LS7 on the Dyno
Discussion
Got lucky! The LS7 is a beautiful powerplant, but the ECU and harness just doesn't exist for the it yet, except for one...and that was originally designed for boats. So, it doesn't have the granular control of a sophisticated system.
However, there's a company called BigStuff3 that makes an aftermarket electronic fuel injection system which is very popular with the LSx crowd. The owner (John) is credited with starting two previous successful ventures; "DFI" (now Accel DFI) and "F.A.S.T." (Fuel Air Spark Tech). BigStuff is his third such EFI company.
Another company, Wheel-2-Wheel Powertrain, has close connection to the Special Vehicles Division of General Motors. It's 47,000 square feet of powertrain toys. Check their website for more info.
My LS7 is in Michigan and is being hooked up to one of the four dynos at W2W. John, from BS3, will install and tune the new ECU and harness.
I know...I know... I should have them change the cam, or drop in some forged, low-comp pistons and/or throw a blower/turbo on there. But, not this time. There are some minor mods, but not power-related. I am sure the GTR will be absurd with stock LS7 power.
So, I should have a dyno sheet before too long. Of course, I will put it up. Oh...baby!
>> Edited by builder on Friday 13th January 16:08
However, there's a company called BigStuff3 that makes an aftermarket electronic fuel injection system which is very popular with the LSx crowd. The owner (John) is credited with starting two previous successful ventures; "DFI" (now Accel DFI) and "F.A.S.T." (Fuel Air Spark Tech). BigStuff is his third such EFI company.
Another company, Wheel-2-Wheel Powertrain, has close connection to the Special Vehicles Division of General Motors. It's 47,000 square feet of powertrain toys. Check their website for more info.
My LS7 is in Michigan and is being hooked up to one of the four dynos at W2W. John, from BS3, will install and tune the new ECU and harness.
I know...I know... I should have them change the cam, or drop in some forged, low-comp pistons and/or throw a blower/turbo on there. But, not this time. There are some minor mods, but not power-related. I am sure the GTR will be absurd with stock LS7 power.
So, I should have a dyno sheet before too long. Of course, I will put it up. Oh...baby!
>> Edited by builder on Friday 13th January 16:08
builder you have some of the most highly respected LSx guys working on your engine!!! i have only heard good things about both of them! the workmanship (that i have seen) from W2W is simple amazing!
all you need now is one of there twin Rotex SC system! hehe
on a more serious note, one tuner (can't remember the name) has seen over 650bhp at the crank on a LS7 (with new forged pistons)! so i recon you could get atleast 600bhp at the crankl out the thing! what are you aiming for????
thnaks Chris.
all you need now is one of there twin Rotex SC system! hehe
on a more serious note, one tuner (can't remember the name) has seen over 650bhp at the crank on a LS7 (with new forged pistons)! so i recon you could get atleast 600bhp at the crankl out the thing! what are you aiming for????
thnaks Chris.
peterpsg said:That's an interesting point. Regarding emissions testing in the USA, in particular in California, a test includes passing a visual inspection to verify the the "manufacturer's emissions equipment" is intact. That visual equipment inspection extends to headers, oyxgen sensors, cats, intake (Of course, in CA, they have special provisions for "Home Build" cars.)
If you're intent on keeping it fairly stock, are you going to try and keep it compatable with emissions spec or ...?
I'm sure if there was a drop in, emissions compatable, LS7 setup, it'd be a popular alternative to AS, and the like.
Also, all vehicles 1996 and newer are required to use an OBD-II computer. Inspections on OBD-II cars (my experience only) don't test the gasses at the tail-pipe. They just plug diagnostic equipment into the OBD-II port and read the information while running the engine. So, it may be a challenge to get (even the best, cleanest-burning engine) through without fail. I imagine the "manuracturer" has some major hoops to jump through, with the EPA (environmental protection agency), to have their emissions system approved.
There are three options available to me in Nevada:
1) License the GTR in a region that has no testing. Luckily, I have a home for rent in such an area. So, that is an easy first option. However, if I sell that home, the challenge remains.
2) License the GTR with an old engine that requires no testing. Then, file a form indicating that an engine swap was performed. This may also be a good option, as there would be no subsequent testing required.
3) Take an old vehicle, weld some of the components to the GTR (i.e. a piced of chassis with the serial numbers), and register as that vehicle. I was thinking VW.
G Man said:Wheel-2-Wheel helped with that car. You may be aware of the C5-R block which was the parent to the LS7. Jay's (rear-wheel-drive) Toronado engine is apparently a step between the C5-R and the LS7 while along the development path.
I was looking at this engine today at the Autosports show very impressive, I read on the internet that Jay Leno was given one for a hot rod and that Chevy found a hot cam for him and found 600 bhp easily
Have aftermarket cams become available yet ?
Yes, there are a couple of companies testing and selling new grinds. There are also three GM Hot Cams available...the biggest was dyno'd and made 600 BHP.
The issue for the guys with a Z06 is programming. Nobody has a product offering (yet) to modify the programming in the new PCM. Same is true for an LS2 made after 9/1/05, as it uses the same hardware. So, an aftermarket PCM is the only way to go right now.
Looking forward to the results Scott. I wish I had known it was at W2W. That's only like 20 min from my house. I should stop by and check it out (if they let me in). I was at the open house that they had before the Woodward cruise. Very nice set-up there. And nice guys that work there. All were very friendly and full of information. The coolest thing was hearing a Daytona Race Car tuning on their Chassis Dyno. Couldn't help but crack a smile every time that beast went WOT. Same went for the crowd of us at their engine dynos every time one was run on test.
Adding to the above... The stock programming (and PCM, which I have here in a box with no programming in it) also requires the presence of another computer; the body control module. So, to use the stock PCM to run the engine stand-alone the BCM has to be programmed out of the PCM along with the anti-theft stuff. And, the stock throttle body is electronic (fly-by-wire), which requires the use of electronics on the loud peddle. So, I am switching to a mechanical TB as well.
builder said:
Yes, someone told me the Delphi MEFI-4B is "bank", but I think it can do both. Mine will be sequential.
Afaik it's bank/batch but maybe it's evolved
It could be ok to fire the stock injectors twice and save buying bigger if it's mappable. How mappable do you think these will be or will they be plug and play? Will you have MAF? Boosted.
Boosted Ls1 said:I think the "M" in MEFI stands for Multiport, thus the batch/bank mode. But, I don't have any direct-use experience with them. The general comments have indicated that the MEFI might not deliver as smooth an idle, the same economy, or offer the drivability of other LSx-specific systems (or the stock PCM). But, at WOT, there's no difference. You might ask Jeff Schwartz about the MEFI. I know there are some guys successfully running the LS7 with it.
Yes, someone told me the Delphi MEFI-4B is "bank", but I think it can do both. Mine will be sequential.
Afaik it's bank/batch but maybe it's evolved
Boosted.
The BS3 system is MAF-less. It does use MAP, though, and wide-band oxygen sensors. Here's a link to the Gen3 (older) manual.
Boosted Ls1 said:Turns out the system can be run in either Speed Density mode (MAP-based) or in Alpha-N (TPS-based). Don't ask what Alpha-N is. Maybe someone can tell me!
Will you have MAF?
The BigStuff3 ECU and harness installation was successful tonight. I don't have the dyno sheet yet, but she made 548 HP @ 6100 and 529 ft/lbs from 4.7 to 4.9k. If my notes are correct, she made 400 ft/lbs at 3k! All standard-corrected numbers. WooooHoooo!
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