Discussion
Hey all.
I'm in need of some advice or assistance.
I bought a sagaris last july, she came with 1 yrs 'warranty' which cost somewhere in the region of £2000.
Althought the warranty company has settled two previous, smaller claims i am at loggerheads at the moment and have been since may when the engine 'went'.
I have had three different correspondence giving three different reasons 'why' the engine has failed: low or no lubricant, fuel contamination and the bearings have worn out, each time ending with "in view of this we regret we cannot accept your claim" dispite two independent inspections on the engine, one of which was carried out by the warranty company themselves.
I offered to the warranty company any help to solve this situation in the form of oil samples and a full ecu inspection, both of which were turned down???
The car and engine has covered just 10k, and after speaking to numerous people in 'tvr' land this is not down to "wear and tear".
The inspection i had undertake suggested the engine bearings had gone. When i spoke to the engineer about this he said it was not due to "wear and tear", dispite all this the company refuse to budge.
ANY IDEAS???????????
thanks
leigh
I'm in need of some advice or assistance.
I bought a sagaris last july, she came with 1 yrs 'warranty' which cost somewhere in the region of £2000.
Althought the warranty company has settled two previous, smaller claims i am at loggerheads at the moment and have been since may when the engine 'went'.
I have had three different correspondence giving three different reasons 'why' the engine has failed: low or no lubricant, fuel contamination and the bearings have worn out, each time ending with "in view of this we regret we cannot accept your claim" dispite two independent inspections on the engine, one of which was carried out by the warranty company themselves.
I offered to the warranty company any help to solve this situation in the form of oil samples and a full ecu inspection, both of which were turned down???
The car and engine has covered just 10k, and after speaking to numerous people in 'tvr' land this is not down to "wear and tear".
The inspection i had undertake suggested the engine bearings had gone. When i spoke to the engineer about this he said it was not due to "wear and tear", dispite all this the company refuse to budge.
ANY IDEAS???????????
thanks
leigh
mrleigh said:
Hey all.
I'm in need of some advice or assistance.
I bought a sagaris last july, she came with 1 yrs 'warranty' which cost somewhere in the region of £2000.
Althought the warranty company has settled two previous, smaller claims i am at loggerheads at the moment and have been since may when the engine 'went'.
I have had three different correspondence giving three different reasons 'why' the engine has failed: low or no lubricant, fuel contamination and the bearings have worn out, each time ending with "in view of this we regret we cannot accept your claim" dispite two independent inspections on the engine, one of which was carried out by the warranty company themselves.
I offered to the warranty company any help to solve this situation in the form of oil samples and a full ecu inspection, both of which were turned down???
The car and engine has covered just 10k, and after speaking to numerous people in 'tvr' land this is not down to "wear and tear".
The inspection i had undertake suggested the engine bearings had gone. When i spoke to the engineer about this he said it was not due to "wear and tear", dispite all this the company refuse to budge.
ANY IDEAS???????????
thanks
leigh
There are specialist engineers who, for a fee, will examine the engine and be able to determine the precise cause of failure whether it be overheating, lack of oil or whatever. Armed with their report it should be relatively easy to persuade the warrant company to honour their obligations always assuming the cause was not down to the operator!I'm in need of some advice or assistance.
I bought a sagaris last july, she came with 1 yrs 'warranty' which cost somewhere in the region of £2000.
Althought the warranty company has settled two previous, smaller claims i am at loggerheads at the moment and have been since may when the engine 'went'.
I have had three different correspondence giving three different reasons 'why' the engine has failed: low or no lubricant, fuel contamination and the bearings have worn out, each time ending with "in view of this we regret we cannot accept your claim" dispite two independent inspections on the engine, one of which was carried out by the warranty company themselves.
I offered to the warranty company any help to solve this situation in the form of oil samples and a full ecu inspection, both of which were turned down???
The car and engine has covered just 10k, and after speaking to numerous people in 'tvr' land this is not down to "wear and tear".
The inspection i had undertake suggested the engine bearings had gone. When i spoke to the engineer about this he said it was not due to "wear and tear", dispite all this the company refuse to budge.
ANY IDEAS???????????
thanks
leigh
Willtvr, did you actually read my post?
i've had two conflicting reports we know the problem with the engine, both my engineer and the warranty company agree on bearing failure!!!
Only the warranty company are suggesting "wear and tear" after 10k, so more expense and another report would be useless, but thanks for your input.
As far as it being an operator fault, i dont follow???
Thanks claire i'll pop down to ian's place over the weekend, let me know when your there.
i've had two conflicting reports we know the problem with the engine, both my engineer and the warranty company agree on bearing failure!!!
Only the warranty company are suggesting "wear and tear" after 10k, so more expense and another report would be useless, but thanks for your input.
As far as it being an operator fault, i dont follow???
Thanks claire i'll pop down to ian's place over the weekend, let me know when your there.
Judging from your unnecessarily sarcastic response to willtvr you also need to improve your communication skills.
I read and re-read your original post and would reiterate every word of advice he has given you. In fact I wonder whether you actually read HIS post.
You refer to... dispite two independent inspections on the engine, one of which was carried out by the warranty company themselves. So that's your idea of an "independent" inspection is it?
willtvr advised that a specialised engineer would "...be able to determine the precise cause of failure whether it be overheating, lack of oil or whatever." He was NOT suggesting yet another report stating that the bearings had gone but rather and authoritive report into the cause of the failure.
You see you have asked for "ANY IDEAS" but have not considered what has been suggested.
Here's another idea for you. Concentrate on the report / correspondence citing "the bearings have worn out" then ask yourself if it's 'reasonable' that the bearings should wear out after so little milage. Then ask the warrantee company the same question and if such a happening fails any test of reasonableness it is an unexpected event, PRECISELY the very thing from which the warrantee is designed to protect you.
I read and re-read your original post and would reiterate every word of advice he has given you. In fact I wonder whether you actually read HIS post.
You refer to... dispite two independent inspections on the engine, one of which was carried out by the warranty company themselves. So that's your idea of an "independent" inspection is it?
willtvr advised that a specialised engineer would "...be able to determine the precise cause of failure whether it be overheating, lack of oil or whatever." He was NOT suggesting yet another report stating that the bearings had gone but rather and authoritive report into the cause of the failure.
You see you have asked for "ANY IDEAS" but have not considered what has been suggested.
Here's another idea for you. Concentrate on the report / correspondence citing "the bearings have worn out" then ask yourself if it's 'reasonable' that the bearings should wear out after so little milage. Then ask the warrantee company the same question and if such a happening fails any test of reasonableness it is an unexpected event, PRECISELY the very thing from which the warrantee is designed to protect you.
Bearings ordinarily don't wear out in 10k miles unless there's a fault .. this therefore suggests the bearing failure will be the symptom not the cause. You need to determine the cause of the bearing failure, and the suggestion of the independent report above is a very very good one.
I can't see how any road car engine can do a set of ends in 10k through wear and tear. The warranty people will think the same and will be looking for a reason caused by you to get them out of paying. If the car has not done a lot of miles since it was sold in perfect (?) working order that might start some alarm bells ringing. Not accusing, just stating the obvious.
The three "different" correspondence you have from the other side may not be so different. Anything that compromises oil pressure can result in the ends going. Oil contamination can result in low oil pressure or low wear protection. Low oil pressure due to no oil etc will do the same, so the three may not be so different.
From your side, it is all very well having someone look at the bits and say the ends are gone, anyone can do that. What you actually need is someone with some credibility (eg someone who rebuilds S6 engines for a living you have no connection with) to look at the bits and say this engine has failed because of “………..”. I suspect this is what the others above are saying.
Depending on that outcome you then go back to them and say this is why it failed, it is covered under the terms of your warranty and you either cough up £???? or we go to court.
Is the car still in bits or has it been rebuilt and you have a bill for the finished job? If it is still in bits there is no way this period of time is reasonable by any standards but it isn’t the first time it has happened.
Hope you get it sorted, good luck.
The three "different" correspondence you have from the other side may not be so different. Anything that compromises oil pressure can result in the ends going. Oil contamination can result in low oil pressure or low wear protection. Low oil pressure due to no oil etc will do the same, so the three may not be so different.
From your side, it is all very well having someone look at the bits and say the ends are gone, anyone can do that. What you actually need is someone with some credibility (eg someone who rebuilds S6 engines for a living you have no connection with) to look at the bits and say this engine has failed because of “………..”. I suspect this is what the others above are saying.
Depending on that outcome you then go back to them and say this is why it failed, it is covered under the terms of your warranty and you either cough up £???? or we go to court.
Is the car still in bits or has it been rebuilt and you have a bill for the finished job? If it is still in bits there is no way this period of time is reasonable by any standards but it isn’t the first time it has happened.
Hope you get it sorted, good luck.
mrleigh said:
Willtvr, did you actually read my post?
i've had two conflicting reports we know the problem with the engine, both my engineer and the warranty company agree on bearing failure!!!
Only the warranty company are suggesting "wear and tear" after 10k, so more expense and another report would be useless, but thanks for your input.
As far as it being an operator fault, i dont follow???
Thanks claire i'll pop down to ian's place over the weekend, let me know when your there.
Did you read mine? There is more than one reason for bearing failure, you don't say what it was. Maybe your engineer didn't know? Depending on the reason it could be construed as operator error as, for example,you are responsible for making sure there is sufficient oil in the system amazing though that may seem. i've had two conflicting reports we know the problem with the engine, both my engineer and the warranty company agree on bearing failure!!!
Only the warranty company are suggesting "wear and tear" after 10k, so more expense and another report would be useless, but thanks for your input.
As far as it being an operator fault, i dont follow???
Thanks claire i'll pop down to ian's place over the weekend, let me know when your there.
I have been in a similar situation and a report defining the exact cause of failure saved me thousands. If you need to involve a lawyer just do it but make sure of the facts first.
I've found when asking for help on here that a non-agressive response is more acceptable all round.
Thanks again lads, all help welcome.
Think its a solicitor i need now not another report, as i stated in my original thread i've had two INDEPENDENT reports, one carried out by an inpenpendent assessor on behalf of the warranty company (they cant inspect it them selves, obviously!)gave the cause as low or no lubrication, and in a second letter said a fuel contamination was the cause. Since the warranty company will not take a sample of oil or test the ecu, this 'theory' cannot be used to reject the claim. The other carried out by another independent assessor on behalf of straight six, a company based in oxon gives the view: "no evidence found of excessive oil consumption in the form of(typical) heavy carbon deposits in the combustion spaces, exhaust ports or valves, or of any blow-by and tarnish of piston skirts".
I would have thought the latter inspection was 'specialist' enough!
sacastic or not i'm not a muppet i know engines need oil to run, and i'm pretty confident i know where the dip stick is and how to use it.
Thanks again
Think its a solicitor i need now not another report, as i stated in my original thread i've had two INDEPENDENT reports, one carried out by an inpenpendent assessor on behalf of the warranty company (they cant inspect it them selves, obviously!)gave the cause as low or no lubrication, and in a second letter said a fuel contamination was the cause. Since the warranty company will not take a sample of oil or test the ecu, this 'theory' cannot be used to reject the claim. The other carried out by another independent assessor on behalf of straight six, a company based in oxon gives the view: "no evidence found of excessive oil consumption in the form of(typical) heavy carbon deposits in the combustion spaces, exhaust ports or valves, or of any blow-by and tarnish of piston skirts".
I would have thought the latter inspection was 'specialist' enough!
sacastic or not i'm not a muppet i know engines need oil to run, and i'm pretty confident i know where the dip stick is and how to use it.
Thanks again
mrleigh said:
I would have thought the latter inspection was 'specialist' enough!
sacastic or not i'm not a muppet i know engines need oil to run, and i'm pretty confident i know where the dip stick is and how to use it.
Thanks again
Yep, sounds like you know it all mate. If your attitude with the warranty company was anything like the one shown here I'm not surprised you're having a hard time. Enjoy your new engine and hope it lasts longer than the first one. sacastic or not i'm not a muppet i know engines need oil to run, and i'm pretty confident i know where the dip stick is and how to use it.
Thanks again
OK, I will step in now - Leigh isnt a muppet and has had 2 inspections, one on behalf of the warranty company and one via Straight-Six (a true independent) they have both given differnt reasons for the engine failure.
I know a little bit of the history through talking with Leigh offline, he is very very meticulous with the TVR and knows the importance of keeping it maintained.
Unforuntatly its gone bang
and like another good friend of mine is having trouble with the warranty company paying out (and we all know they hate to do that). I think the suggestion of getting a solicitor is a good one and thats the next step.
If anyone can give possible reasons for the failures that have been stated, please do so, any background help is invaluable.
Shame this has dragged on for so long - I am sure Leigh just wants this sorted and his Sagaris back as we all would in his position.
If you are not going to play nice then I will have to round you all up and put you in the ring with various size handbags
Claire
I know a little bit of the history through talking with Leigh offline, he is very very meticulous with the TVR and knows the importance of keeping it maintained.
Unforuntatly its gone bang
and like another good friend of mine is having trouble with the warranty company paying out (and we all know they hate to do that). I think the suggestion of getting a solicitor is a good one and thats the next step.If anyone can give possible reasons for the failures that have been stated, please do so, any background help is invaluable.
Shame this has dragged on for so long - I am sure Leigh just wants this sorted and his Sagaris back as we all would in his position.
If you are not going to play nice then I will have to round you all up and put you in the ring with various size handbags
Claire
Gaffer said:
OK, I will step in now - Leigh isnt a muppet and has had 2 inspections, one on behalf of the warranty company and one via Straight-Six (a true independent) they have both given differnt reasons for the engine failure.
I know a little bit of the history through talking with Leigh offline, he is very very meticulous with the TVR and knows the importance of keeping it maintained.
Unforuntatly its gone bang and like another good friend of mine is having trouble with the warranty company paying out (and we all know they hate to do that). I think the suggestion of getting a solicitor is a good one and thats the next step.
If anyone can give possible reasons for the failures that have been stated, please do so, any background help is invaluable.
Shame this has dragged on for so long - I am sure Leigh just wants this sorted and his Sagaris back as we all would in his position.
If you are not going to play nice then I will have to round you all up and put you in the ring with various size handbags
Claire
Fair enough Claire but nobody suggested he was a muppet whatever that might entail. Genuine advice was offered and he instantly resorted to sarcasm. Can't imagine why he has dragged his heels for so long anyway particularly considering he is not a muppet. I know a little bit of the history through talking with Leigh offline, he is very very meticulous with the TVR and knows the importance of keeping it maintained.
Unforuntatly its gone bang
and like another good friend of mine is having trouble with the warranty company paying out (and we all know they hate to do that). I think the suggestion of getting a solicitor is a good one and thats the next step.If anyone can give possible reasons for the failures that have been stated, please do so, any background help is invaluable.
Shame this has dragged on for so long - I am sure Leigh just wants this sorted and his Sagaris back as we all would in his position.
If you are not going to play nice then I will have to round you all up and put you in the ring with various size handbags
Claire
No worries Will. Sometimes the problem is you can read things wrong on a forum and take it the wrong way - I know I have (yes I know its unbeleivable 
)
Its taken this long I guess, knowing warranty companies etc, that they are slow to report on the findings, then the garages are also doing other things as well and before you know it 6/12 months have passed. Leigh has been patient up till now but I guess is fast running out.
So back to the thread, he has had 2 inspections, next step solicitors
now does anyone have info on why the 2 failures mentions could happen..?
Claire
)Its taken this long I guess, knowing warranty companies etc, that they are slow to report on the findings, then the garages are also doing other things as well and before you know it 6/12 months have passed. Leigh has been patient up till now but I guess is fast running out.
So back to the thread, he has had 2 inspections, next step solicitors
now does anyone have info on why the 2 failures mentions could happen..?Claire
Hey claire nice to hear your input on this matter, hows the clutch?
WILLTVR: i'm not one to drag my heels, i cant scream and shout i've got to go through the proper channels.
The proper channels are a slow process and i have to keep persisting, the only option left is to take my relevent evidence to a lawyer and see from a legal point of view if the warranty company have acted illegaly
This muppets got more aces up his sleeve!!!
Thanks for all the advice lads/ladies
WILLTVR: i'm not one to drag my heels, i cant scream and shout i've got to go through the proper channels.
The proper channels are a slow process and i have to keep persisting, the only option left is to take my relevent evidence to a lawyer and see from a legal point of view if the warranty company have acted illegaly
This muppets got more aces up his sleeve!!!
Thanks for all the advice lads/ladies
If you are going to take the legal route you will need evidence of the cause of bearing failure as previously advised otherwise you'll be on a hiding to nothing. It sounds as if everyone is agreed its bearing failure, the question is why? However your lawyer will no doubt give you similar advice, but not free of charge I suspect.
Leigh,
I will suggest you do a search through the threads, a few have suffered from IIRC the half time bearing - eHasler is one. That should also give you some ammo (if it is the half time bearing). I would also get onto Dom @ Power as he knows about these things and if you get it rebuilt by him you also get warranty for any further failures (within a specific timeframe obviously).
Clutch is fine
Claire
I will suggest you do a search through the threads, a few have suffered from IIRC the half time bearing - eHasler is one. That should also give you some ammo (if it is the half time bearing). I would also get onto Dom @ Power as he knows about these things and if you get it rebuilt by him you also get warranty for any further failures (within a specific timeframe obviously).
Clutch is fine
Claire
Spoke to the assessor i comissioned, today and the bearing failure is the root cause of the engine problem.
Nothing has caused the big end bearing to fail, they have just failed.
Due to his finding in the engine, this is a sudden event and not a progressive failure.
He's detailing a comprehensive report to outline everything he found in his inspection to put to my lawyer.
So fingers crossed!!!
Nothing has caused the big end bearing to fail, they have just failed.
Due to his finding in the engine, this is a sudden event and not a progressive failure.
He's detailing a comprehensive report to outline everything he found in his inspection to put to my lawyer.
So fingers crossed!!!
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