Gen 2 997 Turbo? Is it a good idea?

[lambo_xx]

I'm currently looking for a 997 Turbo and have been looking at Gen 1 Turbos. Now I've been offered a Gen 2 Turbo with PDK, very well spec'd and I'm just wondering should I go for it?

Obviously all cars are going to depreciate but are Gen 2 Turbos likely to be very bad depreciation wise? The fact the Turbo S is out makes me think that Turbos might depreciate quite badly.

Would I be better just going for a Gen 1 Turbo at say £70k?

Thanks

[Phooey]

My 2p's worth -

I think the way to go is a 56 plate gen1 for £55k (Sutton OPC) with 2 years warranty. Yes, the gen2 (especially with PDK) is better - some say *much* better, but you are looking at £90k+. 2 - 3 years motoring will cost you £40k+ in depreciation, you are never going to lose half that in 2 years on a gen1.

Paying £70k for a gen1 . It's not going to get you anything £55k won't.

Good luck, if i could afford a gen2 PDK

Oh, and how much do you think an OPC has offered for this -

http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/1932427.htm

Eta - the link i posted above is *exclusive* of VAT. Thought it sounded a tad good value

Edited by Phooey on Saturday 14th August 21:20

[Sandy59]

That's a tough one !!
Unless you specifically want the PDK I'd be tempted to go with the gen 1, and maybe see how things pan out.
I imagine there will be quite a bit of depreciation to come on a gen 2 whether the S is out or not.
Have you considered the GT3, or are you set on a turbo ??

[Koln-RS]

Whatever contemporary car you buy it's likely to depreciate. With Porsches, new or used, I've found it tends to average around 15% pa.

Depreciation, of course, is the real cost of ownership and 15% pa on a cheaper car is going to be less than on a more expensive one - obviously.

But, we don't buy great cars to make financial sense. Life's short, so we make decisions that provide enjoyment and make us feel good.

Personally, think the GT3 is fantastic and likely to depreciate less than a Turbo. But also think the new gen 2 Turbo is a very clever piece of kit and a terrific everyday supercar. It's true that the Turbo 'S' may have compressed Turbo values, but that means there are some attractive offerings for under £100k. Just make sure you are getting all the desirable spec options (and buy an 'S' badge off ebay )

[lambo_xx]

Thanks for the help.

I agree you can get a Gen 1 Turbo for £60k but it's finding one in the right spec. As I said I'll be using the car everyday so I don't mind paying a bit more for the right spec.

The car I've found is just under £70k, it's a 07 plate near enough perfect spec for what I'm looking for and has low mileage.

The Gen 2 Turbo I've been offered has 2500 miles literally the perfect spec if i was to spec it myself and could perhaps be had at a bit of a deal.

So the general consensus is that the Gen 2 will loose a lot more then? I probably will be keeping it say a year or 2. What is everyone's opinions on what both cars will be worth about that time?

Thanks again.

[andycskis]

If you are concerned about depreciation then get the gen 1, you will loose more over two years with a gen 2,fact, and as the next generation turbo will probably be out in 2012/13 value will drop considerably.

[IMI A]

You on;y live once hence its has to be the gen 2!!!

[M-J-B]

Phooey said:

My 2p's worth -

I think the way to go is a 56 plate gen1 for £55k (Sutton OPC) with 2 years warranty. Yes, the gen2 (especially with PDK) is better - some say *much* better, but you are looking at £90k+. 2 - 3 years motoring will cost you £40k+ in depreciation, you are never going to lose half that in 2 years on a gen1.

Paying £70k for a gen1 . It's not going to get you anything £55k won't.

Good luck, if i could afford a gen2 PDK

Oh, and how much do you think an OPC has offered for this -

http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/1932427.htm

Eta - the link i posted above is *exclusive* of VAT. Thought it sounded a tad good value

Edited by Phooey on Saturday 14th August 21:20

Beg to differ...

The advert states VAT will have to be paid, but the advertised price includes it. So I assume if you don't import, it's 17.5% cheaper?

[Womaniser]

The gen2 Turbo PDK gearbox is impressive, BUT, and it's a HUGE BUT, I wouldn't buy one for one reason only. I drove one a couple of weeks ago and was really peeved that the gearbox is not fully manual in manual mode. It will kick down in manual mode if you put your foot to the carpet and over-ride your gear choice. Sure, let it change up at the red-line or down at stalling speed, but nothing in-between. My old Audi Tip' box used to do it and it was annoying, in a Porsche it's unforgiveable.

[Glenn McMenamin]

Womaniser said:

The gen2 Turbo PDK gearbox is impressive, BUT, and it's a HUGE BUT, I wouldn't buy one for one reason only. I drove one a couple of weeks ago and was really peeved that the gearbox is not fully manual in manual mode. It will kick down in manual mode if you put your foot to the carpet and over-ride your gear choice. Sure, let it change up at the red-line or down at stalling speed, but nothing in-between. My old Audi Tip' box used to do it and it was annoying, in a Porsche it's unforgiveable.

Sorry, but that is a stupid comment !!!


That kick down is only activated as an emergency pressure point, I.e. If you need instant acceleration
But are caught in too high a gear. You will find the same feature in nearly any other modern day car with paddles iirc.
This is a very handy feature too, for when you are cruising along in
Manual, and a quick overtake opportunity presents itself.
Up to that point, the gearbox will do exactly as you want it.


I've just put the gearbox well through it's paces through the French Alps, and have found it totally
Accomplished in every way.

[Womaniser]

Glenn McMenamin said:

Womaniser said:

The gen2 Turbo PDK gearbox is impressive, BUT, and it's a HUGE BUT, I wouldn't buy one for one reason only. I drove one a couple of weeks ago and was really peeved that the gearbox is not fully manual in manual mode. It will kick down in manual mode if you put your foot to the carpet and over-ride your gear choice. Sure, let it change up at the red-line or down at stalling speed, but nothing in-between. My old Audi Tip' box used to do it and it was annoying, in a Porsche it's unforgiveable.

Sorry, but that is a stupid comment !!!

We're all entitled to an opinion.

It's annoying when you're in manual mode and the gearbox makes decisions for you. If it's in manual, it should mean manual. If it's in auto, it should mean auto.

[Womaniser]

Glenn McMenamin said:

...You will find the same feature in nearly any other modern day car with paddles iirc.....

Ferrari F1? - No
Ferrari DCT - No
Porsche Tip' - No
Aston DB9 - No
Lambo' E-Gear - No

Edited by Womaniser on Sunday 15th August 13:45

[Glenn McMenamin]

Womaniser said:

Glenn McMenamin said:

...You will find the same feature in nearly any other modern day car with paddles iirc.....

Ferrari F1? - No
Ferrari DCT - No
Porsche Tip' - No
Aston DB9 - No
Lambo' E-Gear - No

Edited by Womaniser on Sunday 15th August 13:45

BMW X6 yes
Audi/VW DSG yes
Porsche Tip never had paddles btw


The gearbox will not budge until you push past that pressure point, and by doing
So you are activating an over riding safety device. Don't activate it, and nothing will change, simples.


Opinions yes, just think it unjustified to rubbish a gearbox if you don!t understand it's features.


G.





G.

[lowndes]

Womaniser said:

The gen2 Turbo PDK gearbox is impressive, BUT, and it's a HUGE BUT, I wouldn't buy one for one reason only. I drove one a couple of weeks ago and was really peeved that the gearbox is not fully manual in manual mode. It will kick down in manual mode if you put your foot to the carpet and over-ride your gear choice. Sure, let it change up at the red-line or down at stalling speed, but nothing in-between. My old Audi Tip' box used to do it and it was annoying, in a Porsche it's unforgiveable.

Of course we are all entitled to our opinions, and in this country we also enjoy the right to express them freely, but in my opinion it would be unfortunate if this post were allowed to cast a serious shadow over the PDK box without the counterpoint being made. Indeed others have already commented so to that extent I add my voice to theirs.

I currently run a car with PDK having generally had manuals in the past. In my opinion PDK is superb. It is true that in certain conditions in manual mode it will override driver input. If you are trickling along in 7th and put your foot to the floor it will immediately drop into 3rd. If you keep your foot down you will soon be going very quickly indeed.

Equally if in manual you have less than 1200 rpm in 5th it won't change up to 6 or 7 until you have around 1400 to 1500. Or if in manual you pull up at a junction having been running in 7th it will most likely have already selected lower gears without bidding.

In my opinion none of these practical overrides in any way diminish the excellence of the system or the pleasure of driving the car. Although manual was not an option in my case, I wouldn't choose it now anyway.

Edited by lowndes on Monday 16th August 08:22

[Phooey]

lambo_xx said:

The car I've found is just under £70k, it's a 07 plate near enough perfect spec for what I'm looking for and has low mileage.

Is it the Arctic silver car at Nottingham OPC by any chance? Drove past it today - looks quite nice in Arctic, but has no S/Chrono unfortunately. £70k for an 07 is top money - what spec is it? (if it isn't the Nottingham car).

[lowndes]

F430F1 said:

in my trials today it just sat on the redline for as long as I held it there.

Edited by F430F1 on Sunday 15th August 23:40

Interesting. Having never had a problem in practice with PDK but having read the earlier post critical of it I too went out and ran a few tests. It was a nice afternoon so any excuse! I found that in general in manual mode it stays entirely in the driver selected gear and only at the extreme ends of the envelope does it finally intervene. Now I have a better understanding of how PDK works I am even more impressed than I was before and find the criticism even harder to understand.

[ted 191]

I`v always had manuals in my lambo`s and ferrari`s, but now have a PDK turbo and would`t go back, it`s also excellent on track !