Tuesday 13th January 2009

Detroit '09: Fisker Karma S

The atmosphere is electric at the Detroit Show...

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Detroit may have once been home to the muscle car, but these days oomph seems to be measured in volts and not horses. Everyone at the Detroit show was clambering to show off their green credentials and new manufacturer Fisker was no exception.

The Karma plug-in hybrid saloon has been around for a while but this time the company was showing off an SL-rival in the form of the Karma S. It is a hardtop/convertible. The good news is it could sell for as little as £60,000, boasts a lightweight aluminium spaceframe chassis and is RWD.

As well as a 260bhp 2.0-litre petrol engine there is an electric motor in the back and a number of lithium ion batteries, which arguably gives you the best of all worlds. It all amounts to 397bhp, which gives the car a 0-60mph figure of 5.8 seconds and a top speed of 125mph.

In terms of range the car can cover 50 miles in ‘stealth mode’ – battery-powered only – and is equivalent to 100mpg. There are also varying modes the car can be used in that should provide decent mpg matched with strong performance.

It is not clear yet whether the Fisker will come to the UK but RHD is being considered.

Thanks to EcoGeek for the vid

[Ex Boy Racer]

Nice looking car. Wonder how difficult it would be to drop a big block V8 into it?

[BlueEyedBoy]

I can't wait till this and the saloon version are released.

[Skinner.Daddy]

That is one of the nicest convertibles available on the market today

[zcacogp]

397bhp and 0-60 of 5.8 seconds? That must be either a massively peaky power delivery or a HUGELY heavy car.

Given that over 100bhp of that is from the motor (as opposed to engine), therefore flat torque 'curve', it cannot be that peaky.

So ... how much does this puppy weigh?


Oli.

[kambites]

zcacogp said:

Given that over 100bhp of that is from the motor (as opposed to engine), therefore flat torque 'curve', it cannot be that peaky.

Depends on how the motor is geared. If the electric motor is running through a single gear ratio with peak power coming at, say, 150mph, it's only generating 40% power at 60mph. Say acceleration is linear, the electric motor is, on average, generating 20% of peak power on the 0-60 dash - or about 20bhp?

If the motor is connected the engine side of the gearbox, then I'd agree that it must be a heavy bd though.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 13th January 13:04

[BlueCello]

Looks a bit like the DB9 Volante. This is a good thing.

[GTRene]

I welcome this sort of cars, lovely shape and better fot all.

[tomTVR]

Lovely looking thing, such a shame they are pissing about with electric motors. Lets have a V8 and it would be epic.

[FestivAli]

The convertible looks simply amazing - the car the Ferrari California should have been. Actually, if it had the Ferrari engine, it would be amazing. Given that Fisker is a coachbuilder as well, I wonder what the possibilities of this combination are? Not that I have anything against electric drivetrains - the Cadillac Converj, Chrysler 200C and the production Karma sedan are all evidence that we are heading in a desirable direction (provided you buy renewable energy to your household when you charge them, and don't drive more than 40-odd miles a day). I'm hoping that the various auto manufacturers don't go bust so that these cars can be made en masse.

Ali.

[theluckyman]

zcacogp said:

397bhp and 0-60 of 5.8 seconds? That must be either a massively peaky power delivery or a HUGELY heavy car.

Given that over 100bhp of that is from the motor (as opposed to engine), therefore flat torque 'curve', it cannot be that peaky.

So ... how much does this puppy weigh?


Oli.

The batteries add a lot of weight - from memory the Karma is just over 2000kg total - the benefit is the torque from a standstill

Cheers

[TUS 373]

theluckyman said:

zcacogp said:

397bhp and 0-60 of 5.8 seconds? That must be either a massively peaky power delivery or a HUGELY heavy car.

Given that over 100bhp of that is from the motor (as opposed to engine), therefore flat torque 'curve', it cannot be that peaky.

So ... how much does this puppy weigh?


Oli.

The batteries add a lot of weight - from memory the Karma is just over 2000kg total - the benefit is the torque from a standstill

Cheers

Lovely looking car, but 125 mph with the equivalent of around 400 bhp is not epic, even if the mpg is. I wouldn;t kick it out of my garage though!

[f111lover]

I like it. Hope it's the shape of things to come.

[winther]

Will the sound match the good looks? doubt it. Wish they would stop messing around with batteries. There are other alternatives

Edited by winther on Tuesday 13th January 15:55

[Apache]

Mighty fine looking machine that

[theluckyman]

winther said:

Will the sound match the good looks? doubt it. Wish they would stop messing around with batteries. There are other alternatives

Edited by winther on Tuesday 13th January 15:55

http://www.claverton-energy.com/
http://www.claverton-energy.com/download/289/

They aren't messing about with the batteries - we desperately need them (ok apart from maybe Saudi Arabia)

Interesting point about the sound these things could make - the efficiency and oil displacement gains are from the battery use on the boring commute/school run/trip to the shops/whatever. For a long drive or a back road you can use pretty much whatever engine you like. Fisker are using the GM 2litre turbo (similar to the VX220 and Europa?) because I think they wanted to keep costs down and wanted to share experience with GM and the Volt. I'd personally like to see DiesOtto in some form, but if you've got the cash what about a small 6, 8 or even 12 like the Italians used to build? F40 was under 3litre and the EB110 was a 3.5litre I think.

Also, I got an email from Mark Barratt at UCL. I won't repeat a commercial link here but EDF are forming a new company that lets you use public recharging points as much as you want for a flat fee of 100 quid a year.

A question - I'm an energy analyst/engineer not an automotive engineer. I suspect quite a few of you are though. What would the implications be of putting an electric motor on each wheel? Would it necessarily affect unsprung mass?

Cheers

[zcacogp]

theluckyman said:

A question - I'm an energy analyst/engineer not an automotive engineer. I suspect quite a few of you are though. What would the implications be of putting an electric motor on each wheel? Would it necessarily affect unsprung mass?

Interesting Q. Little known fact - this is where a car-making company called Porsche started, around 100 years ago ... (not what you think tho'.)

It would be possible. The unsprung mass issue would depend upon whether you put the motor outside of the suspension (in which case it would be part of the unsprung mass), or inside driving through a CV joint or similar (in which case it wouldn't be part of the unsprung mass.)

What's behind the question?


Oli.

[JPKerr]

The good news is it could sell for as little as £60,000,
I wonder what I will get trading in my C4.

[jimmyd123]

More than a hint of maserati Gran Turismo in that.

Edited by jimmyd123 on Tuesday 13th January 20:07

[Piginapoke]

Nice music. Couldn't see Bourne driving one though.

I would love so see how the costs of production of a hybrid compare to a petrol car- it is as green as claimed I wonder? Still, pretty car.

[mitch78]

BlueCello said:

Looks a bit like the DB9 Volante. This is a good thing.

It would, Henrik Fisker designed the DB9 and the Vantage.