

the Bib have had the camera equipment software modified to photograph any vehicle that throw up an error, any error. When the video is checked at the camera units base and an error is reported, the event is logged as a warning flag on the PNC database.

When another camera van operator takes his video back to base to check over, if he discovers an error he will check on the PNC database to see if there are any warning flags on that vehicle.

If there are no flags on the PNC for that car then one is added. If the PNC has a flag on it saying they have had a problem in the past they will investigate further.

pdV6

16,439 posts

147 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
So - all the more reason to use such devices prudently, i.e. get the warning, scrub some speed, disconnect and allow "them" to get a reading under the limit...
Advertisement

Bedford Rascal

29,133 posts

130 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Time to figure out a cheap way of having your car registered on foreign plates methinks.

Sort it all in one fell swoop?

pdV6

16,439 posts

147 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Bedford Rascal said:
Time to figure out a cheap way of having your car registered on foreign plates methinks.

Sort it all in one fell swoop?

The cheaper way (and frighteningly prevalent one) would be to knock up some plates with a false number on. No - that couldn't possibly work, as we're not "allowed" to do that

Bedford Rascal

29,133 posts

130 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
No, I mean actually legally have your car registered somewhere in Europe, buy insurance europe wide etc....

Above board, but below the belt. Now which political party does that remind me of?

woodies92

7,857 posts

112 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
I think you can still use your 'garage door opener' as opening garage doors is the only purpose. Blocking radar is more like a side effect

Boosted LS1

13,636 posts

146 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
A bit of mud on yer plate goes a long way and it's only a 30 fine if you ever see a bib car. It's the most viable solution omho.

As for the jammer, so long as you aren't stupid, drive sensibly it is just like a liscense protection device. They are out to scare people with talk like this. I'd buy one tomorrow if I could afford it.

Boosted.

stackmonkey

4,914 posts

135 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Welcome Woodies92

Good first post!

Zod

26,839 posts

144 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Kentish said:
I know and my point being that "Perverting Justice" is an indictable offence (Crown Court only and very expensive).

Not to mention the possible 7 year jail sentence.

Just thought I'd share this with the PH collective since it's a huge risk to take and easily detectable.

the Bib have had the camera equipment software modified to photograph any vehicle that throw up an error, any error. When the video is checked at the camera units base and an error is reported, the event is logged as a warning flag on the PNC database.

When another camera van operator takes his video back to base to check over, if he discovers an error he will check on the PNC database to see if there are any warning flags on that vehicle.

If there are no flags on the PNC for that car then one is added. If the PNC has a flag on it saying they have had a problem in the past they will investigate further.
It is also highly unlikely that the CPS would succeed with a contested prosecution, particularly in a case where the defendant was not in fact speeding. If you are not speeding, then you are not committing an offence, so the laser jammer is not being used to inhibit the detection of an offence. Thereofer youy are not guilty of attempting to pervert the course of justice. A first year barrister would be quite confident of defending that one.

If, on the other hand, a driver were to be observed continually driving through laser speed traps at speeds obviously in excess of the limit, but without producing a reading thanks to the operationof his jammer, then it would be clear that he was deliberately using the jammer in an attempt to prevent the detection of his offence and he would most likely suffer the consequences.

More difficult would be the case of the driver who had a garage door which opened automatically through the agency of the door opener/laser jammer, who might inadvertently have been just in excess of the limit when he drove though a speed trap without giving a reading because his opener/jammer jammed the gun.

fid

2,403 posts

126 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Bedford Rascal said:
No, I mean actually legally have your car registered somewhere in Europe, buy insurance europe wide etc...

Above board, but below the belt...
Only above board for 3 months iirc...then you have either take it out of the country or register it in this country. Euro trip every 3 months, anyone?

parrot of doom

23,075 posts

120 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
pdV6 said:

DOT said:
Analysis of casualty statistics in Great Britain has shown excessive speed to be a contributory factor in 28% of all collisions that result in a fatality.


I don't ferkin' believe it! The old 1/3 lie gets trotted out once again


Don't you know, speed is a contributory factor in all accidents! Just drive at 0mph and you're perfectly safe - unless a pedestrian trips over your bonnet, in which case its jailtime for you!


I hope the fella concered pleads not guilty - there is nothing yet illegal about having a laser diffuser on your car, and the 'perverting cause of justice' case is as yet, unproven.

love machine

7,609 posts

121 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Simple solution, go and destroy as many cameras as you can.

The powers that be don't listen, they won't even listen when speed cameras fall, it will inconvenience them and make their revenue raising more tricky. You've got to stand up and act for your beliefs, merely writing letters about the injustice will change nothing. Blow the things up.

Edit:- Plod, for the record, I am absolutely all talk and have no intention of following my own foolish, emotional advice.

>> Edited by love machine on Tuesday 7th June 19:23

Nevin

2,996 posts

147 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Bedford Rascal said:
No, I mean actually legally have your car registered somewhere in Europe, buy insurance europe wide etc....

Above board, but below the belt. Now which political party does that remind me of?


Well, given the number of Latvian registered cars in my part of London (and I'm talking dozens if not hundreds) it seems like quite a few people are already doing something along these lines.

Of course, they could all be Latvians legitimately here for a nice holiday!!

simpo two

59,959 posts

151 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
DOT said:
Analysis of casualty statistics in Great Britain has shown excessive speed to be a contributory factor in 28% of all collisions that result in a fatality.

'Excessive speed' is technically nothing to do with breaking the speed limit. But try telling the people who run our lives that.

That's how Essex CC managed to say that '75% of accidents were caused by speeding'. IE if you have an accident at 1 mph over the latest ridiculous limit (the kind where they take a road that's been 60 since the dawn of time and slap a 40 on it, and you get caught at 41), your accident is caused by 'speeding'.

To anyone with an IQ of 100+, or without a political agenda, it's clearly w*nk.

voiceofdoom

21 posts

112 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Just thought you guys would like to know that within 6 years (3 years for new vehicles) all motor vehicles in the UK will be electronically tagged with a transmitter that broadcasts your cars VIN number every 5 seconds, 24 hours a day for 10 years (self powered).

Readers are currently being installed on EVERY motorway junction, petrol station and in every police car.

The plans have also been drawn up for the central computer centre.

The fixed site readers are a white box about 20cm cubed (easily hidden), and can read a cars ID at over 200mph. Initially they will be located with the ANPR cameras you see on motorway bridges (Automatic Number Plate Readers) and will have time delayed information relay. But sooner rather than later a GPRS real-time system of data capture will be implemented.

Currently there is no way to jam or corrupt the signal or forge a false signal that the transmitter emits and it will be instantly and extremely visibly obvious if you remove the transmitter from your car.

The setup costs (reader network and tagging all cars) is zero to the government - private investors will fork up the cash in return for various revenue opportunities the system offers. All R&D is complete, fields test done, systems checked ... it could start tomorrow.

Welcome to big brother - its happening NOW, sadly.
(unless the british public do something about it).

Digital

405 posts

118 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Boosted LS1 said:
A bit of mud on yer plate goes a long way and it's only a 30 fine if you ever see a bib car.


www.sprayonmud.com/

branflakes

2,037 posts

124 months

[news] 
Tuesday 7th June 2005 quote quote all
Kentish said:
Clause 17 of the Road Safety Bill gives the Secretary of State the power to prohibit the fitting of, or the use of vehicles carrying, speed assessment equipment detection devices. It defines such devices as a device one or more of whose purposes is to interfere with or detect the operation of equipment used to assess the speed of motor vehicles.


Does this mean you can't look at your speedometer?
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